We here in the manosphere are very quick to call girls out for maintaining outsized standards. From fat girls demanding fit men with six packs to 5’2” females turning down every male south of 6’0”, we have little patience for females shooting beyond their level. We don’t do this to be “misogynistic”—we do it because we believe each partner has an obligation to work to maintain attraction in the other if they want a relationship to continue (or to even begin).
In understanding this, however, we come to understand the crux of why sites like this exist and why male self-improvement is important. At their core, sites like ROK are designed to allow men to be better equipped to do work of their own. RooshV Forum and ROK are places where we can all share means and methods on how to do that work best, with advice tailored to age group, place of residence, environment, etc. This is done because it is essential for any male concerned with his romantic life to look critically at himself and mercilessly attack the flaws that he finds. It is only through this that process that men can be kept away from the entitlement we so often criticize in some of our female peers.
Men can begin this process by asking themselves a simple question: what do you bring to the table?
This question is in reference to the work you’ve done yourself. How well groomed are you? How engaging are you in conversation? Are you funny, witty, and confident enough when engaging the women you want? Do you dress well enough to catch their eye? Are you physically fit enough to catch their eye?
The entitlement I’ve spent much time criticizing here and elsewhere in the manosphere is not entirely limited to women. I understand this because I once exhibited it myself. Young men, unaware of the realities of female attraction and unaware of how sexual repulsive many of their youthful, “beta” habits are, often express utter confusion at their lack of success with the opposite sex. Too often this confusion grows into anger and bitterness, vitriol expressed absent the necessary internal examinations necessary to build real self-improvement and success. It took me years to overcome this entitlement and begin acknowledging my faults as opposed to merely getting angry at women for not accepting them. Only then could I begin to improve and find some relief for my youthful sexual frustration.
This is a common narrative. Many young men demand dimes and find themselves in this corner of the internet lamenting their inability to attract them. The reality, however, is that these women are not obligated to be attracted to them. If you as a male are unable give an objectively favorable answer to all (or at least most) of those questions above regarding wit, confidence, conversational ability, and so on, then fine females won’t be coming around your way too often, if at all.
Pretty girls have options, and this is truer here in the USA than almost anywhere else. As is the case in all humans, incentives drive their behavior. If you’re not appealing enough to give them incentive to choose you to the exclusion of their many other options while subsequently keeping said girls as your only option, then you’ve got a problem.
Too many young men are unsure if girls think they are good enough or not. This crisis of confidence and insecurity often leads to bitterness or poorly executed negs thrown at female suitors, efforts that all too often leave entirely the wrong impression.
The mission for a young male concerned with improvement is really quite simple. Look at yourself. Find your strengths and find your faults. Adjust accordingly by playing to your strengths and shoring up your weaknesses via discourse on ROK, RVF, and similar spaces in the manosphere. Never cease to take stock of what you bring to the table, and always seek to bring more if you can. Those who are willing to endure this challenging process will see much greater romantic rewards in the future.
Read Next: Why This Site Will Always Be “Creepy”
100% On point. Good…no…GREAT to see a brother in the manosphere.
Niggers unite
Very messed up how if I go for 5’3 chicks I get turned down cause I’m 5’5. Never understood this. Anyways, I look to improve myself by getting more buff, I am cut up, but I feel a bit more size is needed, I wear suits for the time being. I need to get more cash flow to get a better car. Have to project and make my voice super forceful, it is forceful, but I think a bit more force will offset my lack in height an allow me to be seen as equally alpha as a dude who is 6’0. But I know that everytime I open a chick they react very warmly, I just need to build on it more to get her panties wet. my physicla escalaton needs ot improve. I feel that from dating my own race, asains, who are short and conservative, I sort of hold back ot build more comfort, and then when I try to game white chicks, it comes off as too placid.
Careful not to get toooo ripped – being jacked at a short height is usually a clear indication of compensation, and most people can pick up on it pretty quickly. Posture and “presence” are everything.
Having height isn’t always an advantage. In terms of physicality work not so much on a gym body. But a practical body. This is impressive (to men and women) take up something outdoors: free running, downhill or XC mountain biking, martial arts, etc. Just to be able to say, “I can… XYZ.”
Women are impressed- if they aren’t completely conceited bitches- men of accomplishment. And other men respect it.
Being short and puny like leetle boy is wors than ded. I hate parent for making me so tiny like bug. Like flee.
Go climb a skyscraper with some plungers.
The best advice I can humbly offer is to get rid of this limiting belief. I’m not tall either, and yet in the last few weeks I’ve slept with at least two significantly taller chicks. One of them must have been easily 4 inches taller than me (man, those legs and ass were quite the sight. Pity she was fucked up in the head .. LOL).
The other taller chick I started seeing recently, and we had passionate sex on our first date. She did make a little joke about the height, like quipping with a mischievous smile: “Good thing I didn’t wear high heels tonight”. I just smiled back and shrugged, and answered with: “Yeah, I know you have that defect (of being tall). But it’s OK .. I don’t expect you to be perfect.” She playfully punched my shoulder and protested that she wasn’t the one with the ‘defect’, while I just laughed and slapped her ass. Minutes later we were making out in my car like animals on heat.
Now I’m pretty new to the game and by no means some expert Casanova yet, believe me. And I don’t have any special status, fame or insane wealth to compensate. I’m not saying anything to brag, but just to make a point: if you stop making it an issue for yourself, then it won’t usually be an issue for the woman either. Normally I self select for women who are round about my height or shorter, but it just happened that there was chemistry with those taller women too. If you just treat it as a non-issue, then most often it will remain just that.
If however you have that deep down fear inside you that you are worth less just cos you lack a few inches in height, it’s gonna affect your ‘mojo’ a lot. Just don’t give a shit about it. Your focus should be on how fuckin awesome you are or will become in everything else. Give them lots of other aspects to appreciate and play to your strengths. And probably your best weapon in all cases is to be great at conversation, and cultivate that aura of relaxed poise in your interactions.
I also wouldn’t worry about the ‘over compensation’ thing if you workout. It’s never a bad thing to be in shape. If you feel it’s especially important for your confidence, then by all means keep doing it. In my mind, you would appear as an overcompensating clown only if you acted like one, like wearing stupid outfits to draw too much attention to your muscles, walking around with spread arms and flared lats, wearing short sleeves even in winter in rainy weather cos you want to show off your guns, and stupid shit like that. I’ve seen some douches like that, but if you just dress appropriately and act with poise, you’re simply a guy who’s proud enough to keep himself in shape. Who the heck says only tall motherfuckers have a right to that? LOL. Again, limiting beliefs.
So stop limiting yourself with those thoughts, go out there and slay them 🙂
Michael James needs to read this now!!!! Then Quintus, as if on cue, will deliver his manospherical autobiography on Napolean. This is gonna be a good week here on ROK!
Move to the uk, especially london. you’ll have no probs there.
Yes! even tiny girl dont want fuck midjet like me. Say i must have tiny weener that dont fit her.Maybe i get tommy gun and teach them good leson. The when famous and in jale will get love letter from hot girls and have conjugular sex all day.
OK wont use tommygun on Maria so when she see me as big thug she come for sex visit too.
IMHO, the crisis for young men comes early when they lack the training and mentorship for life, where they have a strong sense of self, community, and purpose. Chasing pussy is just one facet of this existence, but should never be the sole purpose.
There are forces at work in US society, in particular, that make many young men basket cases. Not their fault, really. They, again, lack mentors. This is where the Net comes in.
Also, there’s only so much you can do to be successful with women over the long term. One way is to distinguish yourself from the hordes, from the competition. Basic stuff. But, that might not be enough.
Think of it another way: If you have a date set up with a girl, always have a Plan B or C. If she flakes and then goes ghost, you always have something to fall back on — and thing better be something you enjoy doing and that improves you in some way.
Improvement takes precedence over pussy, every time.
Hopefully the comment section won’t be come a pissing contest of how awesome everyone is. lolz
I think about this a lot when I troll sites like POF or craigslist. I love to see how deluded some of the women are, barking off a bunch of demands while being nowhere near what a person of such calibre would be looking for. As the saying goes, water seeks it’s own level.
I do think more men need to be forward thinking in more aspects of their life. It seems like the only things people are concerned about are their next paychecks and the next useless piece of crap that they just HAVE to buy. It’s been a long time since I’ve heard a man within my network talk about the last book he read or the last time he took a class for the sake of learning.
“It’s been a long time since I’ve heard a man within my network talk about the last book he read or the last time he took a class for the sake of learning.”
They most likely don’t see the purpose or benefit in it. They’ve been trained by society to achieve, achieve, achieve. But, achievement for whom?
While I can’t fault anyone for wanting to improve themselves, doing so with the sole purpose of attracting “hot” women makes me feel somewhat uncomfortable. Sure it may work, but I wonder about the quality of such “relationships” when the woman is only attracted to a man for his looks, money, swagger, alphaness as opposed to character, ethics, morality that sort of thing. Equally, I can’t see anything good or long lasting for a man who goes for the sort of women attracted to these things. If it is just sex then I can understand, but you are dealing with actual living people and feelings here.
