As anybody with functioning eyes can see, the world today sucks: No matter where you stand on the issue of whether or not crime rates are going down or up, the repugnant culture, political and social repression, and all the other petty little frustrations forced upon us by rainbow haired harridans might make you want to start throwing punches and kicks—obviously at a punching bag or a willing sparring partner rather than the SJW woman, as we here at Return of Kings would never advocate violence against our political enemies.
If you’re interested in learning a martial art, now is as good a time as any to start. But the hard decision is: which one to study?
Style Versus Style?
If you’ve researched the subject at all, you’ve probably come to websites like Bullshido, Bloody Elbow, or perhaps even Return of Kings. If this is the case, you’ve probably seen people verbally fellating Muay Thai or Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, or shitting on Taekwondo, Wing Chun, or Karate.
The typical criticism of the latter is that they are overly ornate and simply “don’t work,” with the implication that the former are instantly effective, turning any practitioner into a killer. Allow me to tell you the most important rule of picking any style of martial art, including Western ones such as boxing or wrestling: the SCHOOL OR GYM is the most important thing, and the quality of instruction therein. Styles of martial arts are not cars that are 100% better or worse performing than others.
What Is Proper Schooling?
Now that I’ve told you that the instruction is much more important than the name of the style, you might now ask “What makes proper schooling?” From my experience, a good martial arts school needs to focus on three things: 1) Physical conditioning-training strength, endurance (both muscular and cardiovascular), and flexibility 2) Proper form and technique—teaching the proper way to punch, kick, throw, breakfall, and anything else that would need to be done, and 3) Competitive, full contact sparring to put the students in a realistic fighting setting, which teaches them the important lessons of operating under adrenaline and withstanding pain as well as using proper technique while in a panic situation.
Simply put, if you’re not sparring, you’re not training. And yes, that goes for the young children as well: I fully endorse young children punching each other in the head (with supervision, of course).
This is why martial arts like SAMBO or Muay Thai have higher reputations than, say, Balinese White Magic, or why Kyokushin Karate and Sanshou Kung Fu (the latter being the style I have trained in, but admittedly have not mastered) are much more successful in full contact MMA competition than other styles in those same families—because their regular curriculum typically centers around physical conditioning, proper technique, and full contact sparring, rather than a focus on forms, kata, taolu, ceremony, and techniques performed on non-resisting opponents.
Unfortunately, many traditional martial arts, especially as performed in the West, focus on those three things. This is why, in an age of mixed martial arts and full contact competition, these styles have, at best, a dubious reputation that is mostly deserved. With that being said, I don’t think that these styles should be thrown into the ashbin of history-trained properly, they can be effective for full contact fighting. To cite one example, Sanshou was invented in the 1920s specifically to be a realistic, combat-effective kung fu style. Conversely, a Muay Thai or BJJ teacher that teaches ineffectively is not going to help you at all, despite the fearsome reputation that these two styles have justifiably cultivated over the years.
How To Judge A School
In addition to their guts, note that this “kung fu” student is wearing a karate gi.
If you want to determine whether or not the nearby school teaches effectively, the best way to do so is to observe: any school worth its salt (and many that aren’t) will allow people to visit and observe the training. Look at how the teacher trains them: if he’s teaching striking, is he teaching them to aim and properly put their whole body weight behind every punch and kick, or is he just allowing them to flail their limbs towards the general vicinity of the target? For that matter, are they punching actual targets such as heavy bags, makiwaras, mu ren zhuangs, etc, or are they just punching the air?
If the martial art is a grappling martial art, is the training done against a resisting, violent opponent, or is it done against a submitting, non-resisting partner? Are they sparring, or are they just line dancing in pairs? Are forms occasionally done, or are they a primary concern of the school?
Do the students look like they’re in good, athletic physical condition, or do they look like pot-bellied LARPers? Bear in mind that this applies to the teachers as well—if the teacher’s out of shape, the students will most likely not be getting a good conditioning regimen.
Judging based on the criteria above will always steer you in the right direction. Once you have established which schools are “serviceable” and which aren’t, you can then decide which school is the best within your price range-look at the pupils they have trained, the background of the instructors, etc. At this point, you must decide on your own.
Fraud And Chicanery
Unfortunately, there is much fraud and general nonsense in the world of martial arts. Most of it can be determined through a light application of common sense…but sadly, common sense is decidedly uncommon. I have already shown you the idiocy that is Balinese White Magic in this post, but I could take you down a veritable rabbit hole of ki blasts, psychic powers, death touches, and poison fists. And sometimes they advise you to smear feces on yourself.
Needless to say, I think well enough of my readers that I feel you won’t fall for this sort of confidence scheme. But the more common scams are much more prosaic—things like charging huge fees for belt testing, requiring students to buy uniforms or anything else from the school, promising a black belt or the equivalent rank in under two years, or making you sign a lease or a contract. These are just a few surefire signs of a McDojo.
General unprofessionalism and ignorance are common signs as well; mixing and matching of Asian cultures, the instructor sleeping with one of his students, and other behaviors that should raise anybody’s bullshit alarm.
Knowing all this now, you should be capable of assessing a martial arts school for your purposes. Speaking as a writer and reader of this website, combat sports are, in addition to a method of self-defense and fitness, a great way to form a male-only space. This is, of course, something that ROK has also sought to achieve recently.
And most importantly, for whatever style you end up choosing: train hard, and don’t waste your instructor’s time or your own.
Read More: Why Karate Is The Most Beta Martial Art
Here’s an example of martial arts in use: http://beforeitsnews.com/alternative/2016/02/man-defends-his-wife-from-muslim-migrants-you-have-to-see-this-3304034.html
I agree with the statements that sparring is vitally important, and also while learning the forms, thinking outside the box in a fight to win, not to be in “pure form”.
