As a divorced father of two daughters, and a RVF active member, I see articles on raising sons (examples 1, 2, 3 and 4, all from this year alone on ROK). Raising a son is an important matter, as most of us here at ROK are boys.
But wait a minute! 50% of the population is females. Those of us who are fathers (writer included) may also have daughters. The discussions here as I mentioned, are more about sons. What about daughters?
I could sit with myself, complain, or take it to the comments section. But that is not the way the manosphere practices. So I decided to write my own list of tips, based on my know-how so far. I have been on the red-pill for three years now, and I wish to share with my fellow readers what I have learned.
It seems that raising girls is far easier than boys. Even if this is true, it is no walk in the park. It is difficult, to some extent, but can be also rewarding.
1. Teach her what guys and girls find attractive
We all know the answer to that one. But a child does not. Children are not blank slate, but they are unaware of “how the world works”. It is my responsibility as the patriarch to show them.
In order to starve the hamster in advance, I give my daughters tools and the language to understand. Kids have a very strong hamster, as do females (we all know that).
Since early times, people have used stories and myths to educate. This is truer at a young age, as they are not yet teenagers. I often use stories and examples, as kids sometime struggle with “concepts” or “genralities”.
Example: Mr. Peabody & Sherman (the movie)
Some movies illustrate red pill better than others. You also need to find one which the kids relate to. For this article I picked Mr. Peabody & Sherman. It is a fun movie, staring male protagonists which are likable.
During the movie, when the heroes go back in time to save Penny (the child who beat him up and called him names), Sherman talks of her in a “love stroke” manner. In our words – he is attracted to her.
“Why do you think he is attracted to her?” I asked my daughters. Notice how I emphasized attraction rather than “love”. Kids need to parse their environment in the right manor. If you call it love, later in life girls will have a problem separating attraction with love.
Even mean girls are converted if they find their guy Alpha
Their hamster ran as excuses came out one after the other. They dished out multiple explanations, which I will not name, but would make some us laugh.
“It is because she is pretty” I explained. “Boys are attracted to pretty girls. This is what boys prefer.” I continue, “You can see it also in your school, and that pretty girls get more attention”. They acknowledge it, as they have witnessed it firsthand. Lesson hammered in. I repeat it every time we witness it.
“Dad, were you attracted to Mom because she was pretty?” They have asked. I confirmed. They now know that beauty is important. But there is more.
Later in the movie, after Sherman rescues Penny, she is smitten by him. She starts treating him better, and even stands up for him to his “father”. This is not something you do for a person you abused and ridiculed (actually on the same day, at school – if one recalls the plot).
“Why is she attracted to him? She wasn’t before,” I asked them.
Their hamster ran again. Fast. Excuses were coming out, repeating most of what they said before. They even try to say that Sherman is handsome.
“It is because he is now successful,” I explained. “Girls are attracted to successful boys”.
That rang a bell as they sometimes have a crush on one of the boys. Now they know why they feel attracted and not “LOVE”. My other point is that you should not, at their age, discuss Alpha and Beta. This is for a later age. You cannot talk to young girls about “Alpha” male, or “Beta”. I decided to run with “successful”.
Next is the concept of “The Wall”
Taking CH advice:
Tell her with uncompromising bluntness that she is pretty now, and all the boys notice her, but her prettiness will disappear faster than she knows (or can possibly know at her tender age), and there will come a time, always much sooner than she had hoped, when none of the boys will notice her.
My daughters know that they should be married by their mid-20s. I use their mom and other moms of their friends and asking: ”How successful will her boyfriend be, if she was single?”. They look at the fathers of their friends, and at least some of the time it is obvious. My eldest told me that her mom told her that being married at 25 is too young. I replied by stating that her mother has actually no strength running after them, and that they as young moms would have the strength to do things with their children. Message well understood.
2. Show her how guys hit on girls
I day game sometimes. I don’t do it much in front of my girls, because they will cockblock me. It happened a few times before I “stopped”. I recall one time that they ran interference at a wedding, when I was about to number close a young hot girl.
But if we are in a restaurant for example, I tease the waitresses. I use pet names, boss them around a little bit and treat her as a small child. The waitresses usually take it very well, and sometime even blush.
Cockblocked by your own daughters!!!
My daughters start to giggle. “Dad, I don’t know why, but I feel good when you do that,” my elder told me. “It is because older girls are like young girls. They love it when a successful man makes fun of them” I explained. “Also, you see that the waitress was responding well. She likes it,” I add. They witnessed it, and now they know how it feels and how it looks when a guy hits on a girl and what an interaction between boys and girls looks like.
Lesson hammered again. As a side benefit, now my daughters feel better knowing that their father is “Successful”. I’ll admit that my game level is intermediate at best, but good enough is good enough.
3. Connect them to their tradition
I’m not religious, nor traditional in my way of life. I’m atheist and does not feel the presence of god in the world. That does not mean that my heritage should be forgotten. On the contrary, one must have roots. Otherwise we will become leafs blowing in the wind.
In every Jewish holiday or event, I speak with them about it. We practice some of the rituals, since stories are good, and actually doing something is sometimes better. I use my parents for this as well (also atheist but feel the same about heritage as me).
My daughters have a good sense (for their age) about history. When we travel in our country I try to revive stories of the Bible for them. This is available in most of the country, and for you guys at your homeland as well.
I also use the bed time story for this purpose. I try to combine legends (which kids love) from our heritage. There are a lot. I alternate myths from my heritage with others (Greek mythology for example). One can find hordes of stories in one’s heritage of all types and purposes.
4. Work on their femininity
We are man and we practice masculinity. Femininity? Red-pill guys? How exactly? One would assume that this is the mom’s job. So what? We all know that women are not to be trusted with responsibility. So I gladly take some of this burden upon myself.
You can do it too. The funny things is that it is not that hard. It also correspond with the red-pill.
First example: Women highest calling
“What is the most important thing that girls can do?” I ask them. “Give birth” they answer. “And raise the child,” I add. This is something I always find the place to mention to them. There is nothing more important than continuation of our species. “Dad, what if we didn’t have kids?” They ask. “It will be the end of the world for our family,” I answer. “The family line will be lost”. It took some time to understand this, but now they get it. Now they know that kids are crucial and that they should have them and take care of them.
Second example: Chores around the house
Not my best one (to say the least), but I try to have them do feminine chores around the house: Cook with me, fold laundry and so on. Just because I live alone and do masculine and feminine chores does not mean that my daughters can’t learn it also from me.
Start early, and they will reap the reward
This is something that I lack, and should delegate more to them. It is a matter of preferences (I’m lazy in those parts and outsource some of those chores). When done correctly, you get your daughter accustomed to doing chores.
Third example: Looks
In this case I have a good deal of help from their mom. She emphasizes looks, dresses well and wears makeup. Kids need to have discipline and getting dressed, even for girls is sometimes tiresome. Trust me, I use to be like that. When they sometime complain, I remind them that looks are important (see tip #1). This is where a cooperation between parents really kicks it in, and a lot of people mentioned how well they dress.
Whenever they form an opinion on someone (based on their looks), I hammer it home again. Looks are women’s top and dominant SMV component.
Forth example – Future career
Kids do a lot of thinking on what they want to do when they grow up. That may change on an hourly, daily or monthly basis. I had my daughters move from teachers to waitresses to babysitters and to doctors – all in the course of one day.
When they come to me with the new career, I remind them that they will need to also be there for their kids when they are young. Then you see them spin the wheel to show me how it works great with a child (or more). At that time I also remind them that since they will marry a successful man (god, I hope so!) he will be the one providing for them, and they will assist.
5. Reward feminine behavior
Let’s face it, it’s kids. They will fumble, belch, swear and do stuff that they are not suppose to. It is part of growing and also of testing their boundaries.
I punish swiftly. Explain shortly what they did wrong and then punish. If it is a good behavior I reward it. It is virtually the same as when you date, only you care more.
Punishment themes
- Taking away their time with me (for example – not getting a bed time story). This is for when they disrespect my time. Time is important to me, as they know I make efforts to be on time.
- Tactical anger – my daughters have told me that they fear me. Good. If kids have no fear there will be no discipline. Other dads (or moms) may say that it is not good, and that love is enough. YEH RIGHT! I ignore or take the time to explain that fear is crucial.
Never actually lose your temper. Calm down once the point was made. If you cannot calm yourself, walk away and breathe. Losing one’s temper completely is weakness. - Not paying allowance – if it is disrespect to my money. This happens when they break stuff (on purpose or that it could have been avoided). I use less of this punishment as it correlates poorly from a time perspective.
I think you get the hang of it. If you want to take their TV time, have a supporting reason. “Because I said so” teaches them that power is arbitrary (and drives them to accumulate power). Punishment should fit the crime.
Rewards themes
- Verbally – most easiest reward. Giving a good word is immediate. One must not abuse it. When you give praise, look into their eyes and mean it. Kids know when you are “half arsing” it.
- Treats – you may use this on occasion. Usually amounts to a few dollars. If it is an “all-for-dollar” store even better, It gives them a sense of independence and correlate good behavior with physical reward.
- Activity – “You get to pick where will go on Saturday” is one of their favorites. My daughters in particular, and kids in general sometimes like to “steer the wheel”. Giving them that opportunity (not every week!) makes them feel loved and respected, which again is a good correlation between action and reward.
6. Make them play an instrument and practice sport
One of my younger protégé (member of the RVF, which I mentor) told me that a high quality girl either practice sport and/or plays an instrument. He makes the effort of not dating girls who have no depth (pun not intended). Playing an instrument or practicing sports means that you develop character.
Apart from the obvious benefits, it also sets them up for higher quality boys. I know that their hypergamy might also rise, but I’ll take that chance. After all they are my daughters, and I know what’s best for them.
Teach her to play an instrument. It will make her a higher quality girl
Both my daughter practice sports and one is already playing the piano. The second will start next year on an instrument of her choice. They know it and, to my great luck, enjoy it. If your kids does not enjoy sports or music for some reason, look for alternatives.
7. Be there to give meaning to the world
The world is messy, unfair and sometimes not understood. For a child this can be overwhelming. I had my daughter cry every few weeks at “events” that disturb their childish worldview. As a father it is my responsibility to make sense for them. They ask a lot of questions, and get serious answers.
Starting from “the birds and the bees”, I’m there explaining and making sense. I also encourage them to question me and see if the world view I provide is wrong. They ask a lot, sometime repeat themselves – but I’m patient and urge all fathers to be. Making sense of the world is done in a peaceful and respectful manor.
Nothing to add
Remember that mythology teaches us that the masculine gives order to the world. It is the case in most, if not any myths I’m familiar with. A serious task, which one takes upon himself once one becomes a father.
8. Show what happens to “Bad Girls”
There is an appeal for the “dark side”. Even if in movies the bad person gets what’s coming, my daughters (as every other female) have that attraction for “bad behavior”. They see that it is “cool” and has rewards in the form of attention and ability to “do what you want”.
Yes, female behavior should be controlled, but that is easier said than done. What can a divorce father do? Spanking is out of the question (legally). I have a problem with blocking the TV and internet completely.
My answer is to inoculate them as much as I can. Introducing the concept of “wrong/bad kind of attention”.
You come across a YouTube clip, say of Katy Perry. “Dad, they are showing the wrong kind of attention,” my daughters come to inform me. “I know. You realize what will happen to girls who do it?” I ask. “They will get use to it, and have a difficult time using their brain or doing stuff because they are use to it,” they answer. “She will do bad things to herself to get attention.”
The wrong kind of attention. Just ask my daughters
Immune. They now come to me telling me when they come across it. I know that some of you may claim it is not enough. This is the best tool that I can utilize under the circumstances and it works. You may also use it for commercials. Basically exposing the “media” lies repeatedly makes one more immune (not totally) to it.