Most of what the early incarnations of the ‘sphere prescribes is how to get laid, pure and simple. Relationships, in all of their iterations, are usually secondary. Such as it is.
True, bad for the long term, but not for the short term — if getting laid is your primary goal at this point.
Also, the ‘sphere provides invaluable information on how women operate, contrary to what society and what women themselves will say make them tick. Even if you get laid once in a blue moon, knowing how women tick via observation carries its weight over the long term.
Lastly, the ‘sphere is about improving yourself as a man — hopefully, with women being secondary or tertiary. You can take the knowledge and mix it with morality or not. It’s entirely up to you.
Women here are not attracted to good qualities, only bad qualities.
I hear ya. Bro it’s tough being a nigger with a small dick. I buy expensive clothes and wax my head and shit but bro shorties only after them big-ass dick. Used to haveta flash my stacks in the bedroom ta get them wet. Its like I short-changed them. Fuck that. Most my homies got small peckers to an they deal with the same shit. Its like, I’m black, I gots ta be hung. Know what I’m saying.
Whiteys got it made. Everyone assumes they’re all smart and rich and shit, chicks don’t even give a fuck if they’re hung or not, still fuck them.
I swear I’m gonna stay outta the sun and shit and put that whitening cream on. Pull a honey and see if she gives me the, fuck is that?! face.
The best way to bring something to the table, to make sure you have something to offer… is to do it not for the woman, but for yourself. Be well groomed because YOU want to be. Be fit because YOU want to be. Know the good wines, smoke the good cigars, get jazzed about quality because it enhances the experience of YOUR life. These things show off in your overall character.
When you do things to better yourself simply to be more attractive to others, you’re putting the locus of your worth outside of yourself. Not only does this make you dangerously dependent on the fickle opinions of others, it’s disgustingly beta behavior women can smell a mile away. In the end, they rightly won’t respect you for it, but see you as someone who can be manipulated because of the need for external approval.
Do it for yourself, the external benefits will come naturally, without you having to try and achieve them.
BetaAlpaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlphaBetaAlpha
Spot on with the advice, but would be remiss to remind what is the central crux of the current situation.
Most men would be very happy with their SMV equal. Most women’s innate hypergamy means they want SMV+1 or better to be happy.
I’m all for guys developing game and working on personal growth, health and fitness to become more attractive. Guys are usually receptive to changing and getting better.
Now if only more women would be open to improving their game and changing their look and attitude so they bring more to the table than just a vagina.
This is something I’ve encountered in my quest for self-improvement. You better yourself dramatically and never stop striving to get better physically, intellectually, financially, etc. and you realize that many of the women you pined for in the past, don’t bring anything to the table besides their looks. You then have to step up your game even more through travel and other pursuits to find those women that are both beautiful and have some grace and personality.
“Now if only more women would be open to improving their game and changing their look and attitude so they bring more to the table than just a vagina.”
Unlikely to happen given the current state of affairs, which rewards “bad” behavior and “you go, grrrll!” uber alles. We can take it as a truism that many women are value-based and have the herd mentality, which they dare not buck for fear of social ostracism.
OTOH, the woman who has a mind of her own and can see beyond this, and realize that she shoulders half the burden of attracting and keeping a man over the long term, can do something about this. But, this kind of independent-minded woman is rare — at least during the prime of her life. The near 40-something woman who figures this out after deluding herself has done so too late.
I don’t see improvement as a worthwhile end in itself for many guys unless [email protected] gets taken care of alongside this improvement.
If improvement does not lead to [email protected], then there is no point in improving yourself. I get to see lanky, short (not that there is anything wrong with this), unemployed guys getting hot tail; I get less because I am working hard. I would have to be unemployed too (we have a great welfare state here) to have the time to chase tail. These guys are also super omega, but it seems that many girls want this here. US is the complete opposite and is super-competetive, but my accent and different culture helped a lot.
Ultimately, if greater work/improvement does not lead to greater [email protected], or any [email protected], the there’s no point in working as I’m being the [email protected] who’s getting [email protected] by everyone! So its simple, I either don’t work or I leave the UK so it can get overrun by the feckless so the country implodes socially (going on at the moment). My plan is to leave and go elsewhere and the decline I have seen in society from broken marriages and guys getting [email protected] for free is plain to see everywhere. It’s a broken society.
Then look at it this way:
You work to improve yourself and to develop resiliency. If the UK is as bad as you say it is, then your long-term plan is to leave and set up shop elsewhere — hopefully in a better area where your needs are better taken care of.