It might be worth considering a “soft” style, just to increase the odds of staying out of jail. Also consider if turning yourself into a deadly weapon is worth risking getting on watch lists or whatnot.
Also, hop over to http://www.nononsenseselfdefense.com and read what he has to say on the topic. The psychology behind violence is arguably the most important part of a fight.
The art of fighting without fighting.
Said pacifist Bruce Lee
Profoundly True.
Do you have sufficient disciprine, or do you rack disciprine?
If you have disciprine, you may proceed to break lots of bones to avenge your beloved Thai Elephant.
I find Judo to be effective. Especially when combined with executive command of the Russian military. Wonder what style Trump would favour?
Systema haha
At last a sensible article on Martial Arts, and not a ‘let’s dismiss art X’ for imagined reasons.
The list for ‘judging’ schools is sound, to which most martial artists would add “there are no superior or inferior martial arts, only superior or inferior martial artists”.
And yes the proof is genuine full-contact sparring with an *opponent* not partner. Perhaps RoK would be less dismissive of Karate if by ‘Karate’ they meant Kyokushin and the Kyokushin derived schools.
Thanks again Larsen for a great article.
I was messing around with a karate instructor for fun. Firstly you’d never land a punch because he can block anything. Secondly, he can kick over his head so fast you wouldn’t see it coming and that’s game over. But what blew my mind was he was 45 y/o who looked like mid 20s. In america martial art studios have become day centers for the kids after school, and women who think they are learning self defense with a few dance moves. In asia its more like military training without guns.
Perhaps another couple of good indicators for serious schools right there… older men still in great shape, and a distinct shortage of kids messing around…
Make the new guy put on head gear and use him for practice. lol
SHAMEFU DISPRAY!
The key question is: for what do you want martial arts? Self defense? Competition? To be flashy and grab attention?
If you want martial arts for self defense, western Boxing for punching and Kyokushin for kicking are the best options. Forget ground game, in a real fight you are dead if you go to the ground, no matter if you are the blackest belt in BJJ. The most valuable aspect of BJJ and Judo for self defense are the throws.
If you want martial arts for competition in a controlled space, a healthy mix of western Boxing and BJJ/Judo are the best options.
If you want martial arts to be flashy and grab attention, you are a moron that deserves to be punched in the face till bleeding…..
Civil war is coming. Seems like a good enough reason to me.
I did not want to go into politics, but yes, war is coming.
We have to keep in mind 3 levels of training: physical, mental and spiritual.
By physical I mean all: martial arts, physical training, gun training.
By mental I mean to prepare yourself for real and nasty situations. Here (and everywhere in the internet) are a lot of keyboard commandos who think they are badasses because they are good in Homefront or Black Ops or another silly game……are you prepared to sleep in filth, wet from head to toes and hungry? are you capable of pulling a real trigger against a real enemy?
By spiritual I mean a body of beliefs that bring you the comprehension of why are you fighting for.
A war is coming? What makes you say that?
Not doubting you btw!
Only martial arts that practice with knives and other weapons will be effective in that respect . Most arts teach the sport side .
That’s what we call a mcdojo. And not everyone will be armed.
No , most good mma gyms teach sport vs street
Mma is vs one opponent. If that’s all you train for it won’t work in the real world. (not that you should fight multiple people, but sometimes there is no choice)
Kali , silate , and arnese gyms are very hard to come by and krav maga gyms in the US aren’t worth anything . Mma gyms are the easiest to come by . They also spar , most self defense oriented places don’t
This.
And keep asking that key question over the years and watch your answer change…
You’re not a moron if you want it to be flashy , it’s called a martial ART for a reason. It basically boils down to this . All martial arts work /worked for the time period and purpose they were designed for , arts often change over time to compensate for the period and culture their in . Japanese jiu-jitsu is different from judo and bjj because it was primarily used for close quarters combat in samurai armor . Bjj also got rid of ankle locks and other subs that are taught in judo and Japanese jiu-jitsu because the average person didn’t have the control to apply them . Muay Thai used to look alot like lethwei till they outlawed head butts
Yes you are. Even in older times there were styles meant to be effective and styles meant to look pretty. If flashines happens to result from an effective style, fine, but that is not the point.
Oh really ? I bet I could be flashy as hell and still give you the hands haha
Maybe we can give it a go one day, and I won’t care about being flashy.
OHHHHHHHHH (O_O) SHEEEEEEEIT SONNN!!!!!
None of the arts you mention are flashy.
Flying armbars, flying triangles, spinning back elbows , spinning back heel kicks , rolling knee bars , need I go on ?
We do that stuff for kicks (no pun intended). You rarely see that stuff in the ring or in the street.
Cyrus Washington bases his who game around it…arts are intended to be a reflection of the user . If flashy stuff is effect you use it , if more basic stuff is your game you use that .I’ve fought guys of all different styles , each had their weaknesses and strength .
Look I won’t say don’t practice the flashy stuff but it slows you down. Guys start doing spinning kicks and they get kicked in the butt! Literally. I wouldn’t use it in a fight, where one mistake might mean my life.
Our approach for self-defense is always to use the simplest most effective technique.
Depends if you can catch them or not .
I can.
Badi hari said the same
Good for him.
Not really , he got his jaw broke .
But he’s a dickhead.
Name one good fighter who isn’t in some respect , fedor is about it
LOL! You’ve got me there.
How exactly are you dead if go to the ground? You just roll over and let the dude wail on you? Give me a break, this statement is bs.
Yeah, I’ve seen plenty of World Star shit where crowds stand around and watch two guys fight long after it has gone to the ground. The guys with obviously learned ground skills obviously prevail in these situations. There are a LOT of assholes out there studying MMA/Jujitsu now, so, if it goes to the ground, and you don’t have ground skills, yeah, then you’re dead.
All the ground skills in the world won’t save you with four or five guys stomping on you.
Never go to the ground.
Never take the fight to the ground, but be prepared in case you get taken down.
I hear that, although any accomplished martial artist is going to be superior on the ground than any average man. But as when standing, the strategy should be to escape and evade first and foremost.
You don’t really want to be trying to choke someone out on the ground when you don’t know who else is around.
What Woof said.
…or to find out that he’s got a shiv and really doesn’t like you. Ground game is great in the ring, but not worth the risk on the pavement.
The preparation for multiple attackers involves staying on your feet. If you go down you better get back up quickly. I have trained specifically for that.
So have I, but you have to train for all possible outcomes. Taking a man down, for instance, in such a way that you are able to use his body as a cushion, and pivot off of him to scan for secondary threats.
I have used a man as a cushion but I did this while standing. What you are saying is fine in principal but I don’t think you want 70-80 kilos of struggling man on top of you in a street fight, no matter how good you are.
Correct. I do not.
Agreed, If I couldn’t escape I would try and grab one of the attackers both of us will get stomped then.
Actually, in this situation I recommend shooting or running, whichever works best.
Or if you have the opportunity, make an example out of the closest one. Hopefully the rest will leave you alone.
The last street fight I was in I fell to the ground and got stomped on and baseball batted. This is where I took most of my damage and it took only seconds for them to inflict it. Fortunately, I was able to fight my way back to my feet and they ran away.
I was lucky. I’ve seen people beaten into unconsciousness by multiple attackers when they went to the ground.
This is how exactly you are dead if you go to the ground.
Dude, seriously? In just brawling an untrained guy has four weapons to use and a way to maneuver. On the ground even trained fighters have almost none. There are ways to fight from the ground, but you wanna get back on your feet asap.
LOL you must not really understand Jiu-jitsu.
Another keyboard fighter. Is there a convention of that kind in this comments section?
lollz. What’s really entertaining about your dumb ass comment is that I literally just came back from MMA class and am leaving for Thailand in a month to train muay Thai. gtfo with you trying to be witty
You are so badass, can I be your friend please?
You can stop leaving childish comments, that would work.
So much LOL on this. kniebolo is pretty much Peter Griffin in this scene.
dying to see what you would do with the dude who’s got cauliflower ear
Agreed. I also believe catch wrestling can be useful insofar as knowing takedowns and being able to apply holds whilst standing and forcing your enemy to the ground so you can break their arm or wrist as appropriate among other things.
As you correctly indicate-if you do go to the ground you’re dead but it is also useful that if you end up in such a comprising position that you can get out of it and/or inflict maximum damage.
Good points although I advise against pinning yourself against an attacker either on the ground or standing up. If there’s more than one this could get you into trouble.
Absolutely-you have to try to get a hook on and then snap quickly and decisively such lest you’re pinned down or backed into a corner.
Disagree this comment show you know little about Martial Arts. Grappling is very useful as many fights end up on the ground and for law enforcement and other occupations were restraining people is necessary. Styles like Aikido while not as useful allow older people to defend themselves.
This idea that most fights end up on the ground is a complete myth.
I got into many fights in high school. They were all striking affairs and the only time I ended up on the ground was when neither me nor the other guy wanted to do each other too much damage, so we wrestled.
It is true but the one on the ground is the one that lost.
Btw, High School fights are not real fights. Trust me on this.
Getting knocked out and knocking others out is as real as a fight gets.
I don’t need the advice of some Internet guy.
So boxing is a real fight then?
You sound defensive.
Trust me, fist fighting isn’t boxing.
But it has knock-outs, therefore, according to your logic it is a real fight.
I said fist fighting isn’t boxing.
What’s your point?
Me thinks Englishbob is talking about the difference between combat and physical “contests” (for the lack of a better term). High school fights still have “rules”, but I don’t recall any such thing in a prison yard or some random dark alley. People are still looking for judgement from the peer group in a high school contest. On the streets, that guy doesn’t care if he maims you or worse… he don’t plan to stick around to be judged either.
It’s all fun and games till somebody loses an eye, finger, etc…
It’s ok, I know. It’s just that English bob has that characteristic faggot Anglo attitude towards logic—namely like many Anglo faggots he doesn’t use it as a tool of arriving at conclusions but rather as a weapon of tacky one-upmanship. This is very English.
Can’t make it any simpler man.
Then what’s your point in talking to me?
Aikido is not a grappling art though.
If by grappling you mean ground fighting then yes I agree but if you mean grappling as in joint locks, throws, etc. Aikido has plenty of those from what I have seen ( you tube ) Aikido lacks many of striking techniques common in other martial arts however for older people Aikido has it’s uses. looking into it for myself as some type of training is better then the sofa.
Depends on how you define Grappling: If by ground fighting ( Horizontal ) then yes I agree however Aikido has plenty of grabs, joint locks, throws, etc. Aikido does lack striking techniques making is less effective then many martial arts but it seems to be a good system for older people to learn.
Yes it is. Grappling is controlling one’s opponent by means of holding onto them (and everything that comes after that). Most aikido sequences begin with a grip. The word “grapple” shares a root with “grab”.
No. Once you “grapple” with an opponent you end the technique. Aikido is about harmonizing with your opponent, to guide and redirect his force.
Any holds are far much more delicate than a BJJ technique. We do not “grab”, that’s what attackers do. We seek to evade and escape “grabs”. Grappling is the last thing we want because it pins you to an opponent and could mean your life.
Grappling implies two men grappling with each other as part of the fight. We don’t do that with Aikido. A finger here, two fingers there. Its very different. If you “grabbed” with Aikido, you would not be able to perform the technique.
To an observer it may appear that we are “grabbing” our opponents, but the trained eye can see otherwise.
We never grab in Aikido. You can’t perform the technique if you grab and you’ll get slapped by your Sensei if you do it enough times.
“…grabs, joint locks, throws, etc.” are not all the same thing. We don’t really do joint locks either. That implies seeking a submission “hold”. We don’t do holds. Aikido essentially has the same philosphy of the Samurai. In other words, every move is either a kill move or a set up for a kill move.
So I throw you, pulling your shoulder out of its socket, breaking your elbow and your wrist. Now that you are helpless, I will finish you will my ken.
This is very different to the sport of Judo, with seeks to throw you without serious harm or JJ which seeks to pin you and force a tap-out. There are no “tap-outs” in Aikido, only incapacitation or death.
In this context, “grappling” is death. You cannot grapple on the battlefield.
I don’t agree that Aikido is good for old people unless they have a long history of aggressive martial arts.
As I said to the other guy, it may appear to be “grappling” to an untrained observers but its much more subtle than that. And of course a “throw” is not a grab.
Less strength, high kicks and wrestling, etc more deflection and redirection type techniques allowing older people to practice martial arts. That was impression I had after watching a few of videos on Aikido. Maybe I was wrong?
More of a redirect or momentum shift I guess I always taught Aikido was descendant and less aggressive then Aiki-Jujitsu. ( Samurai Hand to hand fighting. ) Minus the strikes or kicks.
Then why ikyo, sankio and the rest of aikido’s extensive vocabulary of wrist and joint locks? A gentle or brief hold is still a hold (and many of the positions are neither). While distinct from other grappling arts like BJJ and wrestling, aikido is still much closer to them than it is to any of the striking arts.
Since you seem to be passionate and informed — does it actually work? And if so, why does nobody seem to be willing to put their skills to the test in the octagon? It would be a powerful message in support of the aiki philosophy.
Well I think the English language is sufficiently nuanced to distinguish between a grab, a grapple and a hold. But also, there are many Aikido techniques that can be performed without even a hold.
Yes aikido shares a foundation with JJ because like JJ it is derived from swordfighting. But of course there is no groundfighting with Aikido, primarily because in combat to go to the ground means death. Samurai would think you were mad to voluntarily go to the ground. This is why they kneel in a position that allows them to quickly draw their sword, rise and defend. In Aikido we practice going to the ground (i.e. being thrown) and immediately rising. Over and over again.
Aikido definitely works, and I have defended myself with it. But it is incomplete. A complete art incorporates modern weapons and effective striking techniques. Many of the flashy techniques come from sport and dance, not combat.
Aikido would never work in MMA because it focuses on kill-moves and incapacitation. You can’t have that in sport. Likewise, systema wouldn’t work either, so you have sambo instead. Judo is the sport version of Jiu-Jutsu. And so on. Aikido shares more in common with Jiu-Jutsu than BJJ or wrestling.
In my school we would refer to Aikido and Aiki-jitsu interchangeably. Aikido is foremost a defensive art but you can guarantee serious harm should you attack an experienced practitioner.
Aikido has a soft reputation due to some of the Western teachers. I think the version of the art you learn is reflective of the person you learned it from. The man I learnt it from was a very hard man indeed.
Its a bit a like Karate in the West. The original teachers were hard men. Nowadays, it’s more art than martial.
Perhaps not. The founder of Aikido developed it and taught it as an old man. But this was based on decades of hard fighting and training. So I think that something like Aikido is where you will end up after your body is too battered to do anything else. But to learn Aikido at 60 years old, having never learned a martial art would be of little use in my opinion. You’d be better off doing Tai Chi in the park.
So for my own example. My body is battered from decades of Muay Thai. And so now I am finding myself moving towards a new martial art that is less punishing to the body. But not Aikido. It is good but I practiced it for many years and I think it ultimately falls short.
JJ also focuses on kill moves (chokes) and incapacitation (joint breaks). And it formed the basis for the UFC. All of police-training aikido concludes with peaceul control of the opponent. What are the kill-moves you are referring to?
From what I see, it seems to have a brilliant theory concerning momentum and body control. Unfortunately all videos involve the agressor moving at half-speed or co-operating.
I would very much like to see it be tested in real conditions. Do you know if this is possible? Moreover, do you know why, despite millions of Western practitioners, there are no aikido competitors in MMA? Is it a philosophical thing?
OK by JJ I was including BJJ. Japanese JJ is actually very similar to Aikido, although in Aikido we would break the neck rather than choke a guy. BJJ looks to me to be very similar to wrestling. There is none of that in Aikido but it obviously lends itself very well to sport.
I can’t speak to the videos you have seen but we move at full speed and no cooperation. Or rather, because you know the technique you will go with it rather than resist otherwise you will have a broken wrist.
Is there really no one in MMA who has practiced Aikido? In any case, my understanding is that Aikido is not a sport by any means. I think you could use some of the techniques in MMA (some of the throws) but because Aikido is entirely defensive, if you had two Aikido competitors facing each other, nothing would happen because each would wait for the other to attack.
In this case, yes, it could be a philosophical thing.
How is JJ similar to aikido? The “cooperation” I speak of is the fact that, as I understand it, you run exercises where the defender knows in advance which attack will be applied. Do you ever have true sparring/randoori? There is a guy named Rik Ellis (from England, like yourself) but he doesn’t seem to use any aikido in the ring. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk70hkVb_10]. I’m not talking about 2 aikido guys — I’m talking about an aikido guy putting his money where his mouth is and facing down boxers, wrestlers, etc.
Well sound it out Jiu-Jutsu, Aiki-Jutsu, Aikido. The throws are very similar because they are both ultimately derived from sword techniques. Aikido is based on Jiu-Jutsu. Note that the Jiu-Jutsu and Aikido you see today are not the original systems. Original Jiu-Jutsu was a lethal art and competitions sometimes went to the death.
A well trained Aikido guy would murder a boxer or a wrestler, probably with his sword. But you won’t find many that good in the West because the modern variant is watered down for Western sensibilities. I studied Aikido under the man, who studied under the man, who studied under the man who created it. This was some hard stuff.
The best elements I learned were about situational awareness, threat assessment and keeping multiple attackers in front of you. We trained against multiple attackers throwing random attacks.
I hope that answers all your questions.
I suppose it does, thank you. Although my questions would be well and truly answered if a practitioner were willing to contribute aikido’s strengths to the MMA revolution.
I suppose you were aware that Steven Segal allegedly trained Anderson Silva (legendary middleweight UFC champ) and Lyoto Machida (used to be a fearsome light heavyweight in the same organization). But they claimed they were working on kicks. From the looks of it Segal may have a bloated (among other things) ego, but he’s also the only guy repping aikido to the masses right now.
This is a cool moment, where many disciplines are being tested against one another. Would be a real shame if the gentlest and most subtle of all never got to participate.
I am actually a little bit dubious about Segal’s teaching credentials with respect to Aikido. His technique is appalling in the movies.
I too would be interested to see Aikido techniques used in MMA. If you ever have them performed on you (as I have had them performed on me) you will definitely respect how awesome they can be. But I do think Aikido needs to be combined with an offensive art.
Grappling is useful in a safe space. And yes, they teach grappling to law enforcer officers, but an incident with law enforcement is not a real street fight.
Have you ever been in a real street fight? A real fight is not one on one, is not fair and it has no rules, does this sound like a no gi BJJ contest?
Meant grappling in a generic sense anything other then strikes and blocks ( punching, kicking, elbows, etc.) both vertical and horizontal.
Quite right about Jiu-Jitsu. Nobody in their right mind goes to the ground voluntarily in a street fight. Most kids instinctively know that being on the ground is not a good idea.
I have had guys tell me they prefer “MMA” (MMA, what is that exactly?) to other martial arts because its more realistic. I’ve had to tell them that nothing you do in sport is “realistic”.
I’m curious that you prefer boxing for punching. To unify punching and kicking you need to practice a punching and kicking art. Otherwise you will find yourself doing one or the other. Don’t underestimate elbows and knees, particularly as it is possible to injure your hands and feet when punching and kicking.
I am not an expert in martial arts. I am training martial arts since years ago, and I have trained TKD, American Kenpo, western Boxing, Kyokushin, BJJ and JKD.
In my personal experience, i found western boxing to be the best for punching. It gives you the necessary speed and strenght, and the physical condition to go to the distance, if you are in the ring or if you are in a street punching for your life. The punching of JKD is similar to the western boxing, with the difference being the torsion of the wrist in the straigh punches, which is useful because allows you to throw a punch faster and with no telegraphy (the famous non telegraphic punch).
Kyokushin is good in physical condition and its kicks are OK, but the nopunchesintheface rule is a minus. If you get used that your opponent is not going to punch you in the face, you are going to do the same thing in a real fight. The kicking of TKD is good for competition, but real life kicking is miles away.
Elbows and knees are OK if you know how to do it.
BJJ (no gi) and Judo (no gi) are good in safe spaces like the octagon, but of no use in a real street fight.
This follows for kicks and punches yes?
What if I want to learn a martial art to help improve my self-discipline and confidence?
Start with what Bruce Lee had to say. Move on from there by studying the evolution of MMA. Then go get your face bashed in a few times so you’re prepared for what it feels like. Then begin training.
Due to the lack of time, I haven’t done boxing in five years. Yet I know better than to walk into a Rex Kung Fu dojo. In this one, the U.S print pants are a dead giveaway. Because nothing says Murica like letting your nappy stanky ass and nutsack rub against the good ole Red White and Blue.
Or this one from Bruno, the classic dildo defense scene. Say what you will about Sacha Baron Cohen, but through his characters, he does have a knack for revealing bullshit.
BJJ/Muay Thai/Boxing/Judo
At the end it comes down to each person’s reason for getting in to it.
If you’re looking for a workout and learning to fight/defend yourself at the same time then the proven methods of BJJ/MuayThai or a combo of those two does well. People “verbally fellate” those two because of its practical implications.
If you have a fetish for Asian culture or something around those lines then it makes sense to explore all these styles and its variants to determine their pros and cons.
I personally boxed, because I absolutely love it and didn’t enjoy grappling or kicking. The self defense thing was a added bonus. Learning how to punch alone can be adequate although having more tools doesn’t hurt either.
I always laughed at “Tai Chi” but after seeing this video think maybe they are on to something. Check out this short video (I am not plugging “Longevity Now”, looks like an EST or MLM seminar) :
A Simple Exercise that can Heal Your Heart
This one is also very good, cardiologist talks about damage from excessive exercising :
I post it because a lot of guys past 40 may be overdoing it with the exercise vs. actual health benefits. Turns out my low-key 20 minute jog is about optimal for my age.
Cool explanation of tai chi , very therapeutic and many don’t know its deadly side for self offense or defense
I’m glad to see a fair amount of ROK readers have practiced some martial art (despite the fact that there’s a little bit of “my style is better” dick waving going on in the comments). I mean, martial arts helps us commit all those rapes, amirite? 😉
Hahaha good one
Great tutorial. When I look for a martial art for either myself or my son’s I’ll be sure to come back to this article again
Hmm, martial artists give me a hot spicy boner.
This is so much better than the last martial arts post. Another easy trick: If you see 10 year-olds with black belts *karate *cough *cough it’s not the right place to be in. If you’re still pissing the bed, can’t master your urine flow, you can’t master a martial art.
” If this is the case, you’ve probably seen people verbally fellating Muay Thai or Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, or shitting on Taekwondo, Wing Chun, or Karate.
The typical criticism of the latter is that they are overly ornate and simply “don’t work,””
Wing Chun “ornate”? Only in the Ip Man movies. lol
Mm indeed. However Wing Chun is very difficult to find good schools in, of actual descendance from the HK schools. I used to go to the Ving Tsun Kung Fu Europe school in Hilversum NL, afaik the only school in the west that was officially sanctioned by Wong Shun Leung. BTW Ving Tsun is how he prefers it written in western alphabet.
It has no ornate moves, fancy kicks, or any of that shit. No grades, uniforms or belts either, just hours and hours of punching rice bags, sticky hands and sparring, mixed with some form practice.
Oh that and the school has “easy days” for casuals/women and the HC nights where at least one nose was bloody by the end, usually several.
Guys! For starters: It is called *Wing TSUN* if you are after the system from Ip man in Hong Kong. The current top GM of this line is called “Leung Ting”.
If the name is wing chun, wing tschung, ving chun or whatever it means the instructor has started his own thing. More often than not of questionable quality.
As someone who has 2 years of Karate under my belt, I agree with this 100%. My instructor was a retired corrections officer who had us do full contact sparring each time we came in for class, and he didn’t promote anyone unless they improved in their sparring skills.
Contrast that with the McDojo down the street, which doesn’t spar at all, and uses brittle weapons made of pine.
I learned from him how to spot a McDojo, as well as why the World Taekwondo Federation is a complete scam.
MMA, or Krav Maga if you only care about life-or-death.
Testify, bro.
Save yourself 15-20 years of training and practice and discipline. Just take a teaspoon of Kratom and you’ll be able to roundhouse-kick goons into orbit.
Supplement that with Brawndo and your erections will be able to perforate their lower abdomen should they engage you in a fight.
[Master Har Don]
“Ha ha ha ha ha… my iron snake bite will penetrate any defense” (said in de-synchronized voice over).
(draws small clockwise circle in dirt with right foot into standard stance)
camera closes in on beads of sweat on opponents face as he looks down….
Best point.. stay from schools that “guarantee” a grade (belt) increase after x-weeks. Anyhow I went to one school; on the first day, we had one instructor taking us thru some moves, while 2 other instructors sparred.. they were all over the training area, sometimes crashing into with students trying to learn. I didn’t go back.
I then went to a Kyokushin Karate school.. the difference was immediately apparent. For one thing they had a good mix of ages and male/female (rather than only school kids). We also had a really good sensei. I always remember him telling us, if he ever heard that we got into a fight or a brawl that wasn’t self-defense, we’d be expelled immediately. I stayed there a couple of years, quit, then came back after another couple of years. Many of the students were still at the school, having moved far up the grades, and a couple were teaching.. and they were bloody GOOD. I wish I’d stayed at that school. Another time, I remember some noob asking “when do we get taught bo and sai and stuff”.. sensei said this was an unarmed school, and don’t even think about weapons until you hit black belt.
BTW that’s not a plug for Karate, it’s simply my experience. Like the article said, go along and check out the school first, and do some basic research. Martial Arts are much-of-a-muchness, as long as you have the discipline to master it effectively, the ass-kicking ability probably doesn’t vary a great deal. Oh yeah, and learn how to take a punch.
When I was a kid I studied Karate. For the first year we did sparring and it was great fun. Then some kid hurt himself and so it was banned. Karate became crap after that and I stopped doing it.
I trained for a while in a kung fu style called Choy Li Fut and it was effective adding conditioning, training and sparring each week. One time a massive guy attacked me in a bar and I used dim mak pressure point in the guys arm to let me go since he had me in a headlock 2 feet off the ground. Also learn eye strikes, elbow breaks and groin strikes. They are illegal in UFC but in real life effective.
I studied studied Choy LI Fut as well (if I’m not mistaken), but my main concentration was the sanshou training at my academy.
Your mistake (in the wild a DEADLY mistake) was getting in this situation “headlock 2 feet off the ground” in the first place. Much better to act faster. Congratulations nevertheless for using your training to get out of this shitty-situation.
I’ve been following Bill McGrath, a licensed teacher of the Pekiti-Tirsia style of escrima. His approach is heavy on practice, but also imminently practical for real-life situations.
His YouTube channel is here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4sqXk6K2gE0V74ejjma2Lg
Unfortunately, in my 60’s with arthritis and spinal problems, my martial art studies are restricted to tai chi, a slow and gentle martial art that when the moves are sped up work for self defense. I also practice with a traditional walking cane.
I’m no expert and not even close, but I suspect I’m slightly better prepared at defending myself than most peers my age.
Style is largely unimportant. Human physiology is the same the world over, and humans have figured out the best way to use it over the course of several thousand years. Better to find the best instructor than the best “style”. A good instructor will take you farther and faster than the most fashionable or popular style.
Disagree, the average Asian male physiology is different then average European male.
We all have two arms, two.legs a the same exploitable weaknesses in the human body. Thus, Homer details a pressure point strike in the Odyssey also found in Japanese grappling, Indian wrestling and various forms of Chinese King Fu
Nope not only different Physiology but cultural differences as well make many Eastern Martial Arts less suitable for European Men without without many modifications
Provide an example of one of the many modifications, please. I’ve done both western and Eastern martial arts, more Eastern of course, pushing twenty years and have found German long sword schools from the middle ages to be eerily similar in attack and defense to the Japanese sword schools.
I too am curious to see how Asian and European male physiology differ so greatly. The last time I checked, eyes, nose, throat, jewels, knees, etc. were all in the same places. Perhaps triple V knows something the rest of the world doesn’t?