9. Explain to them that it is their life, but you are here to show them what to do and support them
Daughter: “Dad, will you help me pick a husband? I want to have a successful one”
Me: “Yes. But it is YOUR CHOICE. I can give my advice but you will live with him”
Other Daughter: “Dad, how can we know if a guy is successful?”
Me (rubbing my hands with pleasure): “Good question. You will be attracted to him, but he also has to treat you well, like I do. He must also be loyal to you, as you will be loyal to him. He will need to have a good job, as he provides for you.”
There are more discussions of this sort going on every now and then. Talk more with your daughters about their husband, otherwise they will be fixated about their wedding. I also bring marriage life, and inform them that since their mother and I broke up, they should learn from our experience and marry better.
10. Teach them not to be bullied
Yes, it’s girls and they are coddled. Yes, school has a strict policy against bullying and fighting. And YES – that does not mean anything today. Your kid, boy or girl, can be bullied. It my kids, so it’s my responsibility.
I teach them to fight back. Never start, but if harassed, punch back, and punch hard. This may seem counter to feminine behavior but it is not. When attacked, one must strike back – male or female. Girls should know how to defend themselves.
Like Ender in “Ender’s Game” you fight not to win this battle, but to win all future ones. For those who remember the first fight of Ender at the beginning of the book.
Fight not win this battle, but to win all future ones
I also warn them about what I call “Victim mentality”. They are not victims, and I will answer to the school. It happened and I did. The teacher and counselor were told, by me, that I don’t allow them to start a fight. However, since they were punched they should punch back. I take responsibility. They were somehow puzzled, and mumbled about a “non-violent school”. I said again that my daughters will not engage, unless physically provoked. My frame was strong enough that they left it as is.
When kids in their class told them that it was wrong, they came to me. I asked them to look at the kids’ behavior. Guess what? Almost everyone punches back. Speaking to an aggressor does not solve the problem, and I’m sure as hell don’t want them depending on authority.
This is also a good time to talk about successful guys that will physically defend them. Yes, alpha males are aggressive when it come to our females. We will defend them, if they are attacked.
11. Pick your battles
My TV fight is a lost cause. I will limit it but not take it out of the house. I will watch with them to provide red-pill guidance. I know that advice on the manosphere is to disengage the MSM, but in this case I choose not to, for my own reasons.
However, I have shown them repeatedly that TV and media should not be trusted. They have witnessed it repeatedly. I sat with them during movies, shows of different kinds and negated the messages (girl power and boys being no good). I had a lot of talks with them about it. But I know that the TV will remain in the house.
I know that some of the fights are not worth fighting. We have a specific amount of energy. You need to pick your battles and not to alienate your kids. Also, sometimes if we win it will be a Pyrrhic victory.
I consider myself stricter than most of the fathers I know, but each year I give them more space and allow them to push the boundaries. It is part of growing up. If you boundary was breached, you can either tactically get angry, or sometimes just say “NO”. But again, know when to lose.
Conclusion
There is a lot of talk about raising red-pill boys. I understand the importance. There is very little discussion on raising girls, at least that I have seen. What I write here is my lesson learned of my last three years of red-pill awakening.
I’m already waiting for the time that they’ll have boyfriends. I may AMOG them, but for sure I’ll have the talk Roosh had with his sister. This is already saved on my hard drive and on my cloud storage. The day will come (in a few years’ time) when it will be relevant. I have practiced it sometimes with girls in my harem, and they all acknowledge that the message is strong and true.
That does not mean I will be successful. I have most of the world against me, including the education system and the media. However I feel comfortable that my daughters will be way less damaged than the rest. Who knows, maybe the change back to patriarchy we are discussing will happen during their generation. In this case they will have an upper hand on other girls.
“Third example: Looks
In this case I have a good deal of help from their mom. She emphasizes looks, dresses well and wears makeup.”
I second that emotion.
My wife is constantly fixing her hair, dressing up, looking in the mirror, etc. So now my 2 year-old daughter has begun copying her. My daughter has started to walk in her mother’s high heel shoes, posture in the mirror, etc. At only two, she is already learning to mimic feminine behavior.
By contrast, my cousin is a feminist mother. She taught her daughter to reject traditional gender roles, etc. The result? Her daughter is now androgynous, fat and single. And of course, they both hate Trump.
Femininity can encouraged by fathers; but ultimately, it’s a mother that fully trains a young girl on the nuances of the feminine world.
The fat acceptance is something the left pushes hard in schools. It really permeates society. The idea that you don’t have to compete is repulsive to me. My x wife had daddy issues and she ended up the same way. Fat just got like a balloon and lazier than a welfare hood rat. Maybe I chose wrong or too much beta at the time 20 years ago…but even years later; she never recovered. My daughter is more like me in that she don’t want to be fat and strives……. I don’t know the answer but I think its start when kids sprout a tooth to get them on the right track.
The entire Western world conspires against a man. Having a traditional family has become a Hurculean task, where you have to compete against a daily assault by the media, school system and government.
Our culture is worse than dick cancer. Turn off the TV, and get them out of government schools.
It’s gotten ridiculous. We’re always talking about bringing back fat-shaming but it feels hopeless sometimes. It’s not unusual to see an average guy with a hambeast these days.
“Femininity can encouraged by fathers; but ultimately, it’s a mother that fully trains a young girl on the nuances of the feminine world.”
Agree, to some extent.
I’m a man, not a women. So I can do my best to show her the ropes. I still claim to my opinion that ” I gladly take SOME of this burden upon myself.”
Emphasizing SOME – not all.
TheMaleBrain
Good advice. I have a 15 year old daughter. The big thing now are kids listening to social media daily and being non-resilient to stress. RE: being put on drugs and killing themselves off. Lots of articles on it. It is what it is for this generation. Its something I have never seen before. —
With kids, another thing going around is female fat acceptance in the youth. I tell my daughter that -its not “okay”…..You put your best self out there. In all areas. When you say its okay to be fat. You are not competing. You are giving up; and that is bullshit. There are tons of kids even at 15-18 where the left is corrupting the minds of these kids.
Drug thing – never crossed my mind. Would start to pay attention to it.
Fat acceptance – emphasizing looks, work on femininity. And yes – I put minimal carbs in my home.
TheMaleBrain
If I have a daughter, and she’s old enough to make a sound decision for herself, I’ll give her two choices…
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/fce4b71f7e2898a7138ab946445a1cd9008e33400c709fe339cfbdb3a9ec3d1f.jpg
You’ve covered all the bases, here. The worst women are always the ones who were allowed to sit around being a princess all day as children.
Excellent job on helping them analyze media, too. I need to get on this. A lot of RP men talk about not having TVs in their homes but I feel that could backfire. TV just becomes a fun, forbidden thing they do at the home of their grandparents/friends/cousins.
The TV thing is a critical issue. Being there to interpret the world is for me the best compromise (under the circumstances)
TheMaleBrain
I recently didn’t watch TV for about a month. I came back and I realized it is nothing but brainwashing. Every segment has some implicit message trying to degrade our culture. I literally cannot watch it anymore.
I watched some TV over Thanksgiving and couldn’t believe the amount of advertising and commercials. I thought I was tuned into some shopping channel or something. It was really about a 50/50 split between content and commercials. And people pay for that shit?
Yeah, it’s most shocking when you give it up for a long time and then come back and do some viewing. My TV watching is limited to viewing HBO at a friends house on Sundays.
I experienced the hacked amazon firestick on turkey day.
uh
mazing
You can literally watch ANYTHING- I looked up obscure foreign movies, anime, documentaries- I found it all. Why isnt this illegal? Friend said he was worried too, did a quick search, apparently its technically legal(for now) because you are streaming, not downloading, the content. If you nab one, you may start watching tv again
I would still take care watching content from HBO. As I understand it, the devices are just accessing torrents (not sure what database they are using, piratebay is good but doesn’t have as much as you describe). The only warning email I’ve ever gotten from my ISP was after torrenting HBO content. Once at home, once at a friends house I was housesitting at. The fire stick would download these same torrents, and still be coming from your same internet service, so I imagine you would get the warning letter just the same. Nevertheless, I’ll have to look into one of these.
I don’t think theres a legal difference to streaming vs downloading. You can currently stream from pirate bay (haven’t tried it, but there’s a link to every torrent with that option) and I doubt that makes it magically legal.
But maybe it’s the sort of thing where it’s technically illegal but they can’t prove it unless you did it live in front of a cop, like they can’t just look at the internet activity logs and accuse you of streaming they way they can with downloading? The hard part is always how they prove you broke the law. Like how red light cameras are being ruled illegal even though obviously it’s not legal to run red lights.
Looks like fire stick is $30 on Amazon on Cyber Monday.
Thats interesting regarding HBO- was his ISP Time Warner Cable? Maybe thats why? They only care if you watch anything belonging to their companies, like Warner Bros movies?You/he got an actual letter from the cable company? I cant imagine this will be allowed forever, it really devalues everything, so enjoy that $30 stick while you can.
I think he got a letter from Time Warner. I got an email from my non-time warner company. I think HBO pursues pirating more than most. I don’t torrent HBO stuff.
There’s definitely some horrifying shit on TV. Especially in regards to family dynamics. Fathers are a huge joke, siblings hating each other is normal, “bad boys” are easily tamed, and single mothers are heroic.
I myself don’t have children, but have made observations regarding this topic based on my two sisters who are both older than me. One who had an illegitimate daughter when she was 18, that was eventually adopted; and the other who is a 27 year old with feminist tendencies that lives in the heart of a big city. I come from a very “traditional” type of family with a father and mother who took very traditional roles, for the most part. But with that being said, it is still up to the mother at the end of the day to teach their daughters the ways of being a woman, and the father is basically the reinforcement of these things. The problem is, is not just the family life but external forces such as the school system, social media, ect…
Last night, I was just at a B-day party, and was listening to my 13 year old niece talk about day-to-day life (mostly school gossip) and man I thought my generation, the millennial and gen-xer’s were bad. The marxism being ingrained at this generation is at a whole different level.
The cultural Marxism, SJW bullshit among the younger people is absolutely terrifying. I’m hopeful, though, because I see a strong backlash emerging.
The problem I see is not only in making on SJW collapse, but on replacing it with something better that lasts. Revolution is not that complicated, but a sustainable change of paradigm it is.
This is honestly why I have not taken up arms yet. Not because it is not morally justified; the Founders were shooting over far less.
But because we could line all the politicians up on the wall, shoot them, and fix nothing. The politicians would be replaced. The elites are the problem.
(and the revolutionaries are the first ones to be shot down, just after the old regime is over)
Yes cultural marxism is a terrible epidemic now in the school system. This was one of the reasons my parents worked their asses off to send myself and siblings to private Christian/Catholic schools to keep us away from this shit at a young age. After my second year of high school we ended up moving for a family emergency and I spent 1.5 years in a public school (first time in my life) and was already tired of it after a few days: the students, teachers, lower quality of academics, and thought to myself how the heck would I have survived 12 years of this. I still cannot believe kids can put up with this for years and years until graduation.
This. It was my mother who taught me how to be a traditional wife. She was adamant that I learn to run a household properly with respect to domestic skills. I followed her example of marrying before 30 and choosing a high quality husband. My father taught me the importance of being chaste and reinforced my mother’s lessons on how to behave in a ladylike manner. Punishment was swift and harsh. My parents did not believe that spanking was wrong either.
I see nothing wrong with spanking one’s wife either…
Boyfriend!? Virgin marriages are far superior. However, being underage and attracted to males may be too long for some to hold out until legal age. Just another problem with the law.
What law ?
Underage sex laws
Yeah, I am completely ok with those. Nobody needs to marry a 15 year old kid.
The idea of age of consent laws are a relatively recent concept. Maturity varies among people, but western societies have coddled and stunted growth in those areas, and remove responsibility from young adults. Seeing as how various factors have contributed to earlier puberty, getting someone older increases the chances of higher notch counts and thus affects the value of said relationship material.
14 year old girls need legal protection from some very stunted people who may seek them out.
No they don’t. 14 is a desirable age and always has been. A lot of 14 year olds have had sex.
Right, not with some guy in his 30’s. There are some very sexually retarded men out there who may have deluded themselves into believing that those kid of relationships are normal. That’s fucked like a tranny.
It was quite common in the old days. If it works, why not? They are the stage in life where they can support a family. A 14 year old guy cannot.
It didn’t work in the old days which is why it was stopped. Young girls who give birth too young die, and so do their babies. Young marriage leads to high maternal mortality rates and high infant mortality rates. Girls may get their period at 12-14 but that marks the beginning of puberty for them, not the end of it (i.e. they are still growing). Let them grow up. Damn.
Contraceptives have been used since ancient times. Girls have been entering puberty earlier and earlier recently. By the time one lets them ‘grow up’, they’re already used goods.
Virgins are boring. I like them a little broken in.
For ONS and such yeah, but for relationship material, its a DIY job
JHC, I hope your daughters live with their mom most of the time.
So, where do I buy this red pill? Do I just need one red pill, or many?
If ever the average woman matures, it would actually be the biggest triumph of patriarchy. The ultimate feminist nightmare.
Ender’s Game is a great book …. but a dog poop movie
The movie was in development hell for about 10 years, and they tried to combine it with “Ender’s Shadow”.
Sadly Ender’s game is the best of the series. The rest is just… odd.
I personally liked how the Shadow progressed with the aftermath of Earth but i would have to agree Speaker of the Dead and the rest after got very strange
I remember liking Speaker, then trying the third book and not being able to finish it.
I agree with a lot in this article and it is well written. But fear has no place in the parent child relation, if you fear the ones most important in your life that should love you the most(your parents) how can you then ever trust anybody. You want to avoid somebody you fear and eventual pull away, maybe end up very obedient or rebellious. Fear and obedience should not go together in the parent child relation, it is stressful to be around some you fear. There is difference on fear and respect, eventually as you grow up you will loose respect for some you fear. They should be taught to respect you and not fear you. You dont teach them anything if they fear you only to be afraid of you and stress them, and it will not keep them from doing bad they will only be more likely to lieto you about it. Dont loose your daughters when they grow up because they have fear for you, you cant really be close or have secure attachment to some you fear, please.
Disagree.
Respect needs to have an element of fear in it.
I believe you are over playing the “fear factor”.
My daughters fear, respect and love me at the same time. There isn’t any contradiction
Respect should not have an element of fear. Anybody who knows anything about children would call it unhealthy. Of course they will love their father and they always will, children are very loyal to their parents. But as they grow up they might loose respect eventually, its difficult to truly respect someone close to you if ypu fear them. Fear is not healthy and the worst is to have fear for the ones you should be able to rely on. I do not think I am oberplaying it, children form their world view in the early years and what happens in these years is crucial. Respect is earned, but fear is what you force on somebody. When respect someone you sincerely values somebodys opinion and being and it is linked with warm emotions.
The Abrahamic religions teach us to fear God and our parents. Confucianism teaches similar concepts.
Its not written by God its just written by some feelish men some hundreds/thousands years ago. So what what they say? They also say to kill unbelievers, thats its okay to rape unbelievers, have sex with children, keep slaves, etc etc so its not some book i would follow. No islam, no christianity no jewish things. No you should love your parents noy fear them. They only tell you to fear god so you buy their foolish lies because who on earth wants to burn in hell forever.
Why are you responding to her?
A child needs to fear the consequences of fucking up or disrespecting their parents. That is an absolute.
No what is the consequences you are talking about? Hope you would not ever lay a hand on a child. The parents also has to earn the respect, giving birth to a child does not automatically makes you a mother and entitled, it takes something. You have to be consistent and firm yes, but in a gentle way. Respect and fear is not the same people mess the two terms up. If they dont do something because they fear you its just because they are afraid and its short term effect, sure its more easy for the parent to just make you children afraid of you to make them do what you want but in the end you will be the looser. But if they dont do something because they respect you they have learned something and actually cares. they fearing you will not keep them from doing either, it will just keep them from being close and truthfull with you.
Fear and respect are not the same. You should be consistent and consequent yes, but in a gentle supportive manner. Results gained from fear is short lived and they learn nothing, results gained from respect means they actually care about what you say and understand it. You would slap a child for not respecting you? I would loose the last respect i had. What are the consequences you are talking about?
Yeah ok pussy.
You should mind your own in my opinion but, this is of course only my opinion and as a adult you are free to make your own choices. To remove this from the arena of your feelings and babble. Yes, I would slap a child for disrespecting me or my property, my child, your child, you… I would cut a tight slap with absolutely no hesitation for any kind of trifling fuckery. I know how to both love and challenge. Share your opinions with your own child.
Go back to Mexico, Bitch.
I am not Mexican, I am not American. Intelligent comment, you really got me Einstein.
Its not just my opinions based entirely on feelings. Its common sense and basic knowledge that it does more harm than good to slap your children. It is just a easy way out to use violence against your child.
All of you sounds so intelligent, you blow me away with your knowledge and wisdom.
For me it is important because no parent has the right to just hit their children whenever they feel like it.
Well, at least I was right about the “bitch” part.
You are really a red pill alpha man. Bravo!
So bright and intelligent!
I’m sure your sarcasm attracts so many desirable men!
Married, so i dont care about attracting men. Also i would never talk to a real man like this, only to you on your own level so you can understand what i say. I dont want to confuse you Rob. 😉
Right, parents have the right to discipline their children as they see fit.
It is your own perspective based on your personal experience. Societies that use corporal punishments aren’t bad.
Any research will say the same. You can also see it in their brain development.
I stringly disagree.
The child has rights to, they have rights to a safe enviroment and rights over their bodies, you cant just hit or whatever you want with them. They are not your personal doll and you dont own them, and one day they will move away and then ypu can just wish they want to take care of you when old.
It is found in studiesbthat children that get spanked has less gray matter in certain areas of the prefrontal cortex and that can be linked to depression, addiction and other mental health disorders, and more aggression. You will say your parents hitted you know and it helped? How? Proof it leads to aggression if you to does exactly the same.
That is simply not true. It is not the place of zealots to impose their own beliefs onto families. I would never say that my parents “hitted” me. You’re not coherent enough to to be telling people. To each their own.
Is that your personal experience ? The parents that you are trying to shame love their children a LOT more Han you do. When you love and care for them as much as they do (I.e your own kids) then you will have earned a say.
Right, but we both agree that you don’t have he right to impose your beliefs into strangers families right ? Lol
It is simply not the case that children who are disciplined by means including corporal punishment have any issues with brain development. Zealots ALWAYS have research at hand that doesn’t really support what they’re saying.
Zealot? I don’t know why you insist on smacking children. But let’s just atop the discussion we will not agree on this.
Its not a belief, it is a fact.
Dont talk about the love i got for my child. But i understand that you feel my comments where meant for you so ok. But how dare you, what a nasty turn just because you don’t have any good arguments.
So if somebody will rape and kill their children just let them, to each his own, how dare i impose my belief on others. How dare the police impose its belief on the citizens, why cant we steal and rob banks like we want.
Then I would recommend Saudia Arabia my friend.:)
Nah.
I respectfully disagree. My daughter has a healthy fear of me. Somewhat like a law-abiding citizen fears what would happen if they broke the law.
And you are close to her, she would tell you anything and you talk a lot with her about anything and spend time?
I disagree. My father is fair but can also be terrifying and that was the only thing that worked for me. I don’t respect people if I know I can undermine them, that’s how I destroyed my previous relationship.
If I would piss him off, he would be terrifyingly angry, and very rightly so because as a child I could have a bad disrespectful attitude. Him getting angry, just raising his voice, would remind me that I should be respectful and watch my attitude. My father has given me a great example in many ways, where my mother did not. I respect him greatly and want my children to be raised by their father in the same way.
Gentle does not always do the trick, especially not when the child has been disobeying your last 40 requests to (not) do something.
You see that with some kids these days. Disrespectful as hell because they know they can get away with it. Leftist mommy will just buy them a glutenfree muffin as a way of discipline.
Gentle does the trick. My daughter is well-behaved and we are very close. I would never be able to fully respect a parent that hitted me and i would loose self worth and feel unsure. Gentle is my mother and we had and have a wonderful relationship. I saw some children who got hitted from young, these children are the most misbehaved i have ever seen.
Gentle does not men to be a push over. I dont think the problem today is that people are being gentle, its more that they are absent leaving a 8 month old baby in daycare 8-9 hours in the day and buying the children of with gifts.
You also teach your child you solve problems with your fists and that the bigger one has the right to beat the smaller one to get what you want, if you hit your child how you then have right to be angry if they hit a smaller child in the school because that is exactly what you are doing at home. The parent should set an example.
Also it does not help with children to say no one hundred times, then the word loose meaning. You have to be firm, just take them with you or find something other for them and just ignore them if they make a scene after you try everything. Focus more on the positive than on the negative, then they will do more positive things. Also pick your battles.
I dont know why you insist on smacking your children, when the damage it does has been proofed. I would rather cut off my hand than to ever hit my child.
Then you lucked out with your well behaved children (even though I wonder how objective you are about that). Many
children, like myself, will be total brats if you give them too much space and allow them to think that they are in the same rank with you. My father did not smack me for no reason. I got a butt whooping when I deserved it, because I was misbehaving and not acknowledging his authority, not realizing how disrespectful that is. I’m glad my father did not treat me like some unique little snowflake, like you see with todays insufferable kids. It kept me grounded and now I truly value how much he sacrifed for me to have a good life and high standards.
Cutting of your own hand? That sounds kind of…islamic? Are you ok?
Islam is a abrahamic religion together with judaism and christianity.
Children will be children, objective overall well behaved and empathic so i call her well behaved. of course children has a mind of their own too and will not be like perfect little dolls all of the time but that is not a bad thing. Bad behavior for me is lack of empathy for others, no respect for parents or elders and constantly pushing and testimg limits to extremes, and once again i have to say the most bad behaved children i have met were hitted or had absent parents.
I just mean that ok they should respect you, but it is wrong to make them fear you and use your hands to get what you want and apparently we will not agree on this and that is ok. But we can agree on that there are many red carpet children and many other mistakes in todays soceity, but using violence and fear on children no. How can you have secure attachment to some you fear, you just cant.
When your bearded patriarch fellows and brahs come over to visit, know that they’re potential future suitors for your young maturing daughters.
http://cdn.myfaithradio.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2014/12/faith-commander1-e1417462268305.jpg
You vet her suitors right there in your living room. You know them. They have righteous beards. Seal the deal with ye righteous fold. It is too late if you’re prying around in parking lots and HS keg parties trying to keep tabs on who she’s associating with. YOU LET HER GO too soon and too late if that makes sense.
Only a mature patriarch with a dominating beard will do for your daughter who carries on YOUR SEEDLINE too. If she gets knocked up by some same age beardless ‘boy-chin’, then as you know it’s hard to afford diapers for a baby when daddy is busy playing NINTENDO at a friend’s house. Give your daughters over to being dominated by a righteous bearded patriarch only. The sooner the better.
If time slips by, years accure and she’s 20, childless and unmarried and her room looks like THIS
https://thumb1.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/94199/94199,1300640758,33/stock-photo-lazy-woman-in-an-unkept-room-looking-sleazy-with-a-cigarette-in-her-mouth-playing-video-games-73543957.jpg
Then by golly BEEF CURTAINS if you haven’t failed as a father. You’ll be pulling your hair out and swear to almighty GOD that you should have married her off back when she was 14-15 to one of your patriarch buddies. If you could only go back in time, you would have offered beef AND bullets for dowry.
Mittens… Is that you ?
Good piece. Thanks for posting. I also have two girls and I’m not sure if it’s harder or easier to raise them when compared with boys. Each one has its challenges in today’s fukced up culture. In any event, it really does start with the red pill. Accepting and conveying the cold hard truths of reality (in an age appropriate way) is the key.
It is tough though because you’re swimming against the tide of pop culture degeneracy and screwed up peers from truly fukced up families. My 13 year-old daughter has a female classmate that, last year (at age 12), claimed she was a lesbian. This year she says she two-spirited and ran as a class rep on a platform of LGBT advocacy. This madness is in a Catholic middle school! I’m not kidding. It’s insane. Fortunately my daughter has enough sense to see the girl is a fruitcake. Meanwhile, the girl’s crazy parents are encouraging this. The dad must be a closeted homo.
Another ok movie thay conveys some redpoll truths is “Daddy’s Home” with Will Farrell and Mark Wahlberg. It’s far from perfect but it does a decent job of showing the alpha-beta juxtaposition.
Those parents should demand their money back from that Catholic school. They paid grand sums of money to avoid public school and what do they get? LGBT advocacy? Public schools teach ‘snitching to the state’ whereas private schools hold parents accountable. That’s the back door social marxist radicals use to get into private schools. Some ‘SDS’ type and socialist action front groups can walk right into a private school with a student enrolled and radicals can sponsor an event or outing that’s backed by some shadowy lefty radical group whereas in public school, usually only the fire department or sherriff comes and hands out ‘don’t do drugs’ coloring books. College social marxists and sjw’s in universities are free agents in education being over 18 years of age and campus radical (LGBT) have easy pickings getting in the doors of the private schools. You can’t even get into the doors of many public schools these days without papers in hand from the official socialist services child kidnappers/racketeers or sheriff or other local enforcement/gov group. Faculty are vetted and enter with swipe cards. Pub schools are on lockdown with door buzzers and parents aren’t usually allowed to go past the office without special permission. It’s a state borg facade whereas private schools socialize more. And that’s how the radicals monopolize the private schools.
But the girl you mentioned whose parents support her being a middle school LGBT advocate – well I smell trouble at home with MOTHER. She’s a vile old radical witch, likely too neurotic to nurture anything beyond a lone ‘only child’. She’s a griping bitching hen who watches Ellen and her husband is hairless and powerless to put her in her place. His support of the daughter being lez is primarily apologetic and results from the duress of living with a 5 foot domestic bitch tyrant who smokes menthols and who controlls the booty call. She has him wrapped around her finger and on a leash. The dad may survive into old age if he begins growing a beard and she doesn’t cut it while he sleeps. If the father is able to amass enough beard, no woman, no bitch wife, no squalking lefty house fembitch thought-tyranny will stand when THE BEARD is prominent in every room of the house where the patriarch plants his foot.
Think about it. If you were some ditsy dingbat mother with all-day women’s channel hogwash over your brain, you could easily push around a hairless dough boy husband. But your bitchiness would come to a screeching halt if you tried to talk down to THIS
http://starcasm.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/Phil-Robertson-preaching.jpg
Even in the bedroom, in fact in every room THE BEARD dominates the house. Piss off the patriarch and the walls shake with male energies drawn in from the ether. A common red pill shaven man can finegle and litigate principles upon his difficult woman but a massively bearded patriarch SWAMPS THE BITCH hands down every time.
Amen. All hail the beard! Phil Robertson called it exactly the way it is… “Start with homosexuality and just morph out from there” into every form of sexual degeneracy known to man.
“Ditsy dingbat mother with all-day women’s channel hogwash over the brain” is pretty good too!
Man is this guy the new cool or what?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CgL0OqGUAAAfUez.jpg
His grin resonates with battle hardened power. A lightweight bike or hockey helmet can also accent a thinning top. In the house or even in a restaurant a helmet upon a bearded patriarch signalls that he’s ready to rumble and ENFORCE if need be. Be cordial but firm always nonetheless. Carry yourself with authoritative masculine grace. A light helmet feels comfortable in no time and adds energy to any suit ensemble.
Hockey and half motorcycle helmets yes. Bicycle helmets are too faggy.
Not excluding the shave leggy kind of biking, mountain biking can be pretty rough on the hide.
http://media.meltyxtrem.fr/article-1796730-fb-f1380566727/red-bull-rampage-2013-mtb-dh-downhill-antoine.jpg
I also knew a bouncer who regularly wore a bike helmet and kneepads over his suit. Why the knee pads I can imagine, but he always looked like he was ready for business and at the same time a great conversationilist with a good plate of women as well.
“Me (rubbing my hands with pleasure)”
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/1c55273e4d4e13a88a9e511463e7f5d6a8766480f47110cefdadb39a33e3c8bb.jpg
Is that a picture of the Israeli author?
I have a Daughter, who is obviously the most important thing in the world to me.
Raising them is tough. Of course I want for her a full and beautiful family life.
However, we often talk on here about the decline in modern women (which is true). But seldom about modern men who are just as bad.
I could never give her away to a beta boy bitch who simply lacks the cajones to raise, protect and lead a family.
Nor could I to the fake alpha deuchbag piece of shit who thinks hitting the gym 3 times a week and wearing slave- labour made designer clothes makes him a man.
2 sides of the same shitty coin. Fake men.
It’s a tough age to raise girls
I asked my cousin who has 3 beautiful little girls what the holy hell he is going to do when they get to high school. His answer “well, lolknee, it’s like this. When the girls are old enough to date I am going to go into the garage and take my shotgun and blow my brains out. I am going to leave a note totally blaming them and their new born sexuality for this action. That’ll keep them from dating”
Exactly. There is not much he can do. If the divorced israeli OP wants to teach us about raising daughters (while he flirts with waitresses in front of them, whatever). But the reality is that the environment , in the long run, is what defines behavior, not individual people. It is our duty, as red pill men, to culturally enforce an environment that restablishes a balance between men and women. Any separated individual action (self-improvement, game,… ) is of second order of importance.
That seems right to me. I mean I am sure you can do a better or worse job parenting. Not sure where giving your young daughter the tingles falls on that line. But women will act like women when sorrounded by men who are men. You can’t teach a girl to be a proper young lady in a word of fags and degenerates. What you can do is shame men who don’t act masculine because as the world gets more masculine femininity will take care of itself
I agree in part. The environment is an important factor. But there is a LOT that the individual family can do.
Especially if they actively keep the cancerous culture away from their kids.
It is practically impossible to keep away current’s culture, unless very strong values are fit and maintained into that person (mostly due to potential retaliation). It was already difficult with TV and Hollywood, now with social media, smartphones and internet is a 24/7 bombardment. Commentators here have given examples of Amish and rural girls being completely destroyed in the matter of months after moving to a city or starting college.
“Women will act like women when surrounded by men who are men”… So TRUE!
One year have passed since I finally left my office work and I am so happy now… I started freelancing from comfort of my house, for a company I stumbled upon online, for several hrs daily, and I make much more than i did on my old job… My last month payment was for 9k dollars… The best thing about this gig is that now i have more free time for my kids… http://chilp.it/728813e
I was born and raised in one of those small, insulated upstate NY towns mentioned above. Moving from that environment to an NYU dorm was intense. And it’s not just the betas that are creating the problem.
Betas are a consequence. The problem is much large than that.
I concur mate. I don’t think taking advice on how to raise girls from a Jew like the author above is a good idea. But Jews are masters of deception. They play both sides of the aisle. It’s no wonder then majority of Democraps and Repugnantlicans bank-rollers are in fact Jews. Haim Saban for the Jackass Party and Sheldon Adelson for the Cuckservative Party. This is also the same for the author above. The brains and driving force behind feminism are in fact Jew ladies. Jews are the owners and purveyors of pornography and smut in America. So you see, first they demean the traditional man-woman relationship and then they act like good guys like the author of this article. The typical “Woe is me” shtick. Thank my lucky stars I abandoned Cucktianity long ago. How can I associate with fools who scream God Bless Israel even when Jews made their hatred clear?
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/bddc395a57d23c678ea18f6815a190c704b893134266b916c069e36f1c2e8791.png
You can teach them at a young age and get them married young, surrounded by a traditional family. Good women are rare commodities and therefore should have high value and be able to secure a high value guy. Old school religious way: no dating, marriage only.
My god! Why would anyone want that???? That sounds fucking terrible. Sorry, I enjoy sex with attractive women with no connection. I’m just not into this puritanical world of bullshit morals that some people want to return to.
Given the choice between what we have now and what you describe I take now 10 times out of 10
Well, I meant for a hypothetical daughter
NYU is full of very strange urban creatures. Better that you should’ve gone to Syracuse or Ithaca or Cornell.
It’s likely true. I had free ride at Cornell too. I’m out now and like to think of it as a trial by fire experience.
People dated in the past……
To lesser extents
No. They just didn’t have sex. (Most of the time). Dating was as common as now.
Depends on what constitutes dating. But yes, they always had the courtship thing.
Sure, no-one can deny it has changed, I mean in the past they were too smart to go to restaurants and pay loads for dinner =P, unless they had the money for it or it was a really special occasion (depending on time period). I read your post as an outright denial of it ever existing.
Hollywood and TV dictates our culture to most people especially our children! That’s why most uni kids are brainwashed Liberals!
Defeatist, but yeah. I kinda get it. Luckily I’m a young Dad. When she’s 15 I’ll be 40, and still very much in ass kicking shape
He was joking of course and probably thinks the same way. They also live on an apple orchard in small town upstate New York which is like the land that time forgot so that will help
Yeah. Sounds ideal
If he is that desperate, it’s better for him to move out with his family to a traditional country. This may not be the best solution though, make him start to attend to a good christian church to in the countryside. I’m not joking.
That sounds absolutely horrible
To me, it sounds better than committing suicide.
different people can have different views of what is good. I am certain his claim that he will kill himself when his daughters are old enough to date is a joke…nothing to take too seriously. The idea of living in a country stuck in time a hundred or more years ago and being in a family where church is compulsory is, to me, a terrible way to live life. I have nothing against people who feel otherwise, but I kind of like the world as it is now….warts and all
I suppose you will agree that the world you live now is the worst world to raise children, specialy girls. I’ll not discuss the implications of the christian life and how you’re absolutely wrong in your vision of modernity. However, it seems to me that you don’t want a solution if it means destroying your individual comforts.
Unlike you, a man like yoir cousin, who is the head of a family, can not afford to risk family health because of his individual wants. His first responsability is with his family. Having said that, I presented an objective solution to his problem. If he can find a better solution, then it’s great, but if the problem is real he can’t merely wait for the fall while making jokes.
actually, I am pretty sure the solution that will present itself is that this is a fantastic world and that children who are taught to be fantastic children and not to cower in the face of change will grow to be fantastic adults. I see you have strongly held beliefs and a disdain for modernity. I think that is a serious problem but they are your beliefs and you are more than welcome to them. In the meantime, I am just not down on the whole modernity hating trend going on here. I think the world is just plain terrific.
I believe a good education can overcome the worst a community has to offer, but I also believe that good education is not possible whitout recognizing objective principles, such as the nuclear family and traditions, unless we change on a biological level. While this doesn’t happen (and I think it will never happen), it is our job to protect what is essential for all of us and the next generations, something our ancestors had done better than us. That is a fact.
I don’t hate modernity though, I simply have a different vision of what modernity means. Modernity equals oportunity, oportunity to growph like never before. Abundant resourses and rampant convenience is always good. However, this is just a part of what is modernity. Everything has a consequence. Liberty whitout compromise, responsability whitout roots, desires whitout moderation. These are the main consequences of modernity. The libertarian. He consumes what the conservatist builts, he fucks his daughter making her unsuitable, ends up contributing little to nothing to the next generation. When he finaly settles down, he has already destroyed more than constructed.
I do have a disdain for this kind of behavior.
I think it is funny how americans use the word “hate” on such a casual manner. This is a very powerful word in my country. If I hated something, I wouldn’t be discussing, I woudn’t be complaining, I would just kill it if possible. If not, I would move on and forget it exist.
I don’t hate modernity, I fear what it is becoming. Our generation is on a crucial point, if we make the wrong choices now our western culture will collapse. There will be a time to pursue self-centered desires, but the time isnt now. Our culture needs us.
Besides useful tech and knowledge access, there is not much to be saved from modernity. And even some of the tech I think, is the reason we are not going to the stars any time soon in our lives (or in this civ).
We know how to keep the dickheads away from our daughters (I agree with you 100%, and I will choke a motherfucker) but our culture has forgotten how to keep the harpies away from our sons.
Very true
This is so critical. I can’t tell you how many times I got used by harpies as a kid. We need to bring back the patriarchy.
I agree. But which Patriarchy? Because I don’t think that everyone here has a similar understanding on that concept.
This is something which is not addressed enough here for sure. I would love to see an article breaking down different types of pateiarchical societies. I know that a lot of guys would like to see a patriarchy which I would totally fucking hate and which would, to my mind, be inferior to what we currently have. My vision of a patriarchy probably wouldn’t be to the tastes of others.
Personally, I think there is only one stable outcome: woman virgin until marriage, one woman per every man plus a 1% of women being prostitutes to empty our balls. Anything else is a mess.
I don’t know exactly what differencies are you refering to, but generaly speaking I can state that the Christian patriarchy model is the best.
Judeo-Christian culture has historically proved itself with unique and effective wisdom. Of course it has flaws, but I would say that this is the best moral system to date.
One can easely realize this by studying the evolution (and deterioration) of European society, and the role of Jewish and Christian culture throughout Middle Eastern history.
The differences I was thinking about emanate from at which time of history should take the patriarchal structure from. Feminism has been going on for the last 100 years already.
See and here I think that we need to evolve past pair bonding.
I acknowledge that given the modern tech. advances and extended lifespan, lifelong pair bonding may be obsolete. i.e. Being a housewife in 2016, unless a couple has 3+ kids it is a joke. But the alternatives seem to produce extreme loneliness and misery in advanced ages. Very complicated problem.
Agreed it is complicated. People live way too damn long. But I feel that the loneliness and misery hun advanced ages could be mitigated by meaningful persuit and, if that isn’t possible, drugs and entertainment
The devious problem here is prostitutes are running around pretending to be women and only with game can one sift the refuse to find quality while quality women are told to join the refuse. Most of this is chiefly due to feminism. By the time the prostitute, female sex seller, is found out, the man is ruined to marriage and aspects of procreation. The prostitute is then allowed to parade her misandry to other usable men and naive women. Other societies are much more conducive to male to female relationships because the prostitutes are outed early and often, the oft overused term is slut shaming.
Women are only 25 percent of this problem but as long as prostitutes are allowed to dictate the terms of the sexual market place, the idea of quality will become a ever growing myth to the masses.
And what is your vision of patriarchy? inquiring minds would like to know and all that.
Like men are required to register for draft, women must be required to have at least 2 children. Fertility rate in the developed world has been below replacement level for decades. Whites specifically, are being outbred by non-whites, who did not give equal status to women (especially muslims). If we do not implement this, and soon, the white western civilization will fall in less than 100 years. Non-whites will dominate in the new world.
White nationalists have been saying that for nearly a hundred and fifty years. It hasn’t happened yet.
no they haven’t, and only a brief look at demographics 100 years ago vs today will show that it’s well on its way towards happening.
No you will not choke anyone out…. because when it happens, you will not be around.. So… there is that…..
I agree 100%. I think that the manosphere needs to talk more about how most modern men are pathetic. Maybe this will be my next article.
Modern men are shit, and especially the hipster idiot types annoy me. But it’s a two way street. They have grown up surrounded by the lowest quality women ever, who are insufferable and where game is often required even on an obese 4.
Men react and adapt to their environment (that’s what game is, after all) and in an environment full of SJW harpies, I can understand why many men try being a supplicating beta. Girls respond to white knights more than they do nice guys; even if that’s not the most successful path it is better than being ignored.
I just think if I hadn’t discovered the manosphere I’m not sure how I’d even react to finding a girl who rejected feminism and went against popular sentiment. I know I definitely would have dismissed true conservative church girls in the past, where now I see their value. ROK has truly changed how I think and crystalized my view of women and the world.
I suppose the point is the current environment was created by a self-reinforcing cycle. Most guys would dismiss or ridicule true, conservative, submissive women, which helps lead to the extinction of unicorns, and guys, giving in to social pressure, and never being exposed to true, feminine women, don’t know any better and do the best they can with the garbage they are given.
The best thing to help improve the quality of men is patriarchy, which, incidentally, is the best thing to help women also 🙂
Agreed, but I think the cycle is one that changes over time and feeds back into itself.
1. Women start off chaste, because they don’t want to get pregnant and left alone.
2. Men are gentlemen. Then, a few girls start slutting it up and marrying these guys.
3. More women catch on and slut it up, getting the alpha fucks and beta bucks.
4. Men start to catch on, and a few learn game.
5. More and more men learn game and pursue high quality women.
6. Women catch on and start changing themselves to become more high quality.
7. More women catch on, until the norm is being pretty, feminine, sweet, etc.
8. The cycle repeats.
Right now we’re around 5, I’d say. This is evidenced by the growing popularity of the manosphere and how more women (Ann Coulter, Kitten Holiday, etc.) are starting to speak out against third wave feminism.
It’s just a cycle, mate. Society is stuck in these self-repeating cycles.
I agree with you for the first points. Women are the ones who initiated all of this, men followed later. They are the gatekeepers of sex, after all.
However, I don’t see how game can improve things, but just making them worse, since it raises the level of men, while women just lower theirs (getting fat) Think about it: the number of women available in a particular age range is fixed. Female supply is fixed. In the end, men end up marrying what they can.
“Modern men are shit, and especially the hipster idiot types annoy me. ”
I have a question about this. It is something which has been bothering I’m and I haven’t been able to put my finger on it. The above quoted statement is something I whole heartedly agree with. Then I think, why? I don’t know any hipsters. All the modern men I know seem to be, more or less, good guys.
My understanding of the cult of faggotry and effeminate hipsterism comes from the web (sites like ROK) and from knowing that a certain element of society hangs out in certain areas of town which I totally avoid (and there has always been an shitty segment of aociety which was better avoided so it is no modern phenomenon).
Meanwhile, the guys I encounter on a day to day basis in restaurants and bars or through work or at the gym all seem ok to me.
I guess what I am wondering is if it really is all that bad with modern men. Is it possible we are blowing things out of proportion, taking the absolute worst as indicitve of the whole and posting the image Up in order to give us something to fight against?
There’s a good bit of economics in there, too. The easy lifestyle and comfort culture definitely leads to lower quality women. And that part is not changing. I mean, yeah, disposable income levels peaked in the US in the 60s, but through the magic of debt and living alone in a small studio apartment, women can have a very easy quality of life here. I dated a big city girl in a serious relationship and concluded at the end that she and her 30 year old friends really have zero need for men in their life.
Hell, yesterday I was walking around town and saw a store that sells nothing but cookie dough for you to buy, and take home and cook. You know how long it takes to make cookie dough? Like 20 minutes. It would literally take me longer to drive to that place, park, go inside and buy cookie dough, and drive back home than to just make it myself. It’s like 5 ingredients. The store is probably paying a couple of grand in rent, that is all built in to the markup for mixing a few ingredients together for women too lazy to bake. I guarantee no men are shopping there. Holy shit this is a lazy world.
Can you name any societies where we saw #6 take place? I’d like to think so, but there’s little evidence of this trend reversing.
Dude, you are almost within rock throwing distance of the highest concentration of hipsters on the planet. And you never see them?
In seriousness, I hadn’t thought about this much until you said it, but I do see mostly normal men in my daily life. I think I’m going to be more open to striking up some friendships with normal looking dudes at the gym, neighbors, etc. in the coming year.
But I do definitely come across tatted up, out of shape, politically correct guys dating far below their SMV.
I went to a party a couple of months back and saw a male tranny (dude in a dress) and 2 fags making out in a dark corner. The men there were all weak in some way. And it didn’t benefit me in any way, as there were no women worth pursuing, or even banging, present.
The male tranny was one of the more attractive ones (I actually checked him out because he was the thinnest “chick” there, and was showing leg, until I saw he was clearly a dude). There’s one cute 22 yr old girl who I got the number of and later found out has herpes.
I live in a conservative part of the south, where there are still people who remember separate bathrooms and water fountains and beatings of negros and all that. I don’t know how their mind can process that we’ve now moved so far, that not only are Jews allowed in the country club, and blacks can pee in the same urinals as whites, but it’s ok to date or marry blacks, or no it’s ok even to date and marry someone of your own sex, or no, it’s ok to actually lop off your private parts and become the other sex. (actually I’m not sure Jews are allowed in the country club, the old money does not relinquish its ways easily)
I just extrapolate that and think, wow, if that’s how it is in conservative pro-trump red state America, what must it be like in the average or typical town, much less the anything-goes loony land? But I suppose it’s not that much different around the nation. And I do live in the city, which is always going to attract these types.
So yes, I think we are blowing things out of proportion. I tend to think there are few people outside ROK that share my viewpoints on many issues, but maybe that’s not true. Hell, I found out a friend of mine reads ROK when I mentioned it recently (I think I brought it up when talking about rape or something) and he’s like oh yeah I like that site. So perhaps we have more allies than we know. The meetups would have been an interesting way of seeing this. I have no idea if a bunch of interesting, mature, professional men, or a bunch of odd, horny virgins would have shown up.
At the same time I have definitely broached some rather benign ideas with several friends, like hey, let’s go hit on those 20 year olds, and they are clearly not on board.
Are we blowing things out of proportion? You just said the thinnest chick at the party was a dude lol
“Dude, you are almost within rock throwing distance of the highest concentration of hipsters on the planet. And you never see them?
Actually, I really don’t. I don’t know how it is in other cities like Seattle or Portland or SF where there are huge concentrations, but as I have said NYC is a very segregated city. Like if I go down to union square or Williamsburg I will see loads of hipsters. But why would I go to those places. It is like if I went down to the bowery in the 60’s i would have seen a lot of homeless junkies and cracked out hippies but I wouldn’t have gone there. I ride the train and see people mostly in suits like myself going to work. I go to an old school barbell club where men go to lift weights not some gym where chicks and gays socialize so I see people there that are into fitness. What they are like outside of the gym I don’t know, but I see a lot of guys I respect and pal around with while there and they are all really cool…like every single one of them. At work I deal wth lawyers, accountants, business people, ad people, construction people, union people and some I like and respect more than others, but there are no real hipster types. When we built our website and do our advertising there are a lot of homos involved but that is expected…they are professionals and do a good job and whatever.
When I go out I stick to very high end restaurants and hotel bars. So I run into successful men, usually in suits, and women who are either wealthy, upwardly mobile or straight up model type status fuckers. No self respecting hipster would find himself in bar pleiades, the mark bar or Bemelman’s at the Carlyle or the champagne bar at the plaza, the rooftop bar at the peninsula hotel. I am not saying I like all the people who go there. Some are total douchebags. But none of them are faggy hipsters. Even the gay ones seem to have a modicum of respect and being gay is ancillary to who they, not their entire identity. I have no qualm with what people do in the privacy of their bedroom so long as it isn’t on display the way the homos downtown do.
Most of the stuff I know or see about modern men being total wusses or hipster douches comes, to be honest, from this website. I didn’t realize half this stuff was even going on until I found ROK even from my perch here in ultra lib NYC (which isn’t really as liberal as it is made out to be tbh….it is just that the idiots are loud and the conservatives have enough money that politics doesn’t matter…I always say that NY’rs have a mentality that politics is like college football…it is mainly for people who live in places that don’t really matter but in NYC we have real issues to deal with so we don’t pay attention…this is easily confirmed when you look at number of people who voted here….percentage is incredibly low)
“I went to a party a couple of months back and saw a male tranny”
Here is another thing..other than on TV and the internet I have never seen a tranny in my life. I live in a liberal city, went to a very liberal university and have never once seen this….not counting guys doing it for a laugh on halloween or shit like monty python. Other things I very rarely see…..I almost never see interracial couples that don’t involve an asian. I think that in the last 5 years I saw one black and white couple. Not just hooking up but a couple walking around holding hands and shit. I mean, I am sure if I spent time downtown I would see it, but I just don’t. I know exactly 3 gay people, all of them through work, and can’t think of a single time I have seen a gay couple in a bar. Now yes, there is a gay bar about a mile away from me (literally called The Toolbox) and I am sure if I went in there I would see a lot of gays. But I wouldn’t go there. I shouldn’t. That’s there place. Let them stay there.
As for clubs, there are still some old money clubs that, while not technically restricted, they have other policies that keep out jews. For instance, when I dated a DAR girl I went to the union club with her a few times. In order to be a member you have to have a direct family member who served in the Civil War (on the union side). So yeah, they don’t have a no jews policy but I don’t think a lot of jews served in the civil war. I went to some DAR dinners where my being Italian made me what the girl referred to as “a gateway minority” I was exciting as a minority but somewhat tolerable because I have blue eyes. Ha. Love that shit. They were straight up wasps and she was a DAR.
“But I suppose it’s not that much different around the nation. And I do live in the city, which is always going to attract these types.”
I have been to almost every state in the US but only to visit when I was young and traveling about. I really have no conception of social order anywhere out of my home town. But yes, I don’t think it seems much different. Just more extreme. Remember, the population of NYC is 1.6 million in 22 square miles…that doesn’t count the millions of tourists here at any given time. My neighborhood alone is a 1.76 square mile area with over 200,000 residents. Having so many people means you will find everything. Yes, if I want to find some area with a clique of transvestite amputees I am sure I can find a bar. Hell, for pretty much every major city there is at least 2 or 3 sports bars so Steelers fans have a bar to go to to find other steelers fans etc. Are there hipsters around? Yes, but I really just don’t see them.
This makes me wonder if the problem of modern man being such a pansy is really even a thing or if we are signing out all the weirdos and putting them in one place to read about which makes it seem far more drastic than it is like when the news decided to report on every fucking shark incident and all of a sudden there seemed like there was some kind of shark epidemic when, in reality, it was a media epidemic.
I think that Russia shortly after the communist revolution is a suitable example. Nowadays, Russian women are largely considered very feminine and traditional, but it wasn’t always so. They got hit hard with feminism far before we did, and they bounced back from it.
I’ve never had a successful conversation with a hipster. They’re so painfully self-absorbed.
Yes, in times of rapid political or technological change, sexual norms change, then eventually change back. Life is a pendulum. Great comment.
Yes, during the October Revolution and through the 1920s, they were sexually liberated. Eventually they corrected themselves.
My friend, I think you just convinced me to move to the warm traditional values heartland of NYC.
Seriously, my friends from NYC have told me the same thing.. they are shocked if I mention a tranny because they never see them. My cousin has never seen one in Brooklyn. Another buddy lived in Chelsea for 5 years and saw 3 the entire time. He cannot grasp how there could be more trannies outside of Chelsea than in.
I am now having to rethink the issue of media problem versus real problem. I mean, when Target allowed dudes to go in female bathrooms, I truly wonder how many men entered a Target ladies restroom nationwide. 10? And 8 of them were trolling?
It has been said by Roosh, rightly so, that the gay issue in politics is so incredibly overblown. The gays have an incredible disproportionate representation in political issues, as compared to other groups that are larger than gays, like the Irish or the truck drivers or the unemployed. And I have to think surely that is also the case with degenerate men and women. But the truth is, they are on the rise, while truth and reasonableness and rationality and masculinity and femininity are on the decline. In that regard, the media coverage is perhaps just a few years too early.
Anyway, NYC can offer so much, it’s really like no place else on earth that I’ve been, so I don’t think much can be extrapolated by examining NYC. It will always be the place that it is, no matter how the rest of the country changes. For example, there is ABSOLUTELY an epidemic of obese landwhale women in America, and yet I doubt you see much evidence of that, other than perhaps tourists. I find it hard to find a thin single woman, much less one I’m attracted to.
Landehale epidemic is real and really needs to be addressed but yes to all the rest. The odd thing about the disproportionate power of gays, I think, is because in the last 50 years Hollywood went from being an agent of entertainment to an agent of social change.
Gays have always been found in the arts. That is just where they wind up. We can speculate on why, but the truth of the matter is that being an actor or artist is something that faggots have gravitated to since time immorandum. When Hollywood started having more power than Washington, and make no mistake it does, then the fags weee able to do things.
Could be. Interesting points, but as a matter of fact the disease is mostly mental, not physical, its manifestations are of the mind, not of the body and hence mostly unseen by casual observers.
I will put as an example a co-worker of mine so to speak. He works along with me but I am just an external and he is from the firm I provide services to, at the request of my employer. I am in a South American country. The guy is ok and cool person. He goes to the gym, studied in France and is part of the elite of his country. His opinion on the U.S. elections: Hillary had the right to win, because it was time to provide and opportunity to a woman to occupy the position and prove her worth. At the moment I was taken aback speechless, WTF. Moreover he swallows hook and sinker the “reality” depicted by videos like this:
If that’s an indication of mental infestation I don’t know what it is. One doesn’t need to dress as a hipster to be hipster…
This is the most bat-shit crazy website I’ve ever seen. Truly sickening, these articles — WTF was this one in particular? I feel sorry for his daughters — and all the hateful comments. I seriously hope to God I never meet one of you.
That is done already by the mainstream media. And the manosphere did that already (here in ROK)
I believe that age is an important factor for men. It takes a certain level of maturity to be a good husband, and both the “beta boy bitch” and the “fake alpha” can grow into a responsible patriarch with experience. Not all of them, of course, not even a majority — but some.
(I myself, for example, was rather clueless when I started seeing girls in my late teens, both about how to attract women and about what I wanted for myself with the opposite sex. It took me almost ten years and a string of more or less dysfunctional relationships to gradually come to insight, by hard experience, about how things work (and still learning…).)
So, I believe that a certain age difference in marriage is desirable. It is probably much easier to find a decent man in his early or mid thirties for your 20-something daughter, than one of her own age.
I have a daughter as well (7 months) and believe it or not, I don’t think it’s as tough as you think. Growing up in a culture is like being a fish in water and many opportunities remain unseen.
There’s a third choice where it’s not beta boy bitches or douchebag PUA’s. I regard Roosh in the latter since he contributes to the problem rather than help solve it. How many nice girls did he bed with his charm that would have made (and later some did) great wives for someone else? Did he improve these women or help drag them down?
I’m going to comment above because I think the Dawn Pine means well, but is mistaken.
You do realize the guy who wrote this article is a rather good example and an ironic one for the moral decline of the west.
Thank you!!!!! 🙂
Divorced? Don’t have sole custody? You aren’t raising them, your ex is.
Shared custody is still raising them. Even if it is shared you are a major factor in their life.
Do you spy your ex-wife while she is with your daughters? If it is not the case, you have no idea what is going on.
Disagree again.
First – it’s ex-wife.
Second – I’m not with them at school, which is long hours. So what?
Even if I “have no idea” (and I some idea) of what is going on, I can still do what I can.
Come on man… school hours? You know what we are talking about…. Anyways, good luck, you are already doing much better than many of the divorced men with daughters I know.
Don’t let the alpha supermen drag you down, man. Yeah, being divorced isn’t ideal but a lot of times there’s nothing you can do about it. I know from past experience (although fortunately I didn’t have kids with my ex). You still can, and should, be the best influence you can in your daughters’ life.
Thank you for the kind words
What’s the purpose of this? Shitting on a guy who probably got his kids taken away by a court?
I would not say it is shitting on him. It is just a necessary comment for distracted readers given writer’s astronomical self-confidence in raising his daughters. Time will say. Good luck for him in any case, I don’t wish him any bad.
Not shitting on nor wishing that on anyone. However if that’s the case though, he’s not raising them,all he can do is give them friendly advice because mom is going to have the most influence on them. Hopefully it works out well but the law of averages doesn’t look too good.
Point taken
As I wrote in the article: “That does not mean I will be successful. I have most of the world against me, including the education system and the media”
After reviewing my initial comment it looks like I was attempting to be argumentative which I was not. I wouldn’t wish a divorce and have to shuttle kids from one parent to another on my worst enemy. I commend you for trying to do the right thing under the circumstances you are left with.
Well you should of proofed it too. In some sections you came across as a miscreant, degenerate, illiterate moron. Just an observation.
As of this weekend, dating American women is out of the question. Talking to a cute girl from Belarus right now. Good god.
American culture rewards females for their negative behavior. Katy Perry doesn’t play musical instrument, doesn’t write her songs, couldn’t win beauty contest, and is worth over $100mm. She sings one song about making out with a chick and society gives her whatever she wants. Attention whoring pays and all young girls growing up in today’s culture know this instinctively.
actually you are wrong… before she got famous she was playing live and writing songs… I think she’s aweful, but credit where credit is due. She writes her songs and writes half the crap for the other tartlets.
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/pictures/9-great-songs-you-didnt-know-katy-perry-wrote-20160401/ashley-tisdale-times-up-20160401
Trolling stone is such an accurate source (sarc).
Girrrrrrrrl power.
http://www.neontommy.com/sites/default/files/users/user444/tumblr_mzkkq13E0I1rq719ko2_r1_500.gif
She’s rather pretty too. Maybe all the alpha supermen on ROK are doing better, but for a mere mortal like me who’s just trying to get by and be the best man he can be, she’s sufficiently easy on the eyes.
She’s not pop star hot, she’s grocery store hot. Tv and movies use to be the creme de la creme of attractive ladies so that even the ugly friend was at least an 8 in real life. Of course that was before Hollywood starting pushing affirmative action for the fat and the old despite no measurable increase in talent.
Oh, ok. So in that case, I guess a father should just learn to roll with the punches and teach his daughters that attention-whoring is all right. There’s no escaping our degenerate modern culture, so you might as well teach your daughter to become an Instagram whore so that she can at least make some money, right?
WRONG! Just because our culture encourages degenerate behavior and sluttiness doesn’t mean you don’t do everything in your power to stop that kind of behavior in your own daughter.
Teach her to abstain from this type of behavior (click image to view at higher resolution)…
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/e7bd83f3282d2f4f777aa4859fa3afb856889bcc56cca89fde354f3df57c463a.jpg
What’s the average age on Rok?
Some things just aren’t knowable.
Some things man was not meant to know… https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/a24902ee4f389ac8eb704ca6699f3f1bcf7bb7f4dddc90a34b30e345acf9da89.jpg
I’d guess it’s uncommon to have really young guys in here, heavy on upper twenties and 30s, and then a long tail out to old age.
Well, I’m 20.
I don’t know the first thing about children or how to raise them (I am pretty good with children in the 18-25 range). Really, I know nothing. I wouldn’t had the first clue what to do to raise a child. That said, coke Christmas time i take the two eldest of my nieces 11 and 9 out shopping, then to the Plaza for Eloise brunch and then to see the Christmas tree and finally to see the nutcracker. They call it princess day and look forward to it all year long. But how to raise them? Instill morals? An education? No idea. Forget red pill. The only pills I know for girls is the birth control pill and plan B.
So my ignorance aside I still must say that the following line struck me as being creepy as fuck
“My daughters start to giggle. “Dad, I don’t know why, but I feel good when you do that,” my elder told me. “It is because older girls are like young girls. They love it when a successful man makes fun of them” I explained. “Also, you see that the waitress was responding well. She likes it,” I add. “
This. I exactly got the same reaction.
I am genuinely surprised more people aren’t creeped out
It depends how you view the context. Text coveys relatively little information
It may be not so much OPs daughters being aroused as feeling secure in having a father who is a dominant male. Dominant males provide more than supplicating ones.
Yeah I can get it and I did preface by saying my knowledge on this topic was next to nothing but still creeped me the f out
You can guess what this is
http://www.manastir-lepavina.org/cms/slike/upload/Sv_%20Gora%20-%20jeromonah%20o_%20Aron%20Dugobradi.jpg
Yes it’s a ‘knee beard’. It extends to the knees. The hair strands of varying lengths resonate with the entire spectrum of wavelengths and bandwidths of energies that are ‘out there’ right under your nose hairs but they blow right by if you lack the correct gague of receptors (hair follicle antennae). Your befulddlement with youngsters, the answers are everywhere. You can either be taught or told the answers prepackaged by some proselytizing lefty who audultrates and perverts truth and knowledge or you can whisk the answers right out of the ether, straight from the cosmos like a big broom whisks dust particles out of the air.
I shave every single morning and on the weekends I shave twice a day
Oh I get it (twice daily on the weekend). You shave two women on the weekends. That’s cool.
Lol! No I actually shave my face in the morning and then before I go out at night. Still your reasoning makes sense
You must be a very hairy person. lol
Men can be creepy as fuck. He has to warn them.
..
He is a role model. He teaches his daughters that their sexual appeal to men has a short shelf life and they better have more to fall back on than shits and giggles should their husbands go from spinning plates to straying far far away. His daughters have a natural man for their father as did Elizabeth I of England.
Take a look at Cosmo. Women know very well that their sexual appeal is temporary, you don’t need to tell them. That’s why they fuck around until their second last period and get pregnant with (not by) the average beta chump, and then GET DIVORCED plus “second youth”. Do you think women don’t know about the attached timeline? The point is if we men, as a group, we are culturally capable of enforcing hipergamy control, and flirting with other women in front of the daughters is not helping at all. I don’t really see how he is a role model.
https://rationalmale.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/smv-timeline1.jpg
Actually, fathers do need to get it through their daughters heads that their sexual appeal to men is fleeting, especially today with all the duck lips selfies and belfies. There’s nothing wrong with a young woman’s focus on beauty and femininity provided she understands she could have more than 40 years after her beauty fades and men no longer come to the yard for her milkshakes. She may apex marry, become a rich widow, and never have to worry her no longer pretty little head about starvation and financial privation. Hypergamy is about shopping for the best male deal. However, romance and finance don’t always play nice together even for submissive samwich makers who keep themselves tidy, slim, and attractive. The author praises his ex, but she’s still his ex.
Good point. Although I should have emphasized Female Imperative (the timeline attached) instead of hypergamy, which up to a certain point, it is understandable.
That timeline! Brilliant.
I have no idea why you try to diss me, but I’ll answer:
1. I have lost some control, not total control.
2. I see that you did not get it even though I explained. Read agai please.
3. I fail to see what you are talking about. What’s one thing got to do with another?
4. Yes I do. That is your call, but they do see me as a role model/someone to get advice from.
Thank you for this advice, good sir. I will consider it deeply as I raise my daughter to be virtuous in this corrupt world.
May God reward your hard work with virtuous men to marry your daughters.
For some time I have been reading here and seeing very valid points on all the different subjects that pass by. There is one thing that I cannot understand and I would be very interested to know how you guys see this.
Rok advocates the red pill way of life. Masculine men who know what leadership is, feminine women who know what modesty and class is, uphold traditional family values and both parents raising their male and female children accordingly (correct me if I’m wrong in any of this)
I completely agree with this. Where I live, there are too many entitled bitches and pudgey weak men. SWJ diots are being given the chance to reproduce here, because our very elaborate social system is keeping them alive with benefits, even though they would probably forget to breath if they would be just a tad bit more retarded.
When Donald Trump won the election I just laughed for hours and hours because for many of us here, he is a sign of hope that the leftist tyranny is nearing it’s end and people with realistic views will have a chance to speak up again without being called a racist/bigot/sexist and being fired from their jobs etc.
But: What I don’t understand about red pill ideology is how modesty in women and traditional values relate to “game” and keeping up your notch count as I’ve seen on the RooshV forum. Also: how does this relate to your own daughters (looking at this article)? Would you be bothered if one of them is a “notch” on some dudes post, because he learned game from the RoK forum and she fell for it?
Nobody here likes the “decline of western women” and their slutty ways, because this is one of the symptoms of society going down the drain.
But on the other hand you need them to keep your game going. It takes two to tango, but with mostly virtuous red pill women around who stay at home and look after the kids, there will be no tango. No sluts, no game. Would a red pill society be worth that to you, or would get slutty women for game from abroad? Not judging, I’m sincerely curious how men (here) look at this.
It’s a fair question. 2 mostly opposing schools of thoughts
1. Lead the revolution
2. Enjoy the decline
It’s a paradox. Admittedly. What I’d simply advise is practise attitude to fuck the sluts, but marry a good, traditional, non-corrupted girl
This seems the obvious answer though I’m not sure how it would work in practice. Under 30 or 40, a man desires whores, yes? He wants to hunt and game and subdue the bitchy girls. He doesn’t want traditional minded, nice virgins. Thats male nature and totally understandable. But if being a bitch and a whore attracts men, naturally the girls will behave accordingly. So now you’re 40, looking for a traditional girl, virginal or at least minimally experienced, to marry and play pater familias with. Where are they? They all became bitchy sluts 25 years ago because that’s what you told them was attractive.
basically….this is the problem that is rarely ever addressed on these parts.
sure women wont behave overnight….but why should they? women the master of shit tests would simply call your bluff and silent treatment you or ignore you know youll cave. and they are right.
it would take the entire ROK Red pill alt right folks to cold turkey stop fucking whores and stop spinning plates. to literally drop out and say “nope, no whores for me”
but it wont happen. men here talk a big game….but i truly wonder how big of a game most of us here actually have. this is the internet where everyone is superman.
for the traditional conservative red pill values to ever make a dent the young men need to tame their horny thirst and act the part. its the only way….we cannot keep fucking the hookers and expect our daughters to turn out any different. ultimately these women….even the rare unicorn ones are going to say “i just want to be loved” and whore it up….why? because they wont be able to find a reliable male that isnt whoring it up as even the good red pill males can’t keep their pants on.
if the red pill is as valuable as everyone here claims….there needs to be a way to actually put it into action and i dont mean the get laid part of it.
Exactly this.
I’m fine with whatever they do, but people (both men and women) have to be realistic. You are right. Men cannot fuck hookers and expect the women in your own environment to turn out as little angels.
There are still some modest, relatively calm women left who look for men they can truly love and respect in a traditional family setting (believe it or not, we do have genuine emotions apart from looking after our own interests and being unstable). They take care of their apperance without letting it all hang out, they really look for that monogamous relations ship and the one man they can have children with and have a nice life in which you support eachother as partners.
But that’s not the type of women you get, if you flirt with waitresses in front of her and brag about your notch count or think you are entiled to “extramarital pussy”.
A bad woman will get angry, smash that guys car and fuck a random dude just to get back at a guy like that, making her a skank. A good woman will just look elsewhere and vanish off your radar, because they will not be wasting their time on low quality guys who disregard their families and marriage.
tl dr: I agree, if you behave like shit, you get shit. Goes for both males and females.
I believe that the concept of a woman leaving her man because he cheated is a feminist concept.
The reason I say this is that there are so many examples in the past of powerful men who cheated on their wives, and even had illegitimate children, and the wife never left them. An obvious example of this is Thomas Jefferson, who fucked his slave and had a bastard child with her. I’d be willing to bet the majority of kings and powerful men of the past cheated on their wives, and the wives just accepted it as normal.
I’m not saying there’s nothing wrong with cheating if you’re a man. Of course, the Bible says for men not to cheat on their wives. I’m just saying it’s not the end of the world if a man cheats. The concept of a woman leaving her husband because he cheated is a feminist concept. It is meant to demonstrate equality (“women can’t cheat on men and get away with it, so why should men be able to cheat on women?”) and independence (“I don’t need no man to take care of me. I can leave his ass if I want.”), which are both feminist values.
Jefferson didn’t cheat. He entered into what was once called a common law marriage with his wife’s half sister and slave several years after his wife died. Agreed that the difference now is most women can financially support themselves. She’s not, as they say, “stuck” in a bad marriage due to financial insecurity. (Another reason wealthy women do still often stay. They could support themselves but not so well as the rich husband) I suspect another reason is blame. If a man cheats today, society blames the man. He’s lying cheating scum who couldn’t control himself. Years ago, society would look at the woman and ask her what she did or didnt do to send her man looking elsewhere. So why codemn yourself to the neighbors scrutiny? Religion probably plays a part too. My aunt told me one reason she stayed with my cheating uncle was she “made a vow before God.” How many women would think that today?
I may have been wrong about Jefferson, but it is a fact that many powerful men and world leaders cheated on their wives, and the wives would not dare leave. Even if a woman had a rich family to support her, she would most likely not leave her man just for cheating. First of all, it was considered shameful for a woman to leave her husband and date other men, regardless of whether the husband cheated on her or not. Second of all, a woman in that situation probably had no desire to leave her husband. Just because a man gets some action on the side doesn’t mean he can’t love his wife.
There’s a reason why when men stray, it’s called “cheating” but when a woman strays, it’s called “cuckolding.” “Cheating” implies that the man broke the expected rules, but the game (i.e. the marriage) continues. “Cuckolding” implies that the man is forever a cuckold. If he has any dignity left, he cannot stay with her.
I believe that a woman naturally doesn’t care too much if her man gets some action on the side, as long as he still loves her, and he doesn’t fall in love with the other woman. Even if the man has an illegitimate child with another woman, his wife will only be upset if he devotes significant time and resources to the bastard. I believe the main reason a modern woman will leave her husband over his cheating is because feminism promotes “equality,” and so it has become socially unacceptable for a woman to stay with a cheating husband. The last thing a modern woman wants is to be seen as “submissive” and “dependent” on a man.
Women didn’t leave their shitty husbands back then because of social mores that forced them into miserable situations. You’re either batshit crazy and out of touch with reality or lying to yourself as with everything else so that you have the upper hand if you think women don’t ‘naturally’ care if their husbands betray and disrespect them by cheating. Women can still love their husbands if they get some action on the side as well. It’s not any more disrespectful or betraying if a woman cheats. Women will sometimes grit their teeth and stay with a cheater for their kids, but they will be consistently bitter and unhappy and the relationship will never be the same. The idiots here base their opinions solely on what benefits them and gives them the upper hand. They don’t have even a shred objectivity or reason. They then project this flaw on all women.
There are plenty of women will accept that and forgive the man. I know a few. They still love their husbands very much, but it’s also clear that there is a huge financial gap going on, which is one of the reasons the woman sticks with her man. I asked one of those women about how they felt that their husband cheated on them, and she was visibly upset about this even though it happend years ago.
I think there’s a big difference in cheating as in a “one time thing” or a complete extra relationship next to the one he has with his wife. The latter will be deemed more unacceptable. But I guess it all depends on the woman or man in question to see what they can forgive and what not.
But if he makes a slip up and she forgives him and stays with him, it would be hypocrite if he dumps her as soon as she makes one slip up.
If one slip up makes her a whore and unfit for marriage, one slip up ( to me ) makes him a manwhore and also unfit for marriage. Cheating once is maybe something you can work past like the women, but I (since I can only speak for myself) will always fear it will happen again.
I personally see it like this: I look for a reliable man with leadership qualities. In return I take care of my appearance, stay in shape, try and educate myself, even earn some money and make sure that the chores that need to be done at home, get done. My man has nothing to complain about.
A good quality man to me means you don’t lie to me because I will find out. I always do. If you are not reliable, then you miss one of the key elements I’m looking for and to me there is no point of keeping you here. To me, this also shows that you lack the morals that I find important because you know it’s wrong but you don’t care and go ahead with fucking a skank anyway. Ergo: bad quality man with no impuls control.
If you cannot even be faithful in the first few phases of a relationship, to me, this is a warning of way more problems up ahead. Even though I’m against the feminist “screw him and yo kids and drop everyting” method, I would sadly probably say goodbye and look for a more reliable, higher quality man to have children with.
Maybe if I’m older and if I have children with the guy, I will be more accepting towards these kind of things and it will not feel like the end of the world. But with my current age and fitness I’m not and I don’t have to be.
LOL. As I’m reading your comment, I’m thinking “This can’t be from a regular ROK reader. This must be from a hater or a troll…”
I continue to read, and then I get to “THE IDIOTS HERE base their opinions solely on what benefits them and gives them the upper hand.”
Suspicion confirmed. Why do you come here if you disagree with everything written here so strongly?
“But if he makes a slip up and she forgives him and stays with him, it would be hypocrite if he dumps her as soon as she makes one slip up.”
You’re absolutely wrong. First of all, it is far more likely that a man, given the opportunity, will cheat. A man’s sex drive is a lot stronger than a woman’s, regardless of what your feminist professors told you. A man can be 100% satisfied with his wife and still cheat just because the opportunity is available. It is simply in a man’s nature to always be on the hunt for fertile women to spread his seed, regardless of his marital status. On the other hand, a woman cannot “spread her seed.” If a woman gets pregnant by another man, she is actively denying her husband the right to reproduce with her, and tricking him into raising another man’s child. Furthermore, it is not in a woman’s nature to be on the hunt for a fertile man when she is already married to one. It is not really possible for a woman to be satisfied with her husband and still find it necessary to cheat. For a woman to go through the trouble of going out, meeting another man, and either taking the time to get to know him, or risking her life by going home with a strange man she just met, she would need to be dissatisfied with her husband in some way. A woman who truly loves her husband would not go through all that trouble.
“I think there’s a big difference in cheating as in a “one time thing” or a complete extra relationship next to the one he has with his wife. The latter will be deemed more unacceptable.”
That is very similar to what I said. A woman will only care about cheating if she feels the man is falling in love with the other woman. It is not about the sexual act in itself, but rather about the man’s feelings for the other woman. There is a HUGE difference between how you would feel if you found out your man went to a whorehouse and how you would feel if you found out he had a mistress who he was falling in love with.
On the other hand, as a man, there would be NO DIFFERENCE WHATSOEVER in how I would feel if I found out my wife hired a male prostitute and how I would feel if I found out she had a boyfriend on the side who she loved. If anything, I would lose MORE respect for her if I found out she hired a prostitute. I would not consider staying with her in either scenario.
“If one slip up makes her a whore and unfit for marriage, one slip up ( to me ) makes him a manwhore and also unfit for marriage.”
So you’re implying that there’s no difference between male sexuality and female sexuality, that there’s no moral difference between a promiscuous man and a promiscuous woman. I have nothing to say. It’s all been said many times here at ROK.
Oh, and one more thing. I’m not necessarily defending a man lying to his wife and trying to deceive her. In the past, since a man would be less worried about his wife leaving him for cheating, he felt less of a need to lie to her. I’m not saying he would straight up tell her about his cheating like it was nothing. Most likely, the wife would not ask about it, and if she somehow found out that it was going on, she would just ignore it.
I can’t disagree with Rob. Men cheat for somewhat different reasons and their cheating … I almost hesitate to use the word … is usually unavoidable. It’s just the nature of men, and it’s often not the personal insult women may feel it to be. A women cheating is another thing altogether. Difficult concept for a woman to wrap her head around, but there it is. This though: “I believe that a woman naturally doesn’t care too much if her man gets some action on the side, as long as he still loves her, and he doesn’t fall in love with the other woman.” That’s just not so, Rob. Women care. Unless they’ve married solely for money, they’re emotionally invested in relationships and love in ways that men aren’t able to be. That’s the nature of women. She may ignore it, she may blame herself, she may resign herself to the inevitable, but I’ve never known a women cheated on who wasn’t heartbroken or enraged or both.
The pathetic souls here don’t have a chance of changing if they don’t realize how wrong and mentally unstable they are.
Well, I am not a woman, so I obviously don’t have first-hand knowledge of what a woman feels when a man cheats on her.
I am not arguing that it is A-OK for men to cheat. Obviously, the Bible condemns male cheating. There are also very real consequences that result from cheating. If a man cheats and gets the woman pregnant (which was all but inevitable throughout most of history), that means less resources and time for his wife and family, because he will have to devote at least some time and resources to his bastard child. So I totally understand why a woman wouldn’t want her husband cheating on her.
I guess my point is just that man cheating on his wife is not morally equivalent to a woman cuckolding her husband. It just isn’t. I think it is utterly ridiculous when (and this is something I’ve seen in movies and TV shows) a woman is angry at her husband for cheating on her, so the husband agrees to let her cuckold him in order to “get even,” with the intention of continuing the relationship afterwards.
I think it ultimately comes down to the physics of sex. When a man cheats on his wife, he is penetrating some other woman. Of course, his wife has a right to be angry for the reasons I discussed above and in earlier comments (possible pregnancy, feeling unloved by him, rightful jealousy, etc.), but at the end of the day, she (the wife) still belongs to her husband. However, when a woman cuckolds her husband, she is allowing herself to be physically penetrated by some other man. As a man, the thought of some other man penetrating my wife causes me to have a visceral reaction of disgust and anger. At that point, as soon as it happens, that woman no longer fully belongs to me, because an important part of her will always belong to the other man. Even if there is no pregnancy, and she apologizes to me and means it, and even if deep down, I WANT her to continue to be my woman, it simply cannot happen. That part of her is gone, and belongs to that other man forever. There’s no getting it back.
By the way, I believe the same is essentially true for a woman who does not save her virginity for marriage. If I, as a man, were to marry a woman who has, let’s say, 3 previous sexual partners, then she will never be fully mine. An important part of her will always belong to those 3 men. The only difference (and it’s a big difference) is that a man who marries a non-virgin is well-aware of what he is getting into. The woman is not deceiving him. On the other hand, a woman who cheats on her husband IS deceiving him.
Why are you here?
You must really enjoy the company of “wrong” and “mentally unstable” men.
I’m cradle Russian Orthodox so you won’t see me condoning adultery. Nevertheless, while it’s perhaps not ideal, it is human nature. We’re all sinners. Your preference for a virgin bride is commendable but in my experience rare – at least outside my church. “I guess my point is just that man cheating on his wife is not morally equivalent to a woman cuckolding her husband.” Oh, yes, absolutely. You know what’s interesting though? As women become increasingly masculinized, they’re hearing the same. Allow a man to cheat on you and your female friends will accuse you of being a pushover, a doormat, or the like. There’s no shame in being cheated on, but there is shame in forgiving the cheater. Funny. Anyway, thank you for the patient explanation, Rob. It’s an interesting perspective and I appreciate it. 🙂
Interestingly, “adultery” was originally defined (according to the Old Testament) as follows: If a married woman has sexual relations with a man other than her husband, they are both committing adultery against the husband. This definition did not include a man cheating on his wife. There are verses in the new testament that expand the definition of “adultery” to include men who DIVORCE their wives. This is interpreted by modern Christians as meaning that adultery includes male cheating, but as far as I know, there is nothing in the Bible that defines it as such. Just to clarify, I am not saying that male cheating isn’t a sin. I’m just saying it doesn’t fall under the Biblical definition of “adultery.”
http://www.christianbiblereference.org/faq_adultery.htm
That website claims the New Testament redefines adultery to include male cheating, but when you click on the links and read the actual Bible verses referenced, they only mention men divorcing their wives, not merely cheating on them.
Of course, as an Orthodox Christian, you are probably more familiar with the Bible than I am, so please correct me if I’m wrong.
You mention modern women accusing their female friends of being a pushover, doormat, etc., for not dumping a man who cheated. This is typical feminist behavior, but it doesn’t really make sense logically. Throughout most of human history, if a woman left her husband for cheating, she would be hurting herself more than she is hurting him. In addition to losing her means of financial support, she would be condemning herself to a life as a divorcee who no decent man would want to marry, knowing that she gave her body away to a man she would ultimately leave, not to mention making her own children into bastards. If she did manage to find another man, he would almost certainly be a lower-quality man than the husband she left, as any self-respecting man would not marry a divorcee with children and an ex-husband.
Nowadays, a woman who divorces her husband would not have as much of a problem supporting herself financially. Divorce is also more widely accepted, and there are more men willing to marry divorcees. But the fact of the matter is, a woman who divorces her husband still has to live with the fact that she gave herself away sexually to a man she would not ultimately stay with, and is causing harm to any children they may have together. Furthermore, although societal norms have changed, I still believe that any TRULY self-respecting man would not marry a divorcee who up and left her own family just because her husband cheated on her.
Rightfully I should have said fornication. But when was the last time you heard someone say ‘fornicaton’? So I concede to modern definitions. The Church Fathers weighed in on this of course but long story short fornication is a sin too.
Yes, of course. My point wasn’t to split hairs over semantics, but rather to point out that even the Church makes a distinction between male and female cheating; a distinction that has become blurred due to the use of modern feminist language.
There are a lot of examples of subtle changes in language that affect how we see relationships between men and women. “Adultery” is obviously one example. Another example would be the term “virgin,” which to my understanding, originally only referred to women. Male virginity was not a thing until more recently. Another (non-verbal) example would be wedding rings. Men only started wearing them in the 1960s.
Anyway, I get what you’re saying. Fornication and male cheating are definitely sinful. My comments were really more for the other people commenting here, one of whom said something to the effect of “if you would expect your wife to stay with you after you cheated on her, then you should stay with her if she cheats.”
If a man gets another woman pregnant, then his wife has to share “resources” with her. Under that same logic, it’s imperative that men also do not cheat, to make sure the woman’s child gets access to enough resources to survive. It is also evolutionary advantageous for women to cheat – more men procreating with that woman means that the strongest seed/man gets the child. It really does go both ways.
Doesn’t make sense. Nature of women would also be to allow competition to have the strongest mate. Same logic would apply if appealing to evolutionary biology.
It’s probably good to welcome other opinions on the site if we make the same criticisms about SJWs and their sites.
Of course “it goes both ways” in the sense that male cheating is a sin just like female cheating, and like you said, if a man gets a woman other than his wife pregnant, that takes away resources from the wife and the children he has with her.
I was not arguing that male cheating is ok. It is bad. Female cheating is also bad. However, just because two things are bad doesn’t mean one can’t be worse, or more serious, than the other.
We’ve already agreed that it is bad for a man to cheat on his wife. I will now focus on showing why male cheating, despite being bad, is not as bad or as serious as female cheating.
You mentioned that when a man cheats, he runs the risk of impregnating the woman, and therefore having to support a child out of wedlock. In the absence of reliable contraception (as was the case throughout 99% of human history and evolution), a man who cheats on his wife certainly risks getting the woman pregnant, but at least he has the option to pull out, which — assuming he actