Girls

How To Pass The Bliss Test In Long Term Relationships

458 Comments

There is an important phenomenon out there that I think many of my fellow men can relate to. For simplicity’s sake, I’m simply calling it…

The Bliss Test.

It occurs during a period that otherwise seems great when you’re in a relationship with a girl. So good, in fact, that you as the man do something “big.” This could be one of many things that signify a reasonably significant step forward in the relationship. The key point is that it’s also reasonably far off into the future.

Some examples of this are, in order from least to most significant:

  • Planning a trip together to a foreign country
  • Moving in together
  • Getting engaged
  • Actually going through with the engagement and get married

Because it’s going to hit home with the most amount of people, let’s stick with the first one—planning a trip together. Let’s say it’s your first ever trip as a couple. If you’re stuck in the 9-5 rat race, you obviously have to plan it in advance. If you live in the United States you can’t just hop on a plane and head to the Mediterranean on a whim.

Let’s say you plan it three months in advance, which is probably a bit on the short end. So you book the trip. You tell her. You’re both excited and looking forward to it.

Then The Bliss Test Starts

Despite you doing something nice, and everything seeming quite harmonious, her shit tests for you rise into the stratosphere.

All of a sudden, nagging becomes a daily occurrence instead of weekly. If she didn’t nag before, you can rest assured she’s now going to start. She becomes more moody and irritable. She’s testing you. Even if you’re still holding frame, and nothing has really changed, she has this unrelenting desire to test you now that she has a firm commitment of something reasonably far off in the future.

I have no idea why women do this. I simply understand that they do it. Every. Single. Time.

My best guess is that it’s simply to see how strong you are as a man. How much crap you will tolerate to remain in harmony given that you have made a commitment well into the future and dropped significant coin on said endeavor? The Med is not generally a cheap region, ya know.

From a biological standpoint, I understand why women test men. To see if you are strong enough to withstand their hurricane of emotions, moods, and the general turmoil of their life. You must be able to deflect it and stand strong. But, looking at pure biology—I don’t get it. The resources are already there, provisioned for her. Clearly if you booked the trip, you are a man who can provide to an extent. It should be a lot of fun, and a new adventure.

So why all the tests? She shouldn’t be trying to bait you into un-provisioning those resources for her. But that’s exactly what she’s doing. Effectively shooting herself in the foot. Even if you know how to handle all these tests and swat them away like the annoying insects they are, it’s still going to change things. In the back of your mind, you’re always going to have this rooted feeling that she’s a bit unappreciative. These tests do nothing for her but make you lose respect for her.

Again, I don’t have all the answers. Please, do leave a comment below if you have a deeper understanding of this than I do.

Looking Forward

While I’ve used a reasonably simple trip to Europe as an example of this issue men face, let’s look deeper. I’ve seen quite a few of my friends get married in recent years (most older than me). While it’s fairly well established that marriage is a raw deal for most men in Western countries, many men still take the plunge. That’s because the relationship up until marriage is relatively blissful.

It’s after the vows that things start to come unraveled. The tests increase in intensity and frequency. Of course, at that point a man is locked in.

What this comes down to is that you can never truly let up and “stop” gaming. This is reasonably well-known game knowledge. However, many people believe that it’s their specific girl. That’s she’s a bitch, and you should just dump her. But, I’d like to offer up a slightly different theory.

Even when you give a woman what she desires (trip, engagement, marriage), she is going to continue to test you because that is what she is as a biological specimen.

What I’m saying is that yes—All Woman Are Like That. Even in more remote parts of the world.

It has nothing to do with her personality, albeit if she’s a bitch it’ll be even worse. No, from significant amounts of my own experience as well as observation, I think it’s a reasonable conclusion. If you give them what they want they turn around and make life more difficult as a result of you doing something nice for them.

It doesn’t matter how good your game is or how you have the relationship set up. That does impact the result as she does test you, but no matter what she is going to test you after you make a major commitment.

What Comes Next

Nuke the tests into the stratosphere. There is only one thing to do. That is to truly not care. Do not let her emotions and swings effect you. Laugh the tests off the face of the planet. Just do you. Trust me, plenty of girls out there in the world would love to go to Italy.

If needed, you can absolutely revoke the major commitment. All the way up to divorce. Most men simply don’t have the balls to stop the marriage from happening in the first place. And once “I do” has been said, it’s all over because the courts are involved.

From experience, it seems The Bliss Test is something every girl does. So you just play the cards you’re given. Sometimes you just have to accept the world for how it is.

The best way to tackle modern dating is to take the power back—The Harem Handbook will teach you how. For more advice about dating, travel, and entrepreneurship, visit This Is Trouble.

Read More: 7 Criteria A Girl Should Pass To Enter A Relationship With You

458 thoughts on “How To Pass The Bliss Test In Long Term Relationships”

  1. Unless the girl is a 7 or above, the guy will not be happy.
    I have never seen a happy guy with an plain jain, fatso, or ugly girl.

      1. I used to work with a short, fat, little jewish guy. He was as annoying as he was ugly. Was married to a hideous wife and had two anteaters for kids. ONe day he was complaining to me and a fellow coworker how he wanted a “hot girl”. Aftter he was done my coworker voiced his astonishment to me that Darrin wasn’t happy with his “little life” — meaning that a short, fat, ugly guy like that should be happy with ANY female. I explained to him that it doesn’t work that way. Even Quasimoto wants (expects?) to bang the hottest cheerleader in school.

        3. Yes. Most men know where they stand in the SMP and we accept it. There are few men who will approach at all, there are even fewer men who will approach a woman above their own SMV.

        4. Wants, but probably doesn’t expect, or he wouldn’t have married the hideous wife.

    2. Sounds like a lot of men have unreasonable expectations about the quality of the woman they can keep.

      1. As snarky as this comes off, I actually think you are right. It is perfectly feasible to keep a 9 purring like a kitten, but not if you just think it is your god given right. You have a responsibility to make yourself fucking irresistible and it just isn’t easy work.

        1. True…if the SMV score is more than 2 points off in either direction, there will be problems.

        2. It really is true. You know, a lot of guys have this feeling like a woman is a bitch if she won’t purr for them. But the truth is an 8 doesn’t get tingles from a 5 and if you are a guy who has no interest in being the best possible version of yourself then you are going to be stuck with the dumpster leavings.

        3. Which is why I bang escorts.
          Yeah, I know you guys don’t like that kind of talk, but I am a realist.

        4. I think banging escorts is a fine decision. It isn’t the one I make for several reasons…but none of those reasons has to do with me thinking it is either morally wrong or a personal failing. It just doesn’t tickle me where I need to be tickled.

        5. As a religious man, I would not engage in it myself, but ethically, I think it is no different than the one night stand. So what if money was exchanged?

        6. Its fine. Keeps things compartmentalized if your energies are devoted elsewhere. Being “on” as consistently and constantly as is required is exhausting.
          Remember you’re paying her to leave, not to fuk you.

        7. I hear you.
          It’s not like I am George Costanza draped in velvet or anything…I do try to stay in shape/fit/trim at least. I like it when the hookers compliment me, even if it is just an act. Closest I get to an ego booster.

        8. You buy a Lamborghini and you have Lamborghini level maintenance and can only drive it under the right conditions. Buy yourself a nice reliable Subaru and you only have do some routine maintenance and can take it anywhere.

        9. Yep, and its the ‘work’ part that’s lost on a lot of guys here. We laugh at fat nasty attitude green hair blobs feeling entitled to the nicest, hottest guys but for some reason when the genders are switched and it’s the old fat dude with the bad attitude and beer gut who demands model like girlfriends some guys are like, “Yeah man! Yeah!!” Too funny hahaha.

        10. I couldn’t agree more. “oh look at that fat pierced green haired slut thinking she deserves whatever she wants just because she has a vagina….by the way, that 8 just ignored me…cunt….I am going to go order a pizza”

        11. Buy a Corvette and solve both problems at once.

        12. I prefer Mercedes. The maintenance costs more, but is needed less frequently. I am driving a twelve year old Mercedes E 350, and it still looks and runs like new.
          Oh, were we talking about women?

      2. Perhaps…
        But we still want the young, hot ones regardless.
        Nothing will ever change that.

        1. And nothing will no matter what shame society tries to throw on men but having realistic expectations around your own sexual value and how that correlates to the value of the women you can attract is key. It tends to be a positive correlation – when one goes up, so does the other.

        2. I get the impression you have a “positive” message here, but I have to admit, it is falling on deaf ears with me.
          I want hot, young girls regardless of what I or society considers my SMV to be (I consider it a 0). I make a good living and I use to to bang hot young girls. Expensive escorts yes, but they are hot and young and that is all that matters to me. Yes there is the whole “loneliness” thing to contend with, but the fact that I have been alone my whole life helps, and cheap booze helps as well. Bottom line, I would rather pay big $$$ to bang 9s and 10s that don’t care about me, then date 2s, 3s and 4s who “love” me.
          I am 51 and females over 30 are invisible to me.

    3. That is because the fatso allowed herself to become that way. It is just one symptom of a much deeper issue of not caring about themselves or wanting to please her husband.

    4. Totally agree. The “marry a plain/ugly girl and she’ll always be faithful” is bullshit. Maybe a long time ago, maybe, but even then I doubt it. Today, with social media, even 3’s think that they’re 10’s so the same attitude applies. As such, go for the highest shelf you can when looking for the LTR/marriage.

    5. I have to give my brother-in-law credit, I never thought of my sis as pretty and she was always overweight. He married her that way, she stayed that way and he was happy. Stuck by her through all the ugliness of a cancer fight. Remissions, returns, chemo, colostomy bags, weakness, hair-loss all that crap. He was devastated when she died. And he always seemed very happy, but she was supportive of everything he did- volunteer coaching for wrestling teams, how he wanted to raise his sons, hunting, where they lived…

  2. What is disturbing about these tests is that the women’s emotions (anxiety, doubt, malcontent) are genuine and deep. Not the superficial probing of a typical shit test.
    Maybe these “big” gestures and commitments signal to a woman that she has found a keeper– meaning she has to put a frivolous life behind her and get down to the biz of being a grownup and a serious partner. The stress of that could be a trigger.

    1. My friend just proposed to his live-in girlfriend of 3 years.
      Her response? She said she needed space to think about it and proceeded to treat him like shit for 3 weeks. He finally said that they should break up and she’s gone straight back to acting like a kitten.
      I think what happened is his 25 year old gf finally realized the reality of her life situation. Her financial debt, the competition in her career, her lazy lifestyle habits, her relatively ordinary self, all kind of came into focus when he proposed to commit to her for real.
      If she marries this dude, that’s a lock-in on an otherwise free-floating imagination of her future self. She’s not early 20s anymore and needs to really decide what she wants for her future. Does she risk and live abroad like she’s been planning and working towards, or does she get comfortable and accept this guy’s offer of taking care of her dumb ass for the rest of her life?
      I get along with my friend’s gf so don’t take me wrong, but she’s given me shit before for my frugality, and only now has realized that her financial debt isn’t paying itself off despite working 5 days a week. I told my buddy what I thought of his situation and to not just let himself get used even though they’ve had a solid relationship up until this point. A girl becoming so confused when offered a marriage proposal seems a little off putting in my opinion.
      In response to the author’s conundrum, I don’t think most girls even have a clue what they’re doing. Their shit-testing and other behaviours simply might not have translated properly into the modern world.

    2. Bliss tests are the last standard by which a man can judge his future with a woman. Can you put up with that for years? Possibly with kids in the middle? If you think so, go ahead and marry her.

  3. Great article Kyle. This was a really interesting topic. I have no idea why women do it. If forced to guess I would think that they believe that the locked in commitment to, say, a trip or a wedding or to sharing a bathroom or even just a ring makes them immune from being nexted and as such they drop all the efforts to win you ober…Ussain Bolt doesn’t keep running top speed after crossing the finish line…he gradually slows to a stop.
    If this is correct then what you are seeing is essentially the true colors of the woman. You are seeing the woman as she is rather than the façade she is creating for your sake (which I am starting to believe is customized by the woman to fit her image of the man….I really am beginning to think it is possible to control who a woman is by figuring out what kind of man would necessitate a woman like that and then being it…for instance, if you want a woman to be a sub who enjoys violence as part of sexuality, by acting like a sexually violent dominator the woman will take those cues and become the sub)…back to it, if she creates a façade for your sake it is probably exhausting for her and that commitment tells her it is time to let her guard down…you are cuffed and she can do as she will.
    The key, as you rightly point out, is knowing that you can walk at any point right up until “i do” I tried to explain this to a friend during his bachelor party. I honestly believe he married a woman who he already fucking hated based solely on financial commitments to a caterer and a crappy DJ. smh.

    1. It is the Best Man’s sworn Duty to “keep the car running”.
      I drove to my wedding with my Best Man at the wheel and every time we passed a road leading the other direction, I mean EVERY FUKKING TIME, he put the signal on, slowed down and leaned over, telling me to give the word and we’re out. Bag packed and everything.
      Once at the church, he congratulated my decision, stood through the grueling ceremony and we never spoke of it again.
      That’s how you do it.

      1. This is how it is supposed to work indeed. I feel bad for my buddy because he knew he would be miserable and just couldn’t be convinced there is a way out.

        2. I hadn’t seen him in 5 years. We talked sporadically. When I went down there a few days before the wedding he had gone from being a 6’4, fit Viking to being nearly 100 pounds overweight with a look of dread on his face.

        4. I still talk to him every few months. The wedding was only last summer. He is drinking a handle of jameson a day and eating fast food like it is going out of style. The woman has 2 kids by another guy and isn’t a looker by anyones definition. I have no idea how she conned him. He was always kind of a beta (military guy with military parents who taught him how to respect women ugh). At this point I assume he will just kill himself with crappy food and booze. I should have beat the snot out of him and dragged him to mexico or something.

        11. you would be surprised how fast it goes when you wake up in the morning and start drinking just to get over the shakes. I drink, but never had his tolerance and now it is even worse. When I was staying with him he would wake up and drink more than I would drink going out just to get himself to stop puking and shaking.

        12. I wasnt going to call you out until you said she has two kids from someone else.
          You failed your friend.

        14. Read the first two chapters of procopius secret histroy where he writes about how big a cuck pussy Belisarius was in regards to his wife. The man single handedly reconquered the Roman provinces for Justinius but had zero integrity when it came to his whore wife.

        15. Not fair, he failed himself and you.
          Men have a duty to help themselves not jist for their own sake but for the sake of those who have aligned with them. His actions were profoundly selfish.
          Look at how shitty you feel. Is that the sort of mindset a friend lets another friend get into? He had obligations to himself, and everyone who loves him to be the best and happiest man he could be. He failed.

        17. My grandmother drank a fifth of scotch every day of her life and chain smoked unfiltered Pall Malls to the tune of a three+ pack a day habit. I never saw her drunk. She started drinking the moment she got out of bed, and didn’t stop until the final nightcap on the bed side table. Just steady sips from a 12 ounce tumbler all day. She was not a large woman, pretty thin really. Her capacity was huge. She was hale and hearty until she slipped on the ice shoveling snow, broke her hip, got pneumonia in the hospital, and died at age 86.
          During my Navy/drinking days I had a huge capacity too. I saw guys drink easily 1.75 liters a day, and more.

        18. I have seen people drink like your grandmother. Some people are just like that it is the exception not the rule. I have seen a few people put down a handle a day…..unfortunately some handle their handle better than others.

        19. It is a part of my Irish heritage. I quit that when I left the Navy and rejoined real life.
          My grandmother did handle it well. However, my grandfather (her husband) died of cirrhosis of the liver at 63. It was not a pretty death.

      2. Few know this. I was at a wedding this weekend where the entire party was bitchy women and married manlets, so I knew the best man would do nothing of the sort.
        I plan to have my most red pill mate do the honors when my time comes. I want him critical and willing to call it off for me right up until the vows.

        1. I disqualified myself for the best man role for a guy I’d known since kindergarten. I knew the marriage was going to be a disaster- and my heartfelt advice to him was – call it off and dump her. He went through with it- it was a disaster.

    3. That’s why it is the best thing to never give her real commitment. Just a few glimpses here and there so she doesn’t lose hope.
      If you do this, she will be addicted to you. You can fuck her as much as you want, she WILL put up every single time.
      That’s the phase when women act as perfect as possible to trap the guy to commit. Well, if you are clever enough you can expand this phase as much as you want. hehe.

      2. Just love yourself more than you could ever love her and you’ll be good. If you’re always looking out for yourself and watching your own back then she’ll always be second and be in that stage of impressing and not being bitchy. I se a lot of guys guys pedastalize women, put them first and compromise their life and dreams for their SO’s. Fucking whack

        1. Very true. I’m always my own 1st priority.
          Simply put; What is love? (baby dont hurt’ me, jk)
          It is YOU, putting someone else than yourself on a pedestal and worshipping it. (“Baby I love you so much, I’d even die for you.”)
          Sounds harsh but that’s actually what love is. That’s why I never “love” any girl. The only people I love are my parents.

        2. Agreed 100%. Once you love yourself you’re way more fun to be around and don’t exhibit all these insecure beta behaviors (generally speaking). Took me a little while to figure this out for myself.

      3. You gotta be the highest value guy she can get at the time, if not that will be delusional behavior

    4. I agree, I dont think the behavior mentioned in the article is a shit test at all. Its an immature, emotionally unstable brat dropping her “good girl” act once the guy has committed some resources to her. She can now stop pretending and show more and more of the bitchy cunt that she really is. Even before I knew what the red pill was I noticed this in a girl I knew years ago. We booked a Valentine’s day weekend vacation and literally the next day she morphed into the person she has been ever since: the real her.
      Guys give women way too much credit by assuming she’s testing you. Most young girls are not that clever. Their minds are focused on getting their way by any means and trying to figure out how to manipulate you into doing their bidding for as long as possible. There are shit tests but I dont think this qualifies as one.

    5. Maybe its the commitment part thats the problem. If she commits to invest, you have effectively aquired her to some degree. Now she depends on you. But are you really up to snuff? Can you handle all of life’s bullshit? Because of you cannot, then she is in deep shit. In the same way a troop is in deep shut if their commander is a gutless vacilating pussy.
      Thus, the test.

    6. it’s a woman’s biological imperative to get inseminated – once she’s been inseminated by you – it’s her imperative to get inseminated by another man. the shit testing, the lack of effort – especially in a marriage or LTR that’s run 1+ yr without children being produced – it’s an instinctive push to blow things up and go get inseminated elsewhere.
      in exactly the same way that men will ALWAYS take a second look at the 21 yr old hottie that passes by in the street – women will always try to blow up their current relationship so they can get new seed somewhere else.
      note that women are always in relationships. always. so if she’s not with you – it’s AUTOMATIC that she’s getting cock elsewhere. – ergo – it logically follows that any attempt to spoil the current relationship is simply an attempt to get new cock.
      you can shame any attempt to shit test by exposing it for what it actually is – an attempt to generate an excuse (via passive aggressive behavior) – to go and ride new cock.
      Men can also do it – when they get bored and restless in a LTR, or even with a short term girlfriend, they can easily generate a situation where the girl dislikes them and causes the breakup without them having to do much. men don’t like breaking up – so they kind of let the girl break up with them – even if it hurts them too.
      the shit testing is what you might call an active passive aggressive approach to the same problem. i want to fuck someone else – and to do that i need to prove you are unworthy and justify the meltdown.
      the other reason that women shit test – conversely is to hold onto you – because if your life is too easy and things go smooth and you make money and are relaxed – well you can easily out grow her and have swathes of chicks after you – THUS is pays her to hold you back, exhaust you with BS and hold you at her pathetic level – so you cannot progress in life and find a better woman. you can read stories of musicians pre-fame – of women doing this to them – the women knew fame was coming and knew they’d probably lose the man – and so they generated chaos to keep his attention and hold him back.
      so basically they shit test to get rid of you and also to tire you out, so they can keep hold of you – until of course you’re a shattered wreck and then they leave you anyway.

    2. True, but then you have a conflict with a man’s biological drive, which is to raise up a son, someone he can teach to be a man and to carry on the genetic line. So at some point, either a man decides to not have kids (in which case get a vasectomy and have fun) or he gets into a relationship where he WILL have to endue the bliss test and a ton of shit tests.
      IMHO, it’s a matter of deciding which pain you want to endure for which goal.

  5. They are ‘shit’ testing to see if you can do the job full time. Just get better at it.
    And why would they decrease? You seem to be confusing them with ‘real’ (complex) tests/discussion that men partake in.

  6. Well, you could just go to Italy alone. You won’t be alone for long once you’re there. 🙂
    Yes, I know, not quite the point of the article, but still… 😀

  7. Think you’ve found “the one”? Go on a long trip (2+ weeks), preferably overseas. I guarantee by the end of the first week you will see what she is really like. The rest of the time is to see how long you can tolerate it. Then imagine being married.

    1. Essential. Make sure the trip is long enough for the excitement of traveling to disperse a little.

    2. Another tell, and one men had better listen to, is that her real personality will start to leak out about a year or so into the relationship. If you’re spending less than a year with a girl and thinking of marrying her, you’re doing it wrong and will get married for every wrong reason in the book. And then, of course, Frivorce Raped.

      1. Couldn’t agree more on this one. The real show begins in the second year. Everything in that first year is fluff.

        1. Yes. And dating is even worse. That’s just acting out a whole movie without a script. You see it sometimes on tv. It’s really cringeworthy to see the man giving in to her demands and the woman painting a picture of how a relationship should be but not wanting that in reality, looking at her history.

        2. For guys not interested in locking down a girl, a 1 year limit to experience an “LTR” in its blissful stage is fantastic. After that, you’d better have your shit down pat or the nastiness starts.

      2. For some girls, it’s a year. For others, it’s less time. For others, it’s simply whenever that ring lands on that finger. In my experience, it was two years, just after we’d gotten engaged, that the shit tests went nuclear. YMMV.

        1. I should have been clearer, my bad. For a girl actually looking to lock you down. Yeah, girls who are just out for fun and parties don’t give a damn what they reveal to you, and they can be downright vile by the second “date”.

        2. There are plenty of girls who play the good girl 18-24 and then break up. They are like pressure cookers. Suddenly they go out every week, trips abroad and hostelstays (cockcarousel time). The “growing together” mentality of yesteryear is long gone.

        3. I’m going to go back to my default, which is that a girl only starts that kind of thing if you’ve not maintained the proper frame in the relationship. And per my first post on the thread, most guys still approach it as “game” and *will* get tired of doing it and the next thing you know, she’s got ten milkmen all making trips to the house every week.

        4. True. But then again, without social constraints female sexuality is just like that of males: promiscuous. Maintaining a relationship, isn’t that game 24/7/365? I think it is. Getting is rather easy in comparison to keeping. Until her SMV is lower than yours, that is.

        5. AWALT, and that applied in 1840 just like it does today, only today you don’t have the State acting in your favor and bolstering your beta position (not you personally) that allows you to misstep. Ergo, naturals will still do perfectly fine in marriage and, really not anybody else. Which is why I can remain married and not be a hypocrite when I tell guys to basically avoid marriage at all costs, unless they’re naturals.

        6. In marriage you are taking over the role of her father as behavioral instructor. Setting limitations on behavior. But what if her upbringing was bad, or she comes from a broken family. No alpha can fix a decade of bad parenting or a lack of parenting.

        7. The “what ifs” should be well known long, long, long before you decide on a LTR. If her upbringing sucked, you’ll know soon enough, and a broken family is probably evident by the third date. Which goes to my point that no man should *ever* even think about a real LTR/marriage until after a year has passed. Avoid, at all costs, the “bliss, this is great, I want to fuck her pussy forever, let’s get married” thing like the plague, or you’ll miss the obvious signs that you mention.

        8. When my kids get up to “marrying” age you better believe I’m going to screen any prospective mates. My daughter is 7 and I’m already looking at her peers and have ruled out all but one as a future possibility.
          I believe that part of a father’s responsibility is to ensure a healthy relationship for his children. That’s why marriages were arranged back in the day. It wasn’t marriage based off of how hot they were or whatever, it was long term viability.

        9. I’ve mentioned this before- I refer to the daughters’ BFs by a number, not a name. When the BF eventually ask why I address him as dash four (or three or …)-
          1. I don’t know how long you’ll be around, so may not be much point in learning your name and getting attached.
          2. If I use your name I’ll start thinking of you as a person and it may make it a little difficult for me to do what may need to get done.
          Funny little joke.

        11. Sometimes her biological directive is stronger than the frame an individual man can muster. I’ve been there. Some women are not designed to submit for longer than a few years, not even to Chad Thundercock.

        12. Sorry man, disagree strongly. While mental illness are exceptions, AWALT, always.

        13. Cluster-B disorders render a woman unable to submit to anybody, man or woman, for very long. These psychos are simply uncontrollable in the long run.
          See also: Jolie, Angelina.

        15. Sure but they’re mentally ill. We just don’t treat most mental illnesses any longer. Jolie should have been institutionalized years ago.

        16. Good point. I never thought of it that way. Natural alphas have the best shot at happy marriages, or at least of remaining married. Think of all those women who hate their husband’s devil-may-care attitudes but nonetheless stay, stewing in their own cognitive dissonance. Even then it’s not guaranteed. A few of those guys overplay asshole alpha game and find themselves getting served with divorce papers.

        17. I read somewhere that if psychiatrists stuck closely to the DSM-V recommendations, one-fourth of all women ages 18-24 would be classified as mentally ill.

        19. That can happen, yeah. I’m not a complete raging hemorrhoid, and there are plenty of fun times we’ve had together doing “fun things” (mountain climbing, climbing up the Eiffel Tower, etc). The whole aspect of “comfort” in relation to Game is valid and applies in marriage just like in pickup.

        20. I always wondered how Jolie managed to snag an Alpha husband and keep him for as long as she did.

        22. When my husband asked me to marry him, my father demanded that my husband ask for my hand. My father and my husband had a long discussion about values and expectations.
          If my husband seemed like a beta who could not be the head of a household, my father would not have given his blessing for our marriage. I found out later that my father deeply respected my husband “being a man and showing that he could take care of my baby girl.”

        23. Also got a nephew who is a cop and absolutely brutal in giving my daughters’ boyfriends the going over. One was such a wuss about it, that it got her thinking and they eventually broke up…
          Another BF to my other daughter other gave as good as he got and is now my son-in-law

        24. And then one day she meets lolknees evil little nephew and all your plans fly right out the window…
          The purpose of having a daughter is to give good to the son of your brother. That is the beginning and end of it.
          Once you have the mindset that no one is good enough for your little princess, SHE will incorporate that mindset. But as a human she will want to fuck and have relationships, she will meet that need by either becoming totally frigid and turning it off completely or youll end up with her having buttboy alphasex and lesbian hookups.
          What you (and everyone else) should do is focus on improving all the yound men around you. Empower and guide them, have their back, look out for them. Control your own pain and emotions.

        25. Its a great vetting process. Just to see how they react. Like you said, the ones who wus out and cave are weak and unsuitable.

        26. Or even before the first date. That is why, according to my sons in their 20s, dating is no longer done.

        27. You are grossly underestimating. Right now 25% of women are on antidepressants or other psychotropic drugs. Which means that the other 75% are going untreated.

        28. I can argue against the natural thing. I was as far from a natural alpha in my youth as you could get. I was deep in the blue pill matrix. However, a series of women have beaten the beta out of me. I am now alpha with my wife and maintain frame effortlessly.
          The blacksmith takes a chunk of scrap iron and puts it in the hottest part of the forge. Then he beats it until the slag and inclusions are gone. Then he shapes, hardens, and sharpens it. Dealing with women these days, you are that scrap of iron, and they are the hottest part of the forge.
          The problem is surviving the first few (or more) women until you are hardened and sharp.

        29. After much bitter experience I would put the trial period at two years instead of one. It worked for me, and was necessary even with a village girl from a tradition patriarchal culture and a family with strong religious faith.

        30. As the father of two daughters (now in their thirties) my motto was:
          Kill the first one and the word will get around.

        31. There is no raising of women. You raise children until they are adults, and you hope you created a good responsible adult. With women they will never be adults. They are big children all their lives (Schopenhauer, On Women).

        32. There is a huge difference between staying married and being happily married. The current stats are that about 50% of marriage stay together. I would estimate a low percentage of those 50% are happy.

      3. Sometimes I get the impression that nowadays more than half of all LTR’s are 0-5 years long and then terminated. People get bored quickly in our consumerist/instant gratification economies. Something “better” is just around the corner. (it’s probably more of the same).
        Getting married is something I wouldn’t do before the fifth year. And cohabiting.. 2.5 or so. People in their young twenties shouldn’t do this at all, because before age 24 or so they are developing their personalities so radically, as I have found out multiple times. It isn’t worth the headache.

        1. Bought and married my Thai wife within 3 weeks of meeting her. It only took that long because we waited 2 weeks for Valentines day to get married. Been together over 7 years now, money well spent. No dating, saw her, wanted her, purchased her straight away.
          English wife marred after 2 years, met at 21 (her 19), married at 23 (her 21). Lasted 30 years but totally fucked in the last year.

        2. Good for you, but then again: there are people who live playing Russian roulette. They are happy as well and can recommend playing it because of the high rewards.

        7. I actually agree with everything you stated but taking biology into account the longer you wait to procreate the weaker your progeny will be. Just logically speaking, logistically thinking, those last 5 years of your 20s is the best time to have the 2.5 kids. I see a lot of guys here that think they shouldn’t have kids for whatever reasons. World is fucked up, frivorce etc but as a man blessed with 4 sons I would advise you all to have some kids. I love them. They give me direction and purpose. Hope. A lot of people aren’t happy because they don’t have those 3 things. If not kids, find something, one single thing that gives you all 3.

        14. There is a theory that women have basically a 4 year cycle. That is enough time to secure a man, get pregnant, have the kid, and raise it to where it can walk and talk and not shit it’s pants. Then she is biologically programmed to look for another man to get a new set of genes to mix with hers. It is an observable pattern. This maximizes her genes being successfully passed down through time. That is the definition of success for any living being; passing down your genes.

        15. It is called a sin sot (sp). Traditionally it is paid in gold, and for Hi-so families it can be quite expensive. When the dirt poor rice farmer parents of a banged out Bangkok whore see a farang patsy wants to marry their slut of a daughter, they act like they are Hi-so and she is a virgin. Thai men would never put up with that. However, Thai men would not, and do not, bat an eye at paying tens of thousands of dollars worth of gold to the parents of a high class virgin bride.

        16. It’s all about novelty. That is what is stimulating to the human brain. After five years, you know everything you can possibly know about that person. After that time staying monogamous is forced from rationality.

        17. Monogamy is always forced. From day one. If you marry you are supposed to be saying, I promise to get up every day and decide to love you. Love that lasts is not a feeling, it is a decision.

        18. Yes. I can imagine that millions of people fool themselves into believing they love somebody because they don’t have better options. The best can do = for them the person they will “love”. I love my gf, but I know that love is depending on me having ambition to study and work and to maintain my physique, take her out to “brighten” her life in the way her friends won’t. There is no unconditional love. In the end it’s all quid pro quo anyway. Does love actually exist? Love for a familymember, your parents, dog. Ok fine. Romantic love? I don’t really believe in that as well.

        19. The only unconditional love is from a father to his children. I laugh in the faces of the young idiot women I interact with who say they are having a child so someone will love them unconditionally. It doesn’t work that way. Men love women. Women love (their) children. Children love puppies.

        20. I would edit that to- most women love their children. If all did, one of the highest risk to kids wouldn’t be mom’s new BF/husband– i.e. the non-biologically related males she introduces into their lives.

      4. My mom put it simply as – long courtship, short engagement. Her second rule in finding a spouse. First was date a lot of people casually….

      5. It could also be that after one year, you have a large data set of red flags to work with that don’t appear like noise when things are early on.

    3. There was a Seinfeld episode in which Elaine and Puddy took a month-long holiday in Europe. When Kramer heard about it, he remarked, “He [Puddy] will be coming home in a body bag.”

    4. thank you for this. I took the red pill shortly before I got a girl pregnant telling myself see was “the one” it’s taken me a couple years since but I have finally swallowed it. The girl was cheating on me with a good friend and I didn’t find out till after we moved out together, with our daughter to a new state. since then I have told her I will see other women while still living with them, just not bringing them home. since that decision I have been getting steadily more pussy while training my baby momma to keep a clean house and teach my daughter while I’m at work. I met a girl who fits so many of my standard criteria (and we banged a buncg) and although haven’t said anything feel like I may be “in love” again. she tells me she wants kids and to stay at home and it’s crazy I almost feel like I want to. but I know it is just another test, a big one, to see if I really dI’d swallow the red pill, if I really can be comfortable without a woman. I feel I almost failed and wanted to outright marry this new girl but coming on here reassures myself that no, my current mission of side bitches should be followed through I don’t need to tie myself down anymore than I already have.

    5. Never saw the point in transporting pussy around the world for free holidays. Plenty of local pussy at the destination, usually younger, cheaper, prettier and more willing to fuck you than the one you have at home.
      Don’t waste your money on tickets for women!

      1. If you are vetting a potential LTR then it is worth the price of the ticket. That is a hard learned lesson. Take it or don’t, but when you are my age you will wish you had taken it.

        1. I’m 61, how old are you.
          Marriage 1 (divorced)
          Married 30 years after spending 2 years getting to know her.
          Marriage 2 (still going)
          Married 7+ years after buying a total (really cute) stranger.
          Seems random to me, so might as well save the ticket money.

        2. I will turn 62 shortly. Married 4 times, once until death did we part. Never married as long as the 9 years with my Filipina bride. However, we did 2 years of chaperoned dating before the wedding. I traveled with her (and a male relative of hers) before getting serious. I had waited to travel with wife Number 1 (also known as THE BITCH) until our honeymoon. It was the most miserable trip of my life. You live and you learn.
          I am happy for you that it has worked out for you so far. Good luck to all of us that it keeps on going well.

  8. I am not sure the women themselves know why they do the shit tests. They just get crabby and lose their performance from time to time. I come home to the wife on occasion, and the place is a mess, and she is a crab. I tell her to go to bed and then I put the kids to work. She will act like a child and pout that I am getting things done. An hour or two later, she will be apologetic and we will have sex. The following day, the place will be spotless and she will be all gussied up and flirty. No rhyme or reason.
    The main thing is to maintain frame and show consistency. If you lose your cool and blow up at her, it will only worsen the situation. They are emotional, and they need a steady frame to lean on.

    1. Amen to the last paragraph. If ‘frame’ is too difficult a concept, men should at least strive for consistency and a Cool Head, even if it doesn’t always lead directly to sorry-fukkie.

      1. Never had a blow up end well. Even if you “win” the argument, it will haunt you for some time.

        1. I learned to sort of “blow in”. Basically, when I would otherwise blow up, I go super-rational and lay down every persuasion tactic I ever learned. Instead of losing the limiter on my aggresdion, I lose the limiter on my dark triad tendencies.
          Way more effective.

        2. There is no winning of arguments, only survival….
          Paradoxically, we come off as the more sensitive species as we let these things haunt us as you say. The woman seems explode at once and be done with it.
          Come to think of this, this is an inversion of the orgasm experience of the respective sexes. Worthy of further consideration if I didn’t have the attention span of a gnat.

        4. If I ever learned to lose that limiter permanently, I shudder to think what I could do. There’s some real power to such frame, and I respect the heavy burden of responsibility that comes with it.

        5. When I was younger, in weak, blue-pill moments, I would loose my shit and the results were devastating.

        7. Because women remember and fat ones remember everything because they’re elephants.

        8. I got the cops called on me during my one and only enormous blowup. Vicious spinster neighbors were looking for any excuse to hurt me, and they heard me yelling and hopping around. The ex-wife turned from a raging tiger to sweet kitten when the men in blue showed up at the door.
          I never lost frame again after that.

        9. Damn straight. As I mentioned to somebody else, the single best tactic you can take when a girl goes total ape shit emotional is
          1. The 5th Amendment silence
          2. A calm, reasoned, unemotional countenance
          To really make it fun, after she’s been ranting a while, just go Mr. Spock on her with a “I can sense that you’re a bit too upset right now to discuss this further. Take some time to cool down a bit and we’ll discuss this later” then stride briskly out the door to someplace fun.

        12. Up your nose with a rubber hose…er..wait, wrong show…

        13. Works with men too. A guy who goes ‘total ape shit emotional’ has just shown you all his cards.

        14. Absolutely. Most “game” is just working human interactions to your benefit. While you do things differently with a man as opposed to a woman, you still have the basics that both share, like going apeshit, which is handled the same way as you note.

        17. And walking away (like most men do) is one of your tactics? I think it’s necessary sometimes. Because women will try to burry you in allegations

        19. I actually believe this is why women are less mentally stable in general. We replay these moments of weakness in our conscious minds to try to reconcile them and they leave them in their unconscious. It’s way harder to control your subconscious mind. That actually shapes you without you knowing. How we men deal with our conscious problems shape how we are perceived by the world and ourselves. People as a whole are shaped beyond their control by what lies in the back of our minds

        20. Typical how Mum here ignores genuine professional advice…. and gets shit reaction…. Advice is applied, improved reaction.

        21. Persuasion is rarely pointing out the rational points, especially with women. Thats where I always failed. I would endlessly explain a point to her like we were in a debate team. She really just wanted to be punished.

        23. Women are generally shitty parents when it comes to discipline. Either too soft or overreact.

    2. A shoulder to cry on is a dick to ride on! Or so the interwebz says….

      1. that’s just something friendzoned guys tell. we all know that’s bullshit,

    3. I think sometimes they know, and sometimes they don’t. Like when the girl will “try to get a rise out of you” because it’s “funny” when you get angry. That’s intentional. Use it as foreplay and get “smiling angry” and rip off her clothes and pin her to the floor. She’ll love it and thank you.
      Other tests, eh, I really don’t think that they’re aware they’re doing it, as you say.

      1. Everyone can have a bad day – it’s not that.
        Women test and fuss at their men largely from unconscious lust. If she can mess things up
        with you enough, then she can go out, drink too much and go to bed with some passing random that catches her fancy. This is why women shit test.
        That is also why women are so obsessed with cheating – because they themselves need a reason to cheat. So if you cheat she has the excuse.
        All the shit testing and gaslighting is a type of
        passive aggressive approach to rationalizing their own inner nasty desires. That is what it is.

        1. If all women are that way, you might as well shoot or castrate yourself. They are not trying to mess things up to give themselves an excuse to cheat. That is giving them too much credit. They lack self control and just act that way.
          That being said, like Ghost says, there are times they are being intentional about it. They want to get a reaction. Make it a good one.

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    5. Great Advice!
      There are moments when keeping your cool is soul crushing hard.
      But well, we are men, we are made to withstand this…

      1. At times, women do have emotional fallout for one reason or another. Just after our second kid, there was about 3 months of just looney bin behavior. I come home 15 minutes late from work, and she blows up. Not fun, especially when there is no sex because of the baby.

        1. When my wife did that particular shit test I say, “Yeah. I diverted from my usual trip home, got to my bimbo’s house, stripped down, had sex, showered, redressed, and drove home. That is why I am 10 minutes late. BTW, she said it was the best 20 seconds of sex she had ever had.”

  9. My friend just proposed to his live-in girlfriend of 3 years.
    Her response? She said she needed space to think about it and proceeded to treat him like shit for 3 weeks. He finally said that they should break up and she’s gone straight back to acting like a kitten.
    I think what happened is his 25 year old gf finally realized the reality of her life situation. Her financial debt, the competition in her career, her lazy lifestyle habits, her relatively ordinary self, all kind of came into focus when he proposed to commit to her for real.
    If she marries this dude, that’s a lock-in on an otherwise free-floating imagination of her future self. She’s not early 20s anymore and needs to really decide what she wants for her future. Does she risk it and live abroad like she’s been planning and working towards, or does she get comfortable and accept this guy’s offer of taking care of her dumb ass for the rest of her life?
    I get along with my friend’s gf so don’t take me wrong, but she’s given me shit before for my frugality, and only now has realized that her financial debt isn’t paying itself off despite working 5 days a week. I told my buddy what I thought of his situation and to not just let himself get used even though they’ve had a solid relationship up until this point. A girl becoming so confused when offered a marriage proposal seems a little off putting in my opinion.
    In response to the author’s conundrum, I don’t think most girls even have a clue what they’re doing. Their shit-testing and other behaviours simply might not have translated properly into the modern world..

    1. as for your friend, that response is a massive red flag.
      he should run, not walk, away from her or is life will be hell until the inevitable divorce raping he will receive.
      he should thank her for making her future behaviour clear.

      1. Master Caution light is illimunating.
        Consulting the relationship emergency condition checklist– step number 1 is: Bailout.

    2. I fear your friend is still staring down the barrel of lifelong
      misery…if she had to make a pragmatic, financial case to stay with
      him, he’s doomed to doing time in a Financial Partnership in which his
      commitments will only increase over time.

      1. And– she will likely continuously calculate financial benefits of alternative partnerships in the future, including how she can get him to subsidize those partnerships as an ex-husband vice ex-BF.

    4. pay a very talented and very attractive hooker to “meet” him in a bar, hit on him and take him back to her hotel room for a toe curling fuck. It will be good for him.

      1. Hahaha great idea. I want to do this for my dad! And my boss! And every miserable buddy I have.

      1. Yep. This is not the response of a woman ready and willing to commit, but of calculating possibilities…. including the end games in the future.

    6. If she acted the fool that bad when he proposed after they have been together for 3 years it won’t get better after marriage….put that bitch in the ROW-AD!

    7. I think your friend’s girl was worried there would be no danger and just be expected to get the ring, share accounts, and do other wifely duties like pop babies and hang with other wives. This awakening shook her up which is why she tried to bolt. Your friend may need to start living a more expressive life for his own sake or this woman will likely look to cheat or some other nonsense to get her danger jollies.

      1. “wifely duties like pop babies and hang with other wives.”
        Unfortunately this is correct — the fact that you left out cooking, cleaning, grocery shopping and laundry. They don’t see that as their duty anymore. At least in here in the Northeast.

        1. It is a shame but current women talk a good game but cooking and cleaning takes energy they rather spare for the one night stand than their relationships. They seem to like doing these behaviors to get you more committed. Best meals I got was when the relationship seemed possible.

        2. Oh, they have energy all right.
          For going to “spin class” and flirting with the instructor. And then off to “Friday’s” for frozen margaritas with the girls.

        3. Never been bothered by that shit, tonight cooked a decent yellow chicken and potato curry while getting pissed with a mate. Took me all of 20 minutes.
          Laundry, 5 minutes to load the washing machine.
          Shopping, Tesco is on my way home from the Jungle.

        4. But your wife actually GROWS the stuff you eat. That’s waaaay better than grocery shopping.

        5. Nah, there’s a rice shop round the corner, far easier to buy a portion of ready cooked sticky rice or steamed rice for 15c than cook it ourselves.

        6. Everyone grows something and they trade/share.
          This week everyone seems to be giving me potatoes and runner beans. Last week it was jackfruit (and more potatoes)
          Don’t know who the stuff is from, they just open our kitchen door and leave it on the table.

        7. Hahaha. I think this may be a Hmong show of thanks. I saw it in “Gran Torino”. Did you recently chase off a bunch of gang punks with your rifle?

        8. I am married to an Asian. We have a rice cooker and go through a 50 pound sack of rice in about a month. I don’t pay for it ready made, no matter how convenient it might be.

    9. “Let me think about it” = Next. Fuck her. If she’s not all in right from the proposal, eject her like blue ice from a 747 and find another broad.

      1. Yeah- the response I got was yes and a question on whether a specific date she had in mind would be acceptable.
        He should have immediately (and it isn’t too late) withdrawn the proposal and let her think about what she should have said for the rest of her life.

      2. You know, I could almost tolerate a “let me think about it” in RARE instances (old school traditional girl being actively courted – not fucked – but courted under family supervision by several appropriate suitors, or perhaps a girl who had literally never given the idea any thought, and just needed to sleep on it – literally take no more than a couple of hours – to realize that this is the right move). It’s the three weeks of her intentionally treating the dude like shit, followed by the good girl reversal only after getting the “OK, fuck off” that’s the biggest red flag here. And tolerating three weeks of that shit is excessive. If you need to sleep on it, but in the interim hour you act like a cunt when you should, at most, be in kind of a pleasant shock = next.

    10. “If she marries this dude, that’s a lock-in on an otherwise free-floating imagination of her future self.”
      Nailed it. He’s competing with a vision of Sex and the City in her head that she thinks she’s going to be living.

        2. You talkin bout The Golden Girls?
          That show was Sex and the City plus thirty years. The parallel is almost perfect.

        3. No I meant sex in the city, but the parallel you draw is mind-blowing….it really is the same exact show!

        4. And UGLY.
          You forgot UGLY.
          Especially the one with the big nose.
          She looks like a foot wearing a wig.

        8. Always, but in her case, she started out ugly and just got worse with age.

        9. I never understood why she didn’t go to a plastic surgeon to remove that ugly wart on her face. She carries it like Hitler wore his mustache. Proud and overt.

        10. “Picture it! Sicily! 1944! All of our men were dead, and I boinked an America GI just to stay alive!”

      1. Ah, now here, we find common ground. Throw her ass to the ground so fast that gravity doesn’t have time to take effect.

        1. … at a > 9.8 m/second squared.
          At some point in the future this girl will be blaming him and the marriage for having prevented her achieving the things she will imagine she could have had. He is signing up right now as her excuse in the future for any regrets about what might have been if she hadn’t taken the comfortable route.

        2. Ding ding ding..
          ….
          Flash forward to the broad eat pray loving after she divorce raped him.

        3. God, I have been there. Every western woman thinks all she has to do is reach out her hand and a big career in a glamorous field is hers; with no effort on her part before, during, or after. Of course, that means any man she lives off of is actually stealing the wind beneath her wings.

    12. “Her response? She said she needed space to think about it..”
      She will be jerking him around as long as he puts up with it or she finds another (not necessarily better) guy to ride.
      He got his answer. He needs to proceed to bang her cute girlfriends.

      1. And her cute GFs will bang him even if they think he is repulsive. They want to score points by taking another woman’s man. This is one of the reasons women are incapable of having friends. Another is that they are just shitty friends.

    13. Question the morality and common sense of a girl who will live with a man without absolute certainty she would marry him if asked.

    14. She’s living with him for the past three years, he proposes and she has to think about it? She’s considering her options while acting like a kitten when he complains because if she swings off of his branch she wants another branch to grab onto. If the relationship was the way she wanted it to be she would of said yes right away. She didn’t, that’s not a good sign. I would of considered her age and maybe she’s thinking she’s too young at 25 but she’s basically his common law wife now anyway as she’s been there for three years so it’s something else….

    15. That broad is fucked.
      Do your best to lay out a case to your friend to not marry her.
      She reacts like that and has massive debt she cant pay off and she wants to live abroad??!
      …
      Do not wed!

    17. Bro – this calls for drastic action. I mean, this is the kind of thing where if you can’t think of any other way to waive him off, it would be acceptable for YOU to cheat with her and let him catch you in the act, just so that he can’t lie to himself about what he’s getting into. It may destroy your friendship, but it might save your friend’s life. Not saying this should be the first step, but if you really care about this guy, you need to prepare do what is necessary to keep him from making a horrible mistake.

    18. If a marriage proposal is NOT greeted with anything less than an ecstatic and immediate yes… should I ever give one… it is a walk or me. More than saying I love you, telling a woman you are about to commit to her (there is no asking) should elicit nothing less than CONFIRMATION that that is all she has been thinking about and waiting for. I doubt I will ever pop the question to a woman, but if I do, that is my litmus test of clarity, the red pill of reality about our relationship no matter WHAT I might have thought up to that moment I was “sure” about. A marriage proposal truly is the single, most telling sign of how your future wife will treat you. Men who do not value themselves, will let the rationalization hamster run amuck and allow all kinds of “time” she needs because “it’s a big decision.” If she actually loves you, wants you, its not a big decision. It is ALL she has been dreaming about and patiently (yes) waiting for.

      1. It would destroy any man to get anything less than an enthusiastic yes. Clark’s friend is devastated right now and probably doesn’t have the self esteem/confidence to end the relationship now. Her treating him like shit for 3 weeks is likely her realizing that he is completely at her mercy which really shows that she is a sick sadistic cunt that gets off on seeing him miserable. She knows the only thing on his mind is awaiting her decision. All women abuse power but thats just cruel. He shouldnt even want to be anywhere around someone that inconsiderate of his feelings.

  10. I would rather not have any understanding of it since it seems I get this part of relationships a lot better than I do others, but women just want to make sure you are who you say you are and are not needy. This is a permanent fixture of women since it is very easy to just get comfortable. Women do this because they don’t like a man comfortable.
    At any given moment you need to be able to levy the ground you walk on. If you can’t do this, the woman won’t get moist and everything ends. The problem is as a guy we all want the lady to simply want the happily ever after. Women don’t want that shit. They want to talk about it of course but want to know they can affect you all the more but also that you genuinely want them.
    As an example, a few years back I planned a trip ahead of time with a fuck buddy. I wanted the trip and the FB wanted more time together. Since I wasn’t as invested, FB subconsciously knew this and decided to go full tilt on sharing stories of how romantic this was and everything else. Trip comes and we do everything I want happily because I already showed I can be happy doing this myself and get a new lady too. One night out comes, and she decides to start bitching after seeing some lady do her best to grind on me on the dance floor. I remain unfazed but lose a new prospect. After this moment of weakness, she decides to act like a brat once a friend gets wasted and passes out on the street. This was where foot came down and she was told she needed to go somewhere with that or risk fending for herself and finding her own space until we fly back. She gets on her best behavior from that point on.
    At a later date I ended things because I really didn’t want the relationship to flourish but that is neither here nor there. At no point did she not play the intuition game to try and assess her role with me and how much flexing she could do. She is hard wired to do this because she wanted to be wet for me at all times. This is just how vaginas are hard wired. They want some danger to always be wet.

  11. Future projections are a way to keep her interested. They can be small (next week we are going to the cinema) medium (we will do a trip in May) or huge (we will start looking for a house). But getting married is Russian roulette guys. Don’t do that stuff. We all know it’s putting a noose around your neck.
    You might love your GF (I do), but red pill truths are… truths. You can’t beat hundred of thousands years of evolution. Women will do what they will do and you can’t stop them. So live for yourself. That means, protect yourself financially and emotionally. No marriage, no shared bankaccounts, no buying houses together, no buying and leasing a car for her. Etc.

  12. Women have no idea what they want and they have no idea why they shit test, it’s just what they do. The question to ask yourself is are her shit tests worth the trouble? There is a difference in her just being a woman and acting up from time time and her being a crazy bitch. Life is too short to be stuck with a crazy woman while a good one is worth it.
    The key to happiness is figuring out AHEAD OF TIME which one she is but, there’s no guarantees, life is full of risk.

    1. Funny, I thought the key to happiness was having sex with lots of women in their 20’s and early 30’s, of all different nationalities, in obscene ways, sometimes 2 or three at a time and living alone.

      1. That too but, we were discussing those who want something else. Everybody’s got a different way of doing things.
        If life had been a little different I might be doing the same stuff however, just knowing myself I would have gotten tired of it after a while

        1. not made for all people. You have to be a particularly kind of nuts to live my life without getting either bored or incredibly depressed after a long time. I was mostly being tongue in cheek….

        3. I understand and living a life like that certainly has its upside.
          There are some cats though that, as corny as it sounds just want a woman who loves them, supports them and will raise his children right and stick with him through thick and thin. Where to find her at I can’t say and even after finding her it’s important to remember she’s still a woman.
          Like the old song-
          Wake me up early,
          Be good to my dog,
          And teach my children to pray.

      2. Sure, you could take that approach, but you’d be missing out on all the mood swings, tests, and the withholding of sex like what the article talks about.

        1. don’t be silly, you still get tested. Only when you answer you can be absolutely brutal knowing the worst thing she has going for her in her arsenal is not fucking you

      3. Nah, I like living with my wife …. and banging other girls in their 20s a couple of times a week. You can keep the girls in their 30s …… way too old for me.

    2. When mine has a funny turn, I point at the door and say, “if you can do better, I’ll be sorry to see you go”. She actually knows she’s instantly replaceable with a younger woman.

      1. Nothing wrong with trading for a newer model every now and then lol

        1. The nice thing about owning a 45 is that you can barter it off for a couple of 22’s.

        3. I’ve actually said that to my wife,. The Look? Yeah, I knows it. heh.

        5. It’s when they not only accept, but come to expect jokes and sayings like that, that you know that you’re golden. There is literally almost nothing left for them to get mad at you about except actual real shit that you may have actually fucked up.
          I’m feeling all curse-y today for some reason, heh.

        6. My dad was always saying stuff to embarrass Mom and I never knew what he was doing. Now I do the same thing and people will look at us like I’m crazy but it doesn’t even faze my wife. She shrugs and kind of grins or rolls her eyes.
          I’ll make comments at work and people will say things like “I bet you don;t say that to her” and don’t believe me when I say I do and she accepts it.
          Women are just like children. When we’re somewhere and I’m ready to go I snap my fingers and my wife and/or kids look at me and when I say “Let’s go”, we go.

        9. right. For women, this is a problem without solution, an unavoidable obstacle. It’s our sphinx. Our response proves our merit. So, yes, sounds to me like your version. It’s a good one, too!

        10. It’s a shit test if you don’t mean it and are trying to see what she’ll do and how she’ll react. For me, it’s because I’m a natural asshole with a decent sense of humor and also, because it basically makes me immune from the whole “You shouldn’t say that to me!” bullshit that most men deal with regarding wives.

        11. That all fits the description of a test .. sometimes meant, sometimes not. Possibly illuminates why women test?
          I hope this doesn’t disappoint but, though you may be so elsewhere, you don’t seem a natural a$$hole here.

        12. I was never a natural asshole. It is an achievement that took me years to become.

  13. What this comes down to is that you can never truly let up and “stop” gaming.

    Amen to that. In fact, I’d add right out of the gate that “gaming” had better have become your natural behavior and not an effort or “work” long before you put a ring on her finger. If it’s still work, you’re going to fuck up your life forever because one day you’ll get tired of working and then boom, you’re screwed ten ways to Sunday. But if you’ve been gaming so long that it’s just a normal part of your personality, and it does happen with time if you’re consistent, batting away nuclear shit tests becomes not only easy but somewhat entertaining. And, because you’ll be unlike 95% of other men, she’ll hue closer to you and be way more of a good wife than you’ll ever find other men having. True fact.
    As to traveling, I dunno man, my wife and the girls I dated before here never really started nagging or giving me shit when we planned international trips. Maybe it’s the “planner” type girl personality I seem to attract, but all my wife ever did prior to marriage was “plan out” all of the details (flights, hotel reservations, savings set aside) and got really happy doing so (still does). So, I guess, if you’re getting serious, go with the “planner” type personality to avoid the shit testing maybe?

    1. My wife is not the planner type at all. Our vacations have all been the road trip types and if something looks cool, we will stop and check it out. She is like a dog, happy to do whatever. Seems to do well.

      1. I don’t mean “plan every shop and museum we’ll visit”, I prohibit that shit. I hate having a “daily schedule”. I meant more the stuff you need to plan out just to get on the airplane. When we hit the U.K. she’ll plan out the car rental, the airplane tickets, putting aside money in savings, and one or two BB’s, and the rest we just do on the wing, as you mention.
        I can see how that wasn’t clear though. Man, I’d *loathe* having my every hour planned on a vacation. Fuck that noise.

        1. gotcha….she does the logistics. Yeah, she pawns that responsibility on me too.

        2. Wanna get out of the logistics detail? Fuk it up royally some time. Book yourselves into a fleabag, make reservations int he wrong city, or the wrong date….

        4. You sir, know the secret of getting out of the expectation of any kind of “job”.
          “Well what do you know sweety, I guess I’m NOT supposed to combine darks and whites and bleach in the washing machine. Huh”

        5. Bingo!
          “Only a man can fake such incredible stupidity as required to get out of household chores”
          -W. Cosby.

      2. My now ex wife was/is a planner– as soon as she knows something has to be done she’s on it and won’t rest. She planned our wedding in a week- dress, flowers, photog, invitations, venue, centerpieces- everything.
        Her major issue is everything has to be perfect. And since one can never be perfect, she always views herself as a failure to some degree. Her own worst critic. Sometimes got in the way with allowing the kids the wiggle room to take care of their own sh!t and fail at minor things and learn. The helicopter parent. Her kid’s minor ‘failure’ was a reflection she wasn’t managing things perfectly.
        Hardest thing on a vacation was getting her to go with the flow- leave time for and take advantage of the spontaneous emerging opportunities.

    2. “that “gaming” had better have become your natural behavior ”
      This 100000x
      The thing is, if it is just a “game” then you are essentially trying to mimic traits that make a man successful not just with women, but in business, in general dealings with people, in life in general. If I do not have it in my to be “on” it means I either have a flu or am just too tired and so I stay home. I use the exact same “game” when talking to women on an elevator, my grandma when I call her on sundays, the waitress in a restaurant, the stranger on the phone, the stranger in the street. To be honest, I don’t know if I have done it so long it became natural or if I am just a natural at it….I really don’t know the answer…but I do know that if you are faking it most women, even the fucking morons, will see through you….when you succeed it just means their whore ass didn’t care.

      1. It’s where most of the guys drop the ball and then think that it’s somehow the woman’s fault. No, that’s her nature, you don’t get mad at a frog for eating flies, so don’t expect anything but her nature to take over if you’re just faking it.

        1. I was compared to the scorpion in the frog and scorpion story yesterday. I told the girl that she can’t call me the scorpion and ALSO get mad. The fault in that story was on the frog. The scorpion was just being a scorpion.

        2. It’s the equivalent of women complaining that all men are attracted to pretty fit women, and that it’s somehow wrong/evil they aren’t attracted to fat lazy women.
          If men are like that, it isn’t wrong/evil— it just is. It is a fact to be dealt with, a part of nature that can’t be changed. Not something to get mad about.

        3. Thank you thank you thank you, that is PRECISELY what it’s like. Wish I’d thought of that analogy first.

      2. And a second thought, what really grinds my gears is when guys say “AWALT!” with regard to female nature when it suits their needs to absolve themselves of their own failings, yet totally forget that AWALT is a two way street. All women are exactly like all women have always been, which means that if you provide the proper frame that they will respond as submissively in 2017 as they did in 1756. ALL means all, in all times, forever, and it applies to ALL traits and actions and responses.
        They kind of overlook that in the rush to proclaim the beauty and nobility of being incel.

    3. I do all the planning. Women are incapable of consistent planning, making sound financial decisions, or sticking to a schedule. I lead, and my wife prefers it that way. I think most women do. Also, I control all the money so she couldn’t make reservations anyway.

        6. The part of the movie where he was messing with the instructor about women drivers-priceless.

        7. I didn’t like Borat, but I thought The Dictator was freaking hilarious.

        9. I was wavering on that actually. She’s got good bone structure, symmetry and a nice fit body, no obvious defects, no ink, no unnatural piercings, long hair. In this day and age that’s an 8, but I was really considering saying “An 80’s HB7/7.5” for a bit. Good call.

        10. Well yeah, not having tats and piercings is really a big plus today. Her body is good. But an 8 or 9 to me is a blonde or redhead with a very youthful, neotenous face. In eastern europe you see loads of girls like in the picture. Go to Krakow, Poland for instance. It’s nothing special. But in the US this would be a 9 for most men.

    2. That’s her, born in Uzbek Soviet Socialist Republic, came here at 3. Soviet but has gone full American.

  15. You learn alot about each other on long road trips too. No need to spend 7 hours on a plane, 2 or 3 in a car is enough sometimes. And cheaper.

    1. Absolutely. The most important thing about marriage is knowing and appreciating the act of shutting the fuk up for a long time.

        1. You’re nuts!!! it’s bed AND breakfast!!!!! What could go wrong?
          Though I’ve been to a few that suk.
          Tell you what – go to Ireland. They know how to do it right. Tea, cookies, huge breakfast, nice bed…shit I’m pretty sure someone offered me their daughter at one point.

        3. Why? If you review them ahead of time and go for the high end ones, they’re quite pleasant I think.
          Walking into some dump though, sucks I’d expect, plus no doubt you’re going to find yourself on prominent display on Youporn or whatever a few days after you leave.

        8. Scotland is the same, very pleasant and everyplace we stayed in the past had wonderful amenities.

        2. Yeah, that’ll happen.
          My grandfather, regarding my mother:
          “I taught her to talk at 2 and she hasn’t shut up since”

    2. This picture certainly has to do with “the bliss”. I bet most men would abandon their wifes… if they only could. They made the mistake of marrying them, buying houses with them, shared bankaccounts. Just never do that. Would you respect your boss if he couldn’t fire you? Probably a lot less.
      Seeing this picture I think of the old women (55+) I see at my gym where I work a couple of days a week, in the morning. Their husbands are probably working at that moment, to pay the bills and the women are doing Zumba and drinking coffee afterwards. 2, 3 times a week. Not my idea of equality. I’ve questioned myself before about the value of women like that. What do they still offer to their husbands? Are they good cooks, do they clean? They must. Their attractiveness is gone for over 2 decades, the children are out the door by now. So, tell me, what is it.

    1. Expensive.
      I drink Carlo Rossi.
      I get the 4L jug for $19.
      It gets the job done.
      Also drink Pabst Blue Ribbon and Old Crow & Seagram’s 7.
      I like the cheap stuff…

      1. I never drink beer (or anything with bubbles) but the wine and the booze I drink Brenda to be very high end….

        1. All depends on what you get used to.
          I started with the cheap stuff at 18.
          The good stuff is wasted on me. Can’t really tell the difference.

        4. I will occasionally sip a little champagne but carbonation gives me a stomach ache.

      2. Fortunately, I have no taste for good wine. So a flagon of Quail Oak is fine by me.
        Unfortunately, I can taste the difference between a good single malt and a blend, or a cheaper whiskey/whisky.

    2. I also brought a pint of Richard’s Wild Irish Rose and MD 20/20 to the office Christmas party this past year.
      Got a few dirty looks from the hags.
      But many of the guys got a big kick out of it.

      1. actually, I wouldn’t drink it but I thought the name is funny. I tend to drink either Spanish wines or a cote de rhone

  18. A friend of mine at work was in line for lunch. The woman behind him said, “Ladies first”. Turning his head slightly he leaned back and replied, “Not now that we’re equal,” and stepped forward to pay his meal.
    They wanted equality and independence. They can have it with all the stressors that come with work, bills AND paying their own way. Be independent and pay for your own ticket abroad.
    If, BIG BIG if, I ever got married again, the moment the “M” word was hinted at I would be relentless at slamming the prenup down every single time that word came across her lips.
    “But I love you, don’t you trust me?”
    “Bye.”
    “But you know I lo..”
    “Bye. Oh and one more thing…bye.”
    Call her up 2 days later, “Just wanted to be clear, BYE!”
    I don’t fuckin want your money or any success of yours that made you money. What is mine is always mine. Yours is yours.
    $1,000 dollar tickets and lodging and food. You say your independent, then PAY YOUR WAY.
    Addendum: I think I would have a woman pass a 125 question test on prenuptial law before marriage like the character in Diner that had his fiancee take the Baltimore Colts test. Instead of a premed test its a prewed or a Marital S.A.T.

    1. Emancipation is a Chinese buffet for women. They only take what they like:
      Men paying for dates. vs. Paying for yourself.
      Men holding the door. vs. No more door holding.
      Getting away with violence. vs. You get what you deserve.
      Working as hard and often as a man. vs. Complaining about glass ceilings and lower salaries.
      Wanting to work in men’s fields, but: demanding special standards. (the death of the military, firebrigades and police forces)

  20. I learned this when I had held off on saying “I love you” to the girl I was dating. One day I finally said it. Immediately her shit-testing and moodiness went up. I simply saw it as the “magic” being gone. Before saying “I love you” I had all the control and her attraction was very high. Afterwards she saw me as just another guy who could be more easily controlled. I suppose this is what happens when you do something big for her; you are demonstrating her that you value her more than you should and that you need to try very hard to keep her.

    1. I am going to have to read this article in full… but I wanted to make a quick comment. The “I love you” was not the trigger. You had no control, she was controlling you the whole time (99% of most guys). The “I love you” was confirmation her control was WORKING, not that she beat you. Think on this deeply.
      Thus she did not suddenly start to challenge you or see you as just another guy after the ILY, she was acting on CONFIRMATION of the power dynamic she was already in the process of setting up. It goes something like this.
      “Hmmm… cute guy. Reacts to my boobs. Let’s see how much love I can give him. Yup, he’s swallowing it hook, line and sinker. I think he wants to say it, but is afraid to. Three more weeks and I should have it, all the signs are there. Once he says it, I can push to see just how much control I have and see how far I can break him for my use.”
      I lot of guys think the bliss test is a challenge to the guys power he has given up with an ILY or some big act of declaration of feeling. It’s not. It’s a woman ramping up control and testing just how far she already has you hooked.
      If you are a man with full power in a relationship, you will never get the bliss test. She is too afraid of losing you. What you might get is her trying to assert herself and get recognition by you deferring some authority or choice to her, but it will never be an open challenge.
      Girls who openly challenge you were already in control, from the first time you met. Think on this deeply.

  21. I can explain why chicks do the “bliss” shit test: it’s pure hypergamy.
    We’ve been told that men are the ones “afraid” of commitment, but the truth is that women are actually even more reticent to commit and stay committed. Shit tests are a chick’s way of testing you to see if you are worthy of her commitment (such as it is).
    If you, as the guy, have hit the “bliss” state where everything is going along nicely and harmoniously, then you feel good about things. But that same state translates like something closer to stagnation for a chick. Remember, she feeds off the drama, the push and pull. A guy’s blissful harmony of relaxed, in sync relationship is a desert wasteland totally barren of hamster food for a chick. Yes, its good and enjoyable, but her drama quota isn’t being met. Thus: she starts shit-testing and other ways of acting out to get the drama going again.
    Along the same lines, if the guy does something “big” like plan a trip or suggest moving in together, then what he is really doing (at least to the hamster) is taking the relationship to the next level. This means the chick has to decide whether the guy is worthy of her going to that next level with him. Result: shit-tests. This is hypergamy in action. She has already ascertained that the guy, on her internal hamster hypergamy meter, is worthy of dating long-term, but before she takes the next step, she has to pull out the hypergamy meter (shit-tests, etc.) and decide if his value is high enough for her to go further or not.

    1. And thus you should never initiate the cohabitation-talk. Or marriage, children or those kind of bliss-subjects. Because they also show insecurity of your part.

      1. Cohabitation is a much bigger step to a girl’s hamster than it is to a guy. Sometimes the girl herself doesn’t even realize how big a deal it is to her hamster.

        1. Explain why it is a bigger deal. Because for both sexes it’s not a permanent deal nowadays.

        2. I’m not 100% sure. At least a part of the reason, I think, that its a bigger deal for the hamster is because the hamster knows the truth. The hamster has rationalized all the girl’s flaws, and craziness, and skeletons in her closet, and told her she is this person who doesn’t have these flaws or that they aren’t really flaws, or whatever.
          Moving in together makes her a lot more vulnerable to having to face reality. It makes it more likely that those flaws and shit she is hiding (even from herself) will be exposed to the guy. Worse than that, if her shit is exposed to the guy, he might just reflect it back to her in a way that might make her have to face it.
          Of course, all that really means is more work for the hamster to rationalize all that shit even more.
          I also think part of it is because most women have a lot of secretive shit going on, and moving in together makes it harder for them to hide that shit.

    2. In order to do away with drama and shit test is having multiple open relationships, and the women should know about the others. This way, there is no way for her to shit test you. If she accepted her place in the harem, there is absolutely no point for her to act up. This is the only way to have a peaceful and balanced life as a man.

  22. TLDR version: women will “shi-test” you. Ignore it or dump her.
    That’s all you’re saying. Why did you make it so long?

    1. Stop AMOGing the author. A lot of writing here is for guys who don’t grasp the fundamentals yet. Further, he was giving fairly universal examples to work with.

      1. actually, this article opened my eyes to something that I have seen though never really registered clear for me. I thought this was one of the better relationship articles in a long time.

        1. I tell you, after I proposed, my wife went aloof for a few weeks. I don’t think it was really a shit test like the article suggests, she was just deciding for herself whether or not to commit. Once that decision was made up in her mind, things were good again. Keep in mind that they are like children and maintain frame even when their behavior is bad, and you will do well.

        2. I just met a girl we fucked like animals and I feel the tingles. coming here and reading the article and all the guy’s comments keeps me from making an emotional decision

        3. That is one of the things this site is best for. Keep your emotions away. If you just met a girl and she curled your toes in bed right off the bat she is totally fucking damaged. Trust me, I have been fucking damaged women for 30 years now. I like them. I don’t see anything wrong with that. But if you bring your feelings there you deserve what you get. No one ever said “boy that girl who drunkenly licked my asshole 3 hours after meeting me sure surprised me when she started acting slutty”

        4. dude you are so right. this girl wears whatever I tell her to I love dressing her up and fucking her. she used to be abused she told me, bad childhood, no father, drugs, partying… but now she is sober and at only 21 she is hot as hell. I couldn’t belive she smoked and took drugs her body didn’t age. anyway I know I can not LTR with all those red flags but the sex so good she literaly cums 5 or 6 times each session. tit jobs make her cum even. so yeah I knew I was fucking up by trying to get all cozy with her and even considering her want to settle down and have kids. thanks guys. I’ll go fuck her with a condom later today. always flush that shit too

        6. I am absolutely saying that. I am also saying that while there must be some first time that a woman fucks the shit out of a guy she just met, it is a rare occurrence and never happens just once.

        7. I have to admit, I enjoy having a girl that likes me to dress her like a Barbie however I want. That can be pretty fucking hot.

        8. She gave me a blowjob in the parking lot 45 minutes after I was introduced to her. I’m *certain* that she’s a reliable, faithful type of woman. Sign me up!

        9. You should def be fucking her…lol….she is prime fucking material but yeah, copping feelz aint leading to a good place. “abused” “bad childhood” bla bla bla. Next time she starts to tell you her sad story put your dick in her mouth. She tells you this because abuse turns her on. Women who were abused who do not want to be abused hide it. Sounds like what she needs is a good slap in the teeth and to be choked out on a cock when she starts flapping her guyms about her sob story. Trust me, give this bish no quarter because you will get none.

        11. lol I knew that shit which you speak. when she took off my belt I grabbed it wrapped it around her neck and chocked her while I fucked her ass. she came and purred like a kitten after. just the other day I noticed myself breaking frame, texting her last and telling her I “couldn’t wait to see her again” I gotta put a stop to that and already be looking for more and keep her on the side. I make music and she is already promoting for me and introducing people (including girls) to me. gotta stay in frame boys but really this is an exciting time for me. my first 9 and I’m doing it how I want so far. I got a studio in the city where I make my art/music and I want to bring back girls to draw and fuck. so far I got her and 1 before I’m looking to build a harem…

        12. I love it so much. I will buy girls lingerie because I want to fuck them in it. bought one for that girl she told it was the first time
          a guy did that. is that for real? guys don’t dress up their girls?

        13. enjoy. don’t get rid of her until you get a threeway. There is no better feeling then when they go out and pick up the girl and deliver her.
          When you say “the city” I am assuming you mean NYC because I categorically deny the existence of other cities.

        14. see I went out once with her but I didn’t hit on other chicks or anything. is that it? just flirt and dance with other girls and she’ll come over and soon I’ll have 2?

        15. Fuck that noise. Fuck her within an inch of her life and when she is shaking on the bed just tell her she isn’t getting more of that good dick until you brings you a gift. I usually say that I just want to watch a girl eat my cum out of her twat or that I want two girls to blow me as a reward “but she didn’t get the cock, that’s only for you.” Lol, like I am not fucking her once the situation presents itself. If she is doing the things you say then she is very much like a great number of the women I play with. She will bring you what you ask her for and you can lay in bed and have a drink waiting for the doorbell to ring.

        16. if that’s the case then call me your padiwan lolknee. I’ll harden my frame and let you know how it goes. really though this site and comments got me here from jacking off 5 times a day to hentai a few years back. ever since elliot Roger when I foud this site and starting bring exactally opposite of him.

        17. You draw and have a studio? My man, that’s a golden ticket to pum pum town! Art school (sluts) chicks should be one of your targets because they’ll do anyyyyyyyyyyyyyything!

        18. I am always afraid of mattress girls with art school chicks, though interestingly I have noticed that this new girl even though surrounded by leftist betas loves the fact I pack heat 24/7. but still, they can always cry rape later though I have a suspicion it is only to beta/omegas

        19. Lingerie shopping is cool, it’s the only real kind of shopping I’ll do with a woman. Ordering her to try this, or that, having others watch this totally submissive act on her part, her being shockingly hot and just cooing and winking and being coy and “Would you like this on me?” can be pretty intoxicating. Throw in “trying out” a few whipping crops on her backside and her going “oooh!” and giggling. Dig it man, dig it.
          Guess I’m just a romantic at heart.

        20. Elliot Rodgers is how I found Stephan Molyneux and his philosophy show. That lead me to learning a lot of Hard core red pill truths!

        21. A lot of guys have no idea how hot a lot of women get knowing that you pack heat. Some scoff, but with a good number of women, you’ve just planted a flag directly in her vagina when she finds out.

        22. Elliot Roger brought you here???
          That’s very interesting.
          I often think about his “manifesto”.
          He was a sick, effeminate, murderous f*ck, but I do agree with his premise that decent males should be entitled to females. In the end, he was far from “decent”, but his idea on the subject remains a valid one. I think the 50s would have been a much better time to live. Or the Roman Empire. I would take either one.

        23. I found it because he and other incels hated the manosphere and so I looked up the manosphere in Google and found some cool sites. fuck that guy. but I felt I could have been like him. I used to be a complete self absorbed self conscious pussy beta faggot

        24. dude I am a romantic too and the ladies love it. romance is dressing them sexy and fucking them good. love going shopping and having them try stuff on for me. and the best part is all the women working and shopping are eyeing me because they know how bad ass it is that I’m having her try on stuff I’m going to fuck her in later. it’s fun for them.

        25. I have seen this word, “incel”, lately and did not not what it meant. Your post made me google it. Incel = involuntary celibate.
          Never knew that. I suppose I was an “incel” until my jr year in college, when I was 20. Then I became a hard drinking whore chaser. It’s not great, but not so bad either. Beats the hell out of being an “incel”…or a chronic masturbater…

        26. That’s true, they only cry false rape when they feel “gamed” by lesser betas. Don’t let that discourage you as nowadays many chicks call themselves feminist because it’s chick and in fashion to do so. The herd mentality renders them powerless in the case of group think given that every cool, sexy celebrity has labelled themselves that.

    1. Men have been told that helping with doing chores will increase the amount of sex. But the reality is that women will disrespect you when you do to much female chores. Vacuuming once, ok. But ironing? Forget it.

      2. There is a balance. If you hang out and play video games while she is doing chores, she will resent you. If you do more than half the house chores while at home, she will disrespect you. Solution? go home and actively play ball with the kids while she gets dinner ready. If you are roped into cleaning up EVERYONE is cleaning up.

        1. I also point out that while I’m at work for 9 hours that day her job is to manage the house. I also handle all outside chores and take out the garbage and will help with the dishes

        2. Outside chores are questionable. Young kids are in charge of feeding the dog and chickens, oldest boy has the lawn. I do the repairs, and will call on help if needed.

        3. My 7 year old daughter feeds the animals. My son is 2 so a little small for yard work but he loves to ride with me when I mow. Little does he know what’s in store for him in about 8 years…..
          Just a side note. I started cutting grass at home when I was about 12. I still cut my dad’s grass. I see it as my duty as a good son and will hopefully pass that sense of duty on to my boy.

        4. If you make 100% of the money, she should do 100% of the house work, and give you a blow job before going to sleep.

        5. So you work all day and then she expects you to do stuff around the house?
          When she brings in as much money as I do, I’ll agree to that.

      3. Ha, I don’t do the laundry but I iron my own stuff. My wife wears scrubs to work so never learned how to iron a shirt. I have been doing it for 15 years so can do it without looking.

      4. Take absolutely everything you are being told, reverse it and now you’re onto something.

  24. The bliss test comes down to biology. Remember our modern lifestyle distracts us, or allows us to avoid, or perspone the purpose of a blissful relationship; family, babies. I realize my girlfriend had been shit testing me through the relationship for the mother of all test, the moment she was pregnant. Dear god!!! She through everything she had at me; you don’t love me, you are going to leave me, I lost the baby, etc. The funny thing was she knew what she was doing but couldn’t stop herself. She said her emotions were going haywire. She said her body and mind wasn’t her own anymore. It makes sense, she wants to know during the bliss test, that you love her sufficiently, that you can put up and responde to her emotional storms for the 9 months of pregnancy. She can’t afford to get pregnant with a guy who will break at the more critical moment. To pass the test, be strong, be calm, reassure her, and don’t let it faze you. Its the test of your commitment to her, not that you aren’t good enough.

  25. If any of you guys don’t believe this article, you are kidding yourself. This is 100% true. My ex-wife would go into full anxiety/panic mode the day before a trip. The trip to the airport was always a hell trip. She was one of those idiots who would stand in line for 30 minutes to get 20 feet closer to the exit (while I would sit and read the paper and drink my coffee). She got so out of control one time that I aborted a vacation while changing planes in Atlanta. I went to the ticket counter and bought a return ticket for myself and flew back by myself. Eventually, we started taking separate vacations because she was such a horror to travel with (and she only wanted to visit her mother or go to the beach).

      1. Also sounds like Steve H needs to watch Eddie Murphy’s Raw bit about separate vacations and wives going to the beach alone.

        2. Eddie Murphy Raw was not only funny, but that shit was chock full of hardcore Red Pill truth.

        4. I vaguely remember it.
          One skit in particular.
          Where he was making fun of a kid “on the welfare” and then he dropped an ice cream, or something.

        5. I highly recommend watching it again. Funny as shit. The ice cream thing was funny, as was the “better than McDonald’s?” hamburgers his momma used to make.

    2. “wanted to visit her mother…”
      That’s a vacation?
      For me that would be a trip to hell, or Mordor at the very least.

  26. “Please, do leave a comment below if you have a deeper understanding of this than I do.”
    Here you go kyle.
    What you describe in your article is a classic move. You did up the beta-boy vibes and this did reduce her sexual attraction (the alpha man vibes) towards you.
    Now she is testing you to see if you are truely the man she fell in love with or just a beta-sucker-future-to-be-ex-and-orbiter who posed as an alpha man and just now did show his true self.
    Hopefull you are still with me, as this was a tiny bit complicated. Welcome to the world of women-think my friend.
    The above is also the answer to “That’s because the relationship up until marriage is relatively blissful.” There is no bigger beta-vibe than a disney-marriage. You have to be a kick-ass alpha to maintain a good sexual attraction after such a betafeast.
    There are ways and it can be done, but they are not the “common” thing. All this diamond ring, kneel on the ground, 10 000$ spending is a surefire way to get her gina dry as a desert in no time.
    “It doesn’t matter how good your game is or how you have the relationship set up.”
    This is false. Stone cold wrong. To make it simple lets go back to basic maths.
    You have been the asshole of the century, she is proud of you. You fucked her 3 times a week for the last 2 years, making sure she cums several times each and every week. You have given her opportunity (dread game) to be 100% sure you can easily bang other girls. Maybe you did this and she knows it.
    Now your alpha-sexy-dominator vibes are at 10 000 points.
    One morning you roll over in bed, grab her boobs, fuck her without saying a word and then do a casual. “You are ok. I realy like your boobs and your ass. I want to fuck you for the rest of my life. Lets get married”.
    Even if this an alpha way to do it….you just earned yourself 1000 beta points.
    Later that same month she shows you a $2000 wedding dress her BFF suggested. You smirk and point at a $500 wedding dress. Short. Only covering half-her-upper-thigh. “No” you say – you will be wearing this. Your long legs looks sexy and I want to bend you over the table and fuck you from behind while our guests are in the other room.”
    Again, maybe the most alpha way to buy her a wedding dress. Still. You got another 500 beta points. You bought her a wedding dress and no matter how you do it – it is beta. Sure, Mr no-balls-beta would have earned 100 000 beta points instead of 500 but some points you will get.
    This goes on and on. The relationship will remain full of tension, energy with frequent and good sex as long as your alpha vibes have considerably more points than your beta vibes.
    Beta vibes kill her sex drive.

    2. “There are ways and it can be done, but they are not the “common” thing. All this diamond ring, kneel on the ground, 10 000$ spending is a surefire way to get her gina dry as a desert in no time.”
      I negotiated a purchase price direct with her mom via an interpreter.
      Took us all weekend to haggle over the price.
      No expense spared for the wedding day, I bought two new outfits for her $5 each, and an expensive wedding meal $1 each.

      1. Nice. In exotic places things can be a bit different than they are in pampered and decadent US/EU countries.
        Where true danger and true poverty exist, the beta vibes are much more valued. You can be a beta-provider AND have the wife respect you AND a good sex life.
        In the west you are on the save side with 70% alpha and 30% beta max. More than that and your sex-life will suffer. More than 50% beta and you will get divorce raped down the road. Its difficult for most western males with an office job to even get 30% alpha done. Big problem.

  27. Say it with me, everyone: “no hymen, no diamond.” Yes, AWALT…but the frequency and amplitude of these things is much reduced when you buy it new rather than used.

  28. The more I read these articles the more I wonder what the fuck is the point of even bothering with relationships with women when I could just pay for a prostitute. Even reproducing can be done without a relationship via a sperm bank. What is the point anymore to marriage if your not religious?

    1. The man has zero benefit from getting married. Women are the ones that benefit 100%. And yet men continue to stick their balls in the wood chipper. smh.

  29. It’s about security and respect. A woman is not going to feel secure with a man she can’t respect no matter what his material possessions are.

    1. The state gives them a greater security and respect nowadays so men cannot compete.

  30. Now that the real comments about the article have been made, I have to make this observation. The author is a top notch writer who offers great advice, but it would suck to have his name. Kyle Trouble. It totally destroys the ability to give a girl a wink and a caddish grin and say “Trouble is my middle name!” All Kyle can do when that opportunity arises is gnash his teeth, throw his fists to the air and curse fate.

  31. This is actually the method I employed in finding Wife 2.0: pressure towards commitment early and often. Forces them to unleash the crazy sooner rather than later. Again, AWALT, so this allows you to see what you’re dealing with. In my case, my future bride made plans to introduce me to her friends without consulting me- I nuked that with a one-sentence text. She proceeded to apologize profusely and listened without interruption when we spoke a day later. She knew that she’d done wrong and wasn’t going to put a front- all key indicators that kept me from walking away. Remember, we’re looking for sex and they’re looking for commitment- the tests should most definitely run both ways. If what you’re looking for is a quality woman, you can save yourself some time, money, and energy with an artificially induced stressor.

  33. Just like how a girl can go from bangable to “meh” all by gaining a few pounds… so too can a man go from outwardly successful to down-and-out by losing his frame/confidence (whether that is due to an injury, job loss, money loss, any type of distress)
    With that in mind… it doesn’t bother me that my lady tests me every now and again to make sure she’s with a guy that’s worth her time. I do the same thing by reminding her to focus on her health and making sure she hits the gym regularly. Give and take… like any relationship should be.
    I think a lot of men get so focused on finding their “good girl” that they often forget that no matter how good her upbringing/family-values are… she’s still a girl, and will behave as such. Likewise, we’re still men, and must behave as such.

  34. A simple thing to do – DON’T GET MARRIED! Sure, you can do the Church thing, or be long-term “partners” but don’t sign no marriage license. The reason men succumb to women’s wishes is because they are scared about divorce, and how a woman can profit off that divorce. Simply don’t allow yourself to be in that situation. She wants to get married? Fine – exchange your vows, give her a ring, but do not sign no damn paperwork that she could use against you in the future.

    1. You’re goddamn right.
      But a huge amount of guys won’t just get that.
      Well, they will get it…after they got divorce-raped.

      1. Wrong. You are in a relationship and live together, you are considered married by the State and all laws apply.
        Moreover, I’m not sure if this is in the U.S, I think it’s U.K but a woman can now sue you if you promised marriage and then you backed out of it.
        You have no idea what the gynocentric laws ca do to you.
        And then there’s this other bit. No woman will live with you if you don’t want to have children. Ever. Once children are in play, you may as well cut your balls off, hand them to her so she can carry them around in her purse.

        1. Each state is different. It’s best to consult your local laws before moving in with anyone.

    1. I met mine (2nd) and married her within 3 weeks, so no time for moving in or engagement. Two out of three ain’t bad!

  36. Yeah, I hear all the same things in TRP in regard to “Don’t get married.”
    Frankly, for a person new to TRP and game, this is correct. As mastery is gained, you have far more risk management tools and can use those effectively. Then there are the next steps of LTR, marriage, and children.
    I understand why many TRP’ers try to hold this rule firm. Many have come from nuked marriages or relationships. Many had no idea of the nature of women. It’s easy to have a hard and fast rule of never marry.
    As Roosh discovered, mastery eventually gets boring, and new challenges are needed, new goals are set, etc.
    Managing a marriage and children in a pro-Western civilization way is a greater challenge, and it takes an expanded Risk Management toolkit and a definite set of goals.
    As a pre-emptive nuke to the standard “You’re gonna get divorce raped haha” crowd, let me point out one very historical axiom:
    Your purpose for your race, culture, and nation is to breed. If you fail to breed, the typical use of such a man was as a soldier, to die for those who had bred or will breed so that they could breed in peace.
    The future is won by the side that brings the most children with the same purpose.
    Get busy doing one or the other.

    1. The thing that bugs me about the “you’re gonna get divorce raped crowd” is that you have control of the situation. In my situation (six young kids, wife stays home), I have very little fear of divorce rape, despite my nuts hanging out on a limb. The reason is we get along very well, she is kept busy with homeschooling, we both live moral lives, she was a virgin on wedding night, we go to church regularly, we continuously work to improve our marriage….etc. The average American has about a 60% success rate, people with our lifestyle have upwards of 95%. I have a bigger fear of one of us dying prior to raising the kids.

      1. Glad it’s working for you Jim. Hope it stays that way. Unfortunately I’ve seen even the most virginal, home schooled, pew jumping holy roller chicks turn into raging sluts and walk out on their husbands and families. I don’t know if they picked up a copy of Eat, Pray, Love. 50 Shades of Grey, or Sisterhood of the Traveling Pants, but sometimes a guy just never saw it coming.

      2. Yeah, me too ….. it didn’t help when she hit menopause …. personality change and divorce.

      3. Jim, like politiacorrecta- I hope it keeps working.
        When things were going well, I could never have imagined that the mom who loved and did so much for her kids, was active in the church etc, would be the one to direct the lawyer to change our agreement to my having full custody on the day it was signed.
        Funny in that I thought that might spark an epiphany of some sort about what she was doing. That distance from her kids had become a goal.

      5. Good for you hope it works out in the long run – when I fisted started work I worked with a young woman who grew up in the church crowd converted a “bad boy” into the church crowd, married him then ditched him to become a “bikies mole” – that’s a no joke story she is now a smoking bikie gang girl – the former husband is now a missionary in a third world country.

    2. “Your purpose for your race, culture, and nation is to breed.”
      You’re fucked …. you’ve bought the propaganda package.
      Fuck my white race, fuck my cucked English nation, and fuck my feminist culture ….. I don’t need that shit. I’m out of there!

    3. You’ve been “brainwashed” the western man has been screwed over big time once the world was relatively safe most modern conveniences were invented and perfected – Now have a look at the world since the Seventies Western countries have exploded their debt mainly for the hand out mentality, European Empires have retreated from all of what they took Centuries to build up just look at what a mess Africa is now without white rule which has now come back to bite Europe on the bum as hordes rape pillage and murder their way into Europe – You need to face up to reality

  37. Most friendships women have with other women ends with backstabbing, they are subconsciously constructing a narrative based on this. They’ll destroy their relationship, and then say ‘I knew he would betray me all along’. Then she’ll be talking to some beta simp later about how she just got out of an ‘abusive’ relationship. In reality she is blindly following her emotions, but this is how she’ll frame it in her mind to minimize cognitive dissonance.

  38. I really can’t relate to the whole “shit test test” theory anymore. There was a time, but now I’m the giver of 95% of shit test because I am so well aware of how much I can bring into a woman’s life now that I want to make sure I’m not wasting my time. The “trip” example here was just an expirience for me. Everything was great until we started planning the trip. As soon as we did I couldn’t help but think “am I really about to commit to a trip with this girl? Instead of alone where I have freedom” and I began testing her, constantly seeing if I wasn’t making a mistake. If she would of tested me at that time she would’ve been out, and because she felt that from my frame she never did. I began asking her “how many guys she had been with, if she’s ever had a ONS, slept with someone to “advance” in life, and many other questions”. All questions I hadn’t given much attention to prior. This notion of the shit test is for the men still mastering their frame, i’m the giver of 95% of shit test. A girls always trying to impress me and prove that I should stay with them. It’s not like this at all.. As one develops there game further and inner strength they’ll see this come to roost. If they’re testing you, they believe they are still the prize and are qualifying that you’re good enough for them. But like I always tell guys, what is a woman truly bringing into your life that’s irreplaceable. She cooks, she cleans, cuts your finger and toe nails? Fucks you? Makes you feel good? Is that not replaceable? We have to get out of the Hollywood romance movie. In the times of feminist mindsets masculine men are truly the prize ; there is no reason any woman should be testing you. And no reason you should be tolerating it. Not today..

    1. Why would you take a girl on a trip?
      If it’s an adventure trip, they just slow you down and limit what you can do.
      If it’s a beach holiday relaxing type trip, there are already plenty of girls on the beach.
      Don’t waste your money on transporting the goods.

      1. You really don’t seem to grasp how human relationships work. This isn’t a diss, you are who you are, but you’re totally unqualified to dispense any kind of advice related to relationships that are not money based.

      2. I definitely wasn’t paying for any of her expenses. If she want to work she is going to contribute to the expiriences she wants to have. But just the “idea” along with bringing sand to the beach was enough to get me rattled. Taking that first trip in “her mind” is signifying that you’re taking her serious.

  39. She may say she’s not a feminist, but that ideology has likely seeped into her subconscious. Use it to test her back: split dinner bills, do own laundry etc.
    This is setting up the structure in which she has to treat you as an equal, instead of feminine concept of obligation. Of course you may have to endure this period when it seems it’s always push and pull but eventually you will wear her down by maintaining this simple concept: respect is earned.

  40. I think girls just get entitled when you start doing nice things for them. It’s a slippery slope until you have spoiled them rotten and they appreciate nothing you do. Got to always stay cognizant of positive reinforcement and negative reinforcement and make sure how you’re treating them ties to her behavior.

  41. I can’t neither tell for sure why, but it’s true. A day before my birthday and in my 22 birthday, a couple days ago, I got mad at him for stupid things. I couldn’t control myself. He did everything right.
    I’m younger than him (he’s 31) so he knows I’m immature sometimes (but mature most of the time) We have had situations like this a couple of times but he never lose control and that terrifies me because makes a girl believe she’s not so important to him because is acting cold and collected. Yes after his reaction last time, I swear to never act like a brat just for the sake of it.

    1. “I got mad at him for stupid things. I couldn’t control myself.”
      You are batshit crazy. All of you women. You should be fucking medicated and sedated all day long.
      You destroy men’s lives with your stupidity and “feelings”.

    2. Sounds like he’s doing it right. If you throw a little foot stomping tantrum and he doesn’t react then you are in fact not in control of him, and you should (and clearly do) understand that. He’s the man and he’s demonstrating that, so fly right and hang on to him if you have common sense.

  42. Women are absolutely insane creatures. Fuck their shit tests. As soon as they start, dump without mercy. No matter what, it’s always on men to fix and do everything… Fuck this shit!

  43. Women also like to make one of their many,many issues the Man’s problem. Here’s a hint ladies # Keep it to yourself. You don’t listen and I am sick to the back teeth of telling you how to fix the situation YOUR intense narcissism has gotten you in to. Stop taking soft sick days off work while the guys in the workplace have to carry your workload. Stop complaining about dishes being undone when you are not prepared to do them yourself. Quit casting judgement on other people because you ain’t exactly perfect either. Stop bitching about people then by nice as pie to their faces, it’s hypocritical, shallow and galling to watch. It’s a woman’s world due to the blinkers feminism has put on the world. The game is now up ladies…

  44. What’s funny about shit tests is they reveal the low self-worth and self-sabotaging nature of women. They say they want a good man, then when they get one they’ll shit test him until he either leaves her or he becomes a broken shell of a man.
    I understand that this is because of hypergamy (Women always wanting to trade up), so they have to make sure you’re made of the right stuff. But honestly they’re just putting their worst foot forward, and if you still want to be with them after whatever shit show they put on then they’ll respect you less for it.
    This is why I’ve honestly been turned off to dating for the past year or so. I spent the first 25 years of my life as a doormat who would take any kind of abuse from a woman. Then I focused on self-improvement to get me out of that funk, and it did wonders for preserving my self-worth. The only problem is when you become a better man the shit tests get worse – I think the girls can tell that I’m not a natural despite my self-improvement, so the shit tests come early and they come on strong. So if being a better person means more shit tests then I can’t really deal with it. It’s funny, I’ve gotten to a point now where it’s easier for me to be single, and being with a woman actually lowers my quality of life because I don’t suffer fools gladly anymore, and shit tests are bad behavior (Albeit natural for women).

  45. this is what the old timers call “never stop courting your wife”
    this is what I call the michael jordan playing baseball phase of my game, I’m unquestionably great at this shit and am just flat out tired of playing. it’s just easier to to have 100 3 month relationships with different women at once instead of a 100 year relationship with 1 woman. I get bored with women and their shit man, especially one at a time.

  46. On topic I would like to say; I wasn’t married a week when the shit tests started like nobody’s business. It took a couple of weeks to find out what the real problem was and fix it. After that the tests were very few and far between. 17 years of marriage was mostly bliss. Menopause ended it.
    The biggest mistake of my life was when I was dating 3 different girls on a regular basis. They would do anything I wanted. For some reason I told myself I had to make a choice; things could not go on this way. Well everybody knows I chose the wrong one and ended up with none. Live and learn.

    1. Menopause ended my 30 year marriage too, I was with her from age 19 to age 50.
      You didn’t choose the wrong one, nobody can predict the effects of menopause.
      Absolutely no information on the effects of menopause on the internet either.
      I spoke to a woman who dealt with the effects of menopause after my 50 year old wife decided to hate me. She said, “menopause often has major and irreversible changes or a woman’s personality, I have never met any woman where those changes were for the good. Essentially your wife post menopause, is an entirely different person to the person you loved and married. The new person doesn’t like you and never will like you. Stop wasting your time trying to fix something that can’t be fixed, and find someone else that likes you.”
      Best advice I ever got!
      Now, new Asian wife half my age, new son 5 years old, never saw or spoke with the previous wife or our 4 children after the divorce. Nearly 10 years ago.
      Move on, enjoy life.

      1. Those were two different stories. I still love my wife deeply but expect no rematch and have moved on. But, I have made a very deep study of menopause and continue to do so. I have found a number of very effective tools which are not generally known. I have also seen some men get through it with their marriage intact and are glad to keep their wife. The sad fact is that many marriages will not survive and I have to agree with P.J.’s solution. Asian women, especially philipinos and Thai, are generally very loyal and loving. Just don’t introduce them to Wal Mart.

  49. My dearest Kyle Trouble,
    You are an idiot and thus you do not understand the biological part. The reason many females push their mates at the beginning of a relationship is to assess their endurance of relationship stress as a precaution against future hardship. This is an evolved measure. Id est, should a man receive interest from a more attractive female, she wants to ensure he won’t leave her for that one. She tests his commitment to the relationship by testing his boundaries. If the boundaries are flexible then the test is passed.
    Females do this because females who failed to do this in ancestral populations experienced collapsing relationships and thus struggled to reproduce healthy offspring absent of a committed provider. Their children oft starved and died. They are nobody’s ancestors and thus they did not contribute to human evolution and thus their behavioural patterns are not exhibited by modern humans.
    Of course, I’m not suggesting men should indefinitely cater to the infinite boundaries of females. We have our own evolved mechanisms, and thus how much nonsense we can put up with will be measured and weighed against the girl’s worth and she will receive an answer that is equal and fair.
    Also, not all women are like this. Only sluts are like this. Sluts are like this because their worth to men (based on paternal certainty) is so low that they need to secure and reinforce their relationship before commitment due to increased probability of divorce. The reason you do not know this is because you are a loser and you’ve never been with a decent girl. You’ve also never studied evolutionary psychology, obviously, and thus shouldn’t comment on human biology. You’re absolutely not qualified to do so.
    Furthermore, Europe is an Islamic shithole. Who the fuck would want to take their hussy to Italy, you dumb cunt? Grow a brain and grow some fucken balls and find a decent girl or fuck off. You deserve to be run over by a 50cc scooter and you will die from that because you are so fucken pussy. Fuck you
    Yours truly,
    Bo Batchelor

  50. My wife admitted as much when we were dating. She said she acted a certain way that pushed men away. She hated herself for it.
    This article is great news! I can go home and tell her it’s not just that’s crazy, it’s her entire species that is!

  51. The nag effect is an evolutionary tool to produce stronger men in a group. The kind of men who don’t leave these ridiculous naggers are the ones who actually have provided and have no actual reasons for the woman to nag and so they truly can laugh it off rather than casting her aside of killing her and thus having less chance of reproducing.
    Hope this helped.

    1. a redneck goes into a lawyers office, tells him he wants to file a divorce
      “Well, do you have a case?”
      “No…. but I gots a John Deere”
      “No, I mean do you have a suit?”
      “That’s what I wear to church on Sundays”
      “No, do you have some sort of grudge?”
      “Yeah, that’s where I park my John Deere”
      “No, what I am asking is…Is she a nagger or anything like that?”
      “No, but her kid is, and that is why I am filing this dayvorce!”

  52. “In the back of your mind, you’re always going to have this rooted feeling that she’s a bit unappreciative. These tests do nothing for her but make you lose respect for her.”
    Respect her ability to disregard the time, heat and pressure needed to create a diamond of a guy that is you. Divorce the idea she’s on your side, for your benefit. You’ve got to be in it for something else (legacy, I’d presume). She’s only a means to that end. All she wants is the end Alpha product. For women, making alpha sausage is dirty work. Sausage itself…yum!

    1. “These tests do nothing for her but make you lose respect for her.”
      But, will you respect me in the morning?
      I don’t respect you now, what difference will the morning make?

  53. I like your article and will comment on the trip:
    There are things you can do to mitigate your financial “risk”. This will give you an upper hand in “negotiations” re: shit tests. Offer to books hotels, rental cars etc. and have her book airfare. It is much easier to cancel hotel/rental car accommodations as opposed to airfare. If you need to tell her to knock it off or else you walk it puts you in a much easier position to walk with less risk of losing money.
    Additionally, i’d suggest booking a small weekend trip (w/ no airfare) first rather than an international one.

  54. Great! I was annoyed enough that whores were advertising here. Now we got pretty boy whores.

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