Really what type of swords are trying to compare? The 16th century Katana was very different then a 14th century German Bastard Sword also Shield use was more common in the West then Japan. What works for a 5’5 140 pound Japanese male may not work the same for a 5’10 190 pound European Male.
1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Kenpo.
2. http://www.fullcontactmartialarts.org/kajukenbo.html
Western Martial Arts:
http://www.mardb.com/russian-all-round-fighting/
Guard and parry positions, as well as target locations, and a similar method of dealing with armored foes.
Again, I am not saying everything is the same and there is no literal differences in styles. I am saying over the course of history, they are more similar than different because human anatomy is basically the same, and it is better to learn under the best instructor possible than to be fixated on a style. We see similar techniques and strategies pop up within cultures that have had zero contact with each other, and hundreds of years apart from each other, either using the human body in optimal ways, or exploitng weaknesses in human anatomy. Your femoral artery is the same place as a Polynesian dudes, is the same as a Russian dudes is the same a Chinese dudes
Look up john Perkins , “attack proof ” guided chaos ” on YouTube that’s all ye need to know . If you can’t find quality instruction in your area I would strongly recommend investing in his book and DVDs , He really explains fact from martial fantasy . The body is intelligent , it has it’s own wired instinct to defend it self . When humans experience fear or hear a loud noise from behind the body goes into a type of instinct reaction , hunched shoulders to protect our vital neck area , hands freeze open not in clench fist but with fingers out for raking and poking ,scratching . Gross motor movements is the way to go , train those instincts . On the battle field were there are bodies , cans , bottles , rocks, your katas i.e. Fine motor movements will not help you . basic stomping gross motor movement, Might . it’s why I think the reason for making soldiers march . All in all when it comes to your ” self offense ” training, it is best to stick with the K.i.s.s principle keep it simple stupid . I’d rather practice dropping or stomping then waste my time on some above the waist vandam high kick , you will get your ass handed to you with that shit .
Another thing , I’m the proud owner of NO! BLACK BLET . That shit is ridiculous to
I remember how when we were kids anyone who had a higher belt was supposed to be “hot shit” but now in retrospect after understanding more about real fighting I see how they were just puffing their chests based on some decoration.
American TV sitcoms also used to have some episode in which some guy was supposed to be some super-tough/skilled guy who as that because of his “black belt.” LOL.
Muay Thai /boxing for punching ,knees and striking
BJJ/Jui Jitsu/Judo for grappling and throws
Krav maga /Combatives/MMA that takes all the best parts from the above for fighting and self defense…
Think about your own mindset. If it’s really about being able to defend yourself and hold your own when you are all out of options, you wont find a single martial art out there that will help you in that situation. Some people probably wont agree, but Marc Animal MacYoung is worth listening to for realistic self defence (including where you really stand in the eyes of the law). Martial arts can help you discipline your body and mind to a degree, but real self defence starts with training your mind to read the crowd and environmental cues so you’re not cornered in an alley with 2 or more attackers to defend yourself against. It’s about making yourself less of a target by not standing out or drawing attention to yourself. And on top of that, it’s accepting that if you ever do fall foul of bad luck, then you’re willing to do whatever you can to stack the odds in your favour, including fighting dirty enough to make sure the other guy isn’t going to get back up.
However, if your mindset is all about manspace and camaraderie through physical training and fair sparring, by all means look for a martial art. Just don’t limit yourself to ones with exotic sounding names. I started with Ju-Jitsu, moved onto Tae Kwon do (gave it up, since it was all about points) moved onto Silat. My go to martial art for most physical training though is boxing. Boxing was where I really learnt to guard and punch. Boxing, for me, has the most practical cardio fitness training routines, that don’t immediately mark you as a potential fighter if you’re doing your circuit in a park. To anyone watching, you don’t look too different to the rest of the personal training crowd.
“ Tae Kwon do (gave it up, since it was all about points) ” Thanks for the head’s up.
Boxing definitely is hard work, and you’ll lose weight along with getting a hard cardio workout.
Unfortunately having women in the class meant getting it watered down when being paired with them. That stinks.
Treat finding a boxing gym like you would finding a dojo. The ones that actually train competition fighters will usually be all male, or at least will only pair you with another man in your weight class. The commercial and crossfit gyms, you’ll get PT’s who’ve done boxing for cardio training, but the classes themselves will usually be stacked heavy with women. IDK, for some reason women are drawn to these kind of gyms. An actual boxing gym, females are a minority – if the coach even bothers to train women fighters.
Thanks for the post & advice.
What you’re saying makes a lot of sense, and I intuitively felt that was the case.
learn to box . learn to wrestle. you’ll have everything you need. bjj and judo will teach you some great basic stuff. the rest of it is unnecessary (not useless, just unnecessary). ‘everything’s a gi’. basic white belt and blue belt stuff can save your ass. of course if there’s a bunch of dudes around ready to stomp you the ground is bad. but you can get shanked or batted in the noggin from behind if your standing up. taking a dude down and then running away is probably the best if you have no choice but to fight.
inb4 teh dedly.
Enjoyed the article and the good advice. Much needed I would say!
“Simply put, if you’re not sparring, you’re not training”
That’s interesting, because somehow when I first went looking for a martial arts training facility, I naturally wanted to find one that did sparring. Probably because I understand that unless you’re really trained in not getting beaten down you won’t be able to block, attack, or avoid in real life when in that situation.
The first place I tried was a supposed Krav Maga place, which was a mixture of mid 20’s to middle age men and women, practicing moves against pads, etc, but no sparring. Needless to say, that’s a joke and I didn’t sign up.
I tried kickboxing later and stayed for a while. We did bag work, kicks, and sparring. Nothing gets your attention like getting hit in the head and having to actually avoid getting hit. The place wasn’t perfect, but we were taught some really helpful things and did lots of bag work.
There’s no substitute for REAL training. Just makes so much sense!
Looking forward to starting again soon after finishing my current weightlifting routine which doesn’t allow time for fight training.
I always appreciate advice regarding what to pursue because I see so many places like “Title Boxing Club” which are lame excercise-type “boxing” facilites without real training or McDojos in suburban Atlanta areas, with a bunch of people in pretty outfits moving around but not doing any serious fight training.
Also I would say if you go somewhere where there are women training, expect to see your training get watered-down and it takes the fun out of it often.
Watching a woman act like a prissy little girl who thinks she’s tough in a boxing/fight class is just ridiculous.
boxing is a respectable style. Most kick-boxing is not. Wrestling is also decent but more for your fitness and to impress the ladies. The last thing you want in a real fight is go to the ground. Even cowards will come forward and kick the man on the ground.
As a long time practitioner of several martial arts (including many described in the article), I have to agree on every point except for the “instructor having a gut” part; as an exception, not the rule, of course. My old college club team judo sensei was a 79 year old Japanese man who will still engage in light sparring and active resistant instruction with students who were well above his size, athletic prowess and most importantly- all well below his age. He carried a modest old man’s gut, but he was deadly disciplined and encourage us to free fight and spar with control as much as possible. There are other examples from anecdotal experience as well. But sure enough, these were exceptions I felt necessary to bring up. And yes, beware of the neckbeards fatty in a gi, regaling you of his glories with Big Mac stains on his “black belt”.
When I was a kid and again a bit in college I trained in Judo. I got pretty good at it too, placing in a number of tournaments. It was a good fit for me as a kid as I was REALLY small for my age. Judo worked well as you could use an opponents own weight and strength against him.
The latter came in handy when I got picked on by various school bullies. Either I was able to throw him (then escape as he lay stunned on the ground), or choke him into unconsciousness (this nearly got me suspended in 7th grade).
Another nice thing about Judo, you can build strength and endurance without getting hurt. In college I practiced with adults who were much older than I. There were 50+ and 60+ year old men that were masters, in great physical condition, and who could throw my 21 year old ass all over the mat.
Not many Judo studios exist though.. even around here in the NYC metro area. Karate and Taekwondo seem to be the popular choices.
You have to be really careful even with the so called MMA. There is a lot of bullshit created styles out there. A lot of martial art teachers have this guru complex. They want to be somebody Important, so they make up their own style to feel important. But often what they create is pure bullshit. It takes an extremely high level martial artist to create a new martial art. Who understands how to intertwine various concepts and principles, and not just a bunch of techniques mashed together. I’ve rarely seen it done correctly. You just have to be extremely careful with what style, and teacher you associate with.
Did any of you guys check out the Kimbo Slice vs Dada 5000 fight? That shit was an embarrassment to martial arts. It was the worst fight I’ve seen in my life! By the end of the fight all they could do was spoon each other on the ground grasping for breath. I didn’t know if I was watching a fight, or two fat lesbians fingering each other for the first time.
I like the article as well and sparring is very important. I would like to add that the mental preparation is equally important. A lot of instructors talk about neutralizing the attacker. What does that mean? Is he or she dead? Incapacitated? Are they preparing you to inflict violence with the utmost prejudice on another person? Most people are not mentally committed to actually doing harm to some one.
@Larsen Your article is going in the right direction. There is one major point I would like to add. In fact it is maybe THE most important.
1) Sports vs. self defense
Sports: Kara-te is a perfect example.
(When I was around 20 I did train this along with kick-boxing (another sport) for about 6 years).
In this SPORT you have katas, you have punches, you have kicks. Most punches are hard ones. The idea is to damage an armored (samurai) type of enemy. Not very common in our modern world.
The so called competition – including cage fights or MMA – have rules. Even if it is basic rules, like “dont break his neck. dont castrate him. dont rip out his eyes” etc.
Self-defense: WT Kung Fu
(This is what I do nowadays in my 40s at least 3 times a weak with having a wodden training dummy in my bed room. no joke.)
In this SELF-DEFENSE style you learn how to finish any fight as fast as possible. You dont have to do hard punches “with your full body weight”. You do not attack ones face. You tartet the throat. 3 fast punches we teach but i have yet to see one to stand after no1 + no2 did hit. You cant really do sparing like that, because it kills.
You also do not kick the head or do round kicks. You go for the groin and at the same time grab the neck so you can break it. Again – end of fight due to death of opponent. The list goes on.
Self defense is all about killing as fast as possible. In the modern political correct western world this *of course* is a big no go and you will find no mention in advertising. There it is all about “sports” “fitness” or “violence prevention”.
The truth is; in a real fight it is all about violence. He who attacks without thinking too much about what he does and just uses what he has trained on a wooden dummy 10 000 times simply kills his opponent in the blink of an eye.
Conclusion:
If you want endurance, good looks, flushy techs – go train a sport.
If you want to be a strong fighter – learn self defense.
One last note about defense. You have to be a master to be defensive. The student (even the advanced one) will want to be attacking as fast and as deadly as he possibly can.
Yeah, this is the main reason why I am seeking as an adult to undertake the training in some martial art. It’s already hard enough to as a grown man, make new friends. I haven’t never been one to make friends super easily with other guys and I have many more female friends that male. I quite honestly get fucking sick of all that feminine energy though, especially if we’re not smashing. I need balance, and I’m hoping that by doing this I can get some of this energy out in a male environment and form some cool bonds with some new bros.
Krav Maga, taught properly, is an awesome martial art. It combines boxing, kickboxing/Muay Thai, BJJ, judo and weapons training. Much of it is BS though so you have to filter out some of that stuff