When I turned 21 I went to the Orthodox Church I was baptized in and gave my first confession, an acceptable way to apologize to God. That same night, I received a vision from God which, to the best of my interpretation, said that if I let my Christianity fall then my honor would also fall.
I still think about this vision when I casually suggest to a young girl that we should go get something to drink, and somehow find ourselves in my bedroom. Am I losing my honor?
I’m ashamed that I can’t find happiness as a Christian. I never wanted to disobey God, but I understand why Adam took the apple from Eve—life outside of game doesn’t seem to be worth living. So sweet and enticing was the siren call of easy sex that it was impossible for my heartbroken 23 year old virgin self to resist.
Thus I followed the serpent and found the secrets of game. I came to understand how emotional manipulation operated, what niche I could best score women, and how to get fast sex. I corrupted myself because I stopped believing in love.
You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall not commit adultery.’
But I tell you that anyone who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
I distinctly remember the time when I used to turn down offers for sex. If it seemed that a girl was only good for one thing then I never saw a point to the affair. Love was God’s solution, lust led to hell.
The virgin I fell in love with in college didn’t make it past her second year. She continued the charade of maintaining abstinence despite going into guys dorm rooms at 3am after receiving a phone call.
As it slowly dawned on me that for every chaste woman there were ten chaste men; that my culture actively destroyed women as love partners; that promiscuity for both sexes was promoted and rewarded; that my culture was dying with no chance of being a good place to live in my lifetime; I was faced with the unavoidable and grim conclusion: does a man want to please God in today’s world? Celibacy is his only realistic option, as it is just as sinful to be a beta who pines away for women as it is to be an alpha who plows through them.
Who can live a life without sexual intimacy? The very idea is inhuman. To be a good Christian is therefore super human. If celibacy is what it takes to be a good Christian today, then I will never be a good Christian. I am not strong enough for that.
Merry Christmas, everyone.
Read Next: The Perfect Woman
If you’re getting “visions from God”, you need to visit a psychiatrist.
God doesn’t exist, and living your life in a constant state of guilt because you worry about pissing off a fictitious entity is only going to screw up your mind even more. Get real.
Thank you for your thoughtful and measured contribution to the conversation.
I get those feels sometimes, even though I turned my back on the church in my early teens. Not that I am pissing off God, per say, because I’m not sure he’s paying attention, if he’s there. What makes me feel better is this: an alpha lifestyle/attitude/behavior makes women feel good and safe. They don’t feel those feels with betas. So by learning game, in some weird way, you are giving the women you game security, even when you don’t stick around. If God wanted women and men to be good and chaste and loving, he would have made women (the gatekeepers to sexuality) attracted to those qualities. Why would he create beings whose biological instincts are in constant diametric opposition to its conscious thoughts? Wouldn’t that be a mistake?
The problem is that “those alpha qualities” are completely culturally determined. What’s alpha in one society is beta in another. Roosh writes about this a lot – how much game varies from one culture to another.
In another distant land and time, it was alpha to be a strong Christian man.
I think we know what group we can blame for this one…
It rhymes with lemon-ists
They are not wholly culturally determined. Some things are universal – you’re not afraid, not needy, and so on.
Maybe it was Roosh who said that you basically only need to be Interesting and Cool – it just varies by culture, and subculture, what constitutes those things.
A lot of points to unpack here:
1) Re: alpha behavior. Read the blog “Dave in Hawaii” about being alpha in relationships and how it keeps women in line and in love during relationships. (Heartiste quoted him a lot a couple years ago.)
2) Re: Biblical precepts and rules are present to guide us in limiting our human instincts. Even when we are commanded to be “good and chaste”, it can still be presented as a challenge to overcome “baser” instincts.
3) Re: Women’s sexual drives and alpha behavior. Even if you’re waiting on sex for a long while, you can still be a ‘alpha’ (even by western standards), if you present a strong, confident, commanding front to women. Women will respond positively. Simply be upfront and confident when you tell her that she won’t be getting your dick until well into the relationship, because she needs to earn it. Don’t be apologetic about it.
The church’s inability to provide guidance for men in a world where traditional relationships are dying is letting a lot of men down. Dalrock has that beat covered.
http://dalrock.wordpress.com/
Samseau, I recommend reading some N. T. Wright. tl;dr: being part of the kingdom is not about following a set of rules, or mouthing the script from the Hebrew and Greek scriptures. It’s about fealty, allegiance to the king of the kingdom. When Odysseus returned to Ithaca, he had little difficulty identifying those servants who had remained faithful.
Loyalty is shown by obeying rules. I’m not a good rule follower.
First time i read through that no-date challenge, Samseau. fantastic. what were the results of your three dates till sex challenge?
http://www.rooshvforum.com/thread-10228.html
lol it was as i expected but still an interesting read nonetheless.
for others the short answer is. want to develop ltrs? bang ’em fast. want fast sex? go for the bang as soon as possible
The most important aspect of Christianity isn’t love for mankind, or following the law. The most important aspect of Christianity is obedience to God and the acceptance of Christ as your savior.
How to deal with that is up to you.
Well that would certainly fly in the face of the actual words of Christ, who, when asked what the great commandment was, answered, “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.”
Just sayin’…
I used to be the same, turning down and rejecting girls for sex and as I was “being true to my religion” my parents are die-hard religious freaks that brainwashed me into being a huge beta, however I realised at the latter stages of college the same thing you did, and took the red pill. Success came really easily as being in a Western country meant that easy sex wasn’t hard to find. Although I don’t really like the western culture too much and find it harder and harder to take women seriously anymore (More than easy bangs) my success just improves each year. It’s intriguing.
“I corrupted myself because I stopped believing in love.”
Sometimes I feel like this is exactly what happened. I started studying game the moment my ex and I split up. It’s been three years and many, many women since then. But as jaded as I’ve become, the more time that passes the more I’m almost entirely convinced that this was either who I was from the start, or at least was I was naturally going to become in life. It’s almost as if my four-year bout with love was an outlier, or some aberration rather than a taste of what “real” love is.
I’ve never been religious so I only have myself to blame for my actions. But looking back I think I’ve taken the logical path each step of the way. Even as disappointed as I am with the typical Western Woman, having seen their true, dark nature… I wouldn’t take anything back. I’d take the red pill again in a heartbeat.
“I was faced with the unavoidable and grim conclusion: does a man want to please God in today’s world?”
In our inner core yes, but I also know the many lusts men have. The strong man controls those lusts and puts that discipline to good use.
You can’t be virtuous without being tested. Being an incel makes you no more virtuous with purity than an alpha that plows through many women.
Lol you talk about the female hamster yet you follow Christianity one of the biggest hoax of all time. What an idiot. Out of all the guest posters Roosh has this guy is by far the worst. Please don’t let him post here again Roosh.
This was, by far, the most helpful and meaningful contribution thus far. You are clearly a deep and thoughtful thinker.
fools reject what fools don’t understand. I choose Christianity on pure reason.
samseau,
this piece was profound for me. moreso than anything else i have read on the manosphere. it connected to me on a deep personal level.
I’m 22, recently graduated, working, doing all the shit i have been made to do my whole life. i grew up in a religion essentially identical to yours. i have had so many opps in my life to fuck girls (good quality) and i threw those opportunities out in order to comply with my deeply ingrained religious constructs, (and perhaps my own fear). my parents are a big influence, that is a factor as well. i am not proud, or ashamed either.. to admit that i am a virgin. but i don’t know how to proceed man… searching for answers. not sure if i should try to find a ‘nice girl’ or just pick up a random (which would honestly feel like putting to waste all of these years i’ve built this shit up)
also trying to reconcile this red pill that i have recently almost OD’ed on… no hope left for that life i was told to live, pain from what i see around me w/ these girls/society in general. this factors into my perception of my job, future, everything. what the fuck is the point of playing this game? i know i might let down my parents, but at this point it is becoming more than a decision of red pill/blue pill. it is almost life and death.
i wanted to tell you thanks for writing this, truly.
I’m pretty sure foreign women are more compatible with the Christian lifestyle, but the problem is expiating out of America is like escaping a prison.
I talk a lot about matters related to this theme on my blog. I’m a 26 yr old virgin by choice and deal with many of the same questions.
definitely. and that would be ideal but it is especially difficult to break out with a corporate kind of job.
at this point i am not sure how or if i will proceed with the ‘christian’ lifestyle. it seems almost like a joke/lie to me now. especially after this red pill and a recent girl situation (similar to your story)… very good girl from a decent family, only one prior boyfriend for 4+ years.. goes out on one date to a baseball game with a loser with a shit job (granted he does have a wealthy fam) gets drunk and fucks him. now hooked on him although he wants nothing to do with her.
it confirmed in a big way this red pill i am taking. it also ripped up any remaining shred of hope i had left while going through this red pill process.
i am still in some ways, saddened.. it is not easy to accept the transformation of your reality.
also when tied to the religious aspect, the red pill, the girl, and my induction into modern american slavery have brought more into question than just marriage and women. it brings into question topics such as god, spirituality, purpose… i have analyzed these my whole life but the game has changed now.
Dear Atheists: since God in general and Christ specifically have not been disproven, it is presumptuous and ignorant to assert your rejections authoritatively, and reveals your own lack of wisdom by doing so.
Further, to suggest that any internal conflict is superfluous and unnecessary would be in error as well, as any man of wisdom knows that there is inherent value in these struggles, and those who excel at self-examination are often the most well-rounded of men.
Not gonna argue or tangle, just check yourself. A more measured approach to this sort of topic would likely serve you better, as well as the brothers here in discussion.
Anyway, Samseau, I have also had the same inner dialogues. Even the atheist PUAs come to realize that excessive promiscuity is no ‘promised land’ either. There is a very dark underbelly. It is difficult to subscribe to a faith that says abstain or marry, during a time when only Marriage 2.0 is available. I have no doubt a marriage could be conducted successfully, even in these post-modern days, but it would like launching the space shuttle. Intensive, hard-as-hell, with major amounts of efforts and spectacular possible failure.
To the man who does not wish to conduct endless short-term sexual liasons, whether it is to honor his God or simply because it isn’t working/fulfilling to him, I an only speculate that perhaps a non-state marriage would be a suitable solution. Vows and covenants, but no state certificates. In most of humanity, marriages have been exactly that. This still holds many of the perils of Marriage 2.0, and having kids presents the same problem pretty much anywhere, so I guess you have to steel yourself for the fact that there are no guarantees and no way to fully avoid risk.
If we indeed carry on with the different sexual partners throughout life, yet still wish to acknowledge a God, we can only hope that He understands, and that His grace is sufficient. The bible, near as I can tell, points to the concept that God looks at the heart of a man, that the condition of your heart is the most relevant issue when it comes to how God regards you. To that end, it would make sense to keep your heart warm and open and loving. I believe this is possible, even post-red-pill, but I do think that promiscuity necessitates a hardened and cynical heart, which would be dangerous territory. To somehow reconcile the two is, in the end, impossible, the war of the flesh against the spirit, and all that.
“Out of the abundance of the heart, the mouth speaks”
Above any sexual behavior, how do you speak? This may be a more immediate bellweather, and the thing to guard above all others, because of the immense power of the spoken word. Perhaps minding this issue most carefully would lead you to more satisfying conclusions about other areas of your life.
I disagree that promiscuity inherently implies being cynical or cold. I see it as more of a reaction to the sad state of marriage in today’s world. Cynical would imply that the person is unreasonably reactive to previous experiences, whereas in an age where the divorce rate is roughly equivalent to flipping a coin, and 70%+ of those are initiated by the unhaaaaapy women (because of their hypergamous nature), staying away from the gamble doesn’t seem unreasonable at all.
“To the man who does not wish to conduct endless short-term sexual liasons, whether it is to honor his God or simply because it isn’t working/fulfilling to him, I an only speculate that perhaps a non-state marriage would be a suitable solution. Vows and covenants, but no state certificates. In most of humanity, marriages have been exactly that. This still holds many of the perils of Marriage 2.0, and having kids presents the same problem pretty much anywhere, so I guess you have to steel yourself for the fact that there are no guarantees and no way to fully avoid risk.”
In theory a great solution, but in practice impossible because the state will just move in and declare non-state marriages as “de-facto” common law marriages.
Really!?!?
You should know our Lord Jesus Christ better by reading the New Testament; i’ve had my own sinful past, but it got me nowhere but a darkness of depression and guilt,
while gradual repentance and confession of my sins to God was like walking towards a source of great light and comfort.
What Jesus did and taught as described in the New Testament was most good and practical for me and described exactly that what this world glorifies (sexual immorality, violence, greed, human fame,etc) is sin and only plays to the hand of satan.
The following sites might be interesting to anyone seeking to know more about God, His Son Jesus Christ and how get free from any sinful addictions:
http://www.porn-free.org
http://www.settingcaptivesfree.com/courses/way-of-purity/
http://www.provenmen.org/framework/uploads/PM_StrivingForAbsolutePurity_Manual_print.pdf
May God help you escape the net of sin and lies spread throughout the whole world through any media through His Son Lord Jesus Christ.
eat a dick jesus freak
Why don’t you show him how? You appear to be the block expert.
Why be a Christian at all? Constantly worrying about sinning is not the religion of choice for me. With such a wide variety of religious paths you can take, why not choose something that encourages things that make you happy? How about a Player God, creator of Game and ruler of the Manosphere or something. That’d be sweet.
Dionysus?
‘As in Adam all die. ‘ 1 Corinthians 15:22. Note, it doesn’t say As in Eve, because I mean it’s supposed to be all her fault we’re in this mess. Uh, uh, not according to the scriptures.
Man without a moral light to guide the world results in websites like this. A secret place where men can bitch, I mean moan, about the evils of a post feminist society. Lets face it, we are All paying for your sins guys! The son of God came to pay back this debt, and part of this payback was living a life free of corrupting a woman! ( Except that Dan Brown would like us to believe otherwise). That really is superhuman, a quality that modern men are lacking, because they admit that they can’t help them selves. You continue to use woman as the scapegoat for society’s degeneration and then have the audacity to morally corrupt her.
I am not a feminist. I am trying to restore a women’s rightful place with my Stepford wife philosophy. I have the metaphorical balls to actually to do this. How many of you Alpha wannabes have the balls to reestablish Adam to his rightful place? Not many which is why the son of God had to do it for you! Feminism is a buy product of mans naturally inabilty to morally lead. Why complain? Now we know how we got here.
When your future daughters start to be corrupted by tomorrows mini you’s, what the hell are you going to do about it? You’re not actually going to have children? Okay, problem solved!
You want to restablish the alpha male within you and restore his rightful place in this world? Are you man enough? Do you have the moral fibre it takes, like the son of God did?
Because if you profess not to, sites like this will continue to grow but men will forever remain frustrated because there is not one thing you are doing to seriously right the world we live in.
I enjoy the frankness of this website, but seriously guys, you have brought the woes of the modern world upon yourselves. Your future sons and daughters will thank you for it in hell!