I agree that, for many men, unless pussy is factored into the mix, there’s little incentive to improve yourself. Live for today and fuck tomorrow. Then, middle age comes and the bad habits you picked up when in your teens and 20s start coming back to haunt you. You might not die young, in a hot ball of flame. You could very well end up the middle-aged schlub with 20 more years left on the odometer, hating each passing year because of wrecked health or something worse.
If nothing else, work on your health. Once it’s gone, you wish that you had it back.
In the west man has lost all value. He dont have a leg to stand when interacting with women. Unless he is rich or a celebrity he is simply just another desperate fool doing close dance game at the bar. To these women we’re worth less than dirt under their shoes.
Let’s stop being so negative now, come on …
Negative is the new real. Quit been emotional.
Well, enjoy then. You guys want some cheese with that whine?
Im not a negative person in general, but in this area this is how I view reality. If it wasnt so, blogs like this would not exist
I understand that you probably have your valid reasons to think this way. I’m not disrespecting that. But just moaning that the world sucks will not help us. So I extend a brotherly handshake to you..we are on the same team here 🙂
Yes agreed but sometimes you just need to moan 🙂
Then stop caring about what worth is when it comes to women.
What do they know…the only worth they have is their bodies and they do a great job of screwing those up.
I have leg. I like tripod with 3 leg ‘cos I’m so tiny.
I have leg. I like tripod with 3 leg ‘cos I’m so tiny.
The bottom line is, if you want a better woman, be a better man.
So what is a “better man?” Someone with a plan for life, as you can’t lead if you don’t have a goal. Someone who works both for his own interests and those of the greater society he is embedded into – like the old sailors said in climbing the ship’s rigging, “one hand the ship and one hand for yourself.” Someone who wants a woman to fulfill her goals of a loving family and is emotionally and competently able to do so.
That’s a good selection of qualities to have. It is important to bear in mind as well that showing a good side could very well turn off a chick, especially in the USA, as there are many females walking around with worms in their heads. There are a ton of skags out there who think, for example, that a dope dealing DJ is far more interesting and impressive than a doctor who saves lives. The thug loving phenomena comes to my mind right now as I write this response. But in the final analysis one has to draw their own limit to shaping who he is as a man, and be willing to forget any woman who has a truly warped view of the world. So be willing to toss aside the zombies you meet in order to get to a quality female that fits your criteria as well.
I fear that women are getting so hypergamous that the future of seduction and success with women lies not in genuine self-improvement, but in cosmetics – faking attributes of high value just long enough to obtain the desired end, typically sex.
Given how many women may avail themselves of only a fraction of men, this is a suitable short-term solution in that it gets men and women together. But past the first date or two, it will only yield disappointment for the woman and contempt for her and her choosiness by the men, obstructing the formation of healthy long term monogamous relationships.
This also assumes that women (as well as men) are intellectually savvy to see what’s going on and socially aware to look toward the long term.
It’s going rapidly to just plain hook-up culture, where men are willing to do whatever it takes to get laid, including being a thug. Being a man who has compassion for his fellow human being is something each man does so by choice. Not that it will get him laid, because it won’t, but rather as to not be among the Great Unwashed of men who would, if offered a blowjob from a skank in exchange to kill another man, would gladly take the offer. If chicks rewarded men who were decent then we would see every guy lining up to save the world. But that is not the case. In all of our “wisdom” and language and technology, is eclipsed by our growing callousness and narcissism fueled by pedestaling and catering to the whims of hormonal driven animals. It will not be too long until the Human race shows much less consideration to each other then modern day primates do in the jungle. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b26BD5KjH0
I bring a large, meaty cock to the table.
pics or it didn’t happen
Yes yes short be very bad catastrofee wors than being ded and corpse. My darlink Maria shunned me and treat like a bug then went with taller man. Maria is the finest girl who ever lived so now I cry cry cry all day the long. I even make youtoob video about it with old film and song together to go width it just two illestrat the dilemma. You see tiny man being shunned by big brute to abscond with my Maria.Look how he takes her.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lkrJg52JIVY
And if that not terible enouf this guy on right hear stole her too before.
Look Killer Joe go stealing my Marie!!!
And if that not terible enouf this guy on right hear stole her too before.
Look Killer Joe go stealing my Marie!!!
Great writing and great points about bringing something to the table before you expect rewards from life, but why does the author always use such cheesy pictures of guys who are way over the top?
Love the article! As a woman I believe there is room for growth with both makes and females. Why can we all try to be better than just average.
Sorry for my errors in my last comment.
Pandering to women, and chasing women, is an utter waste of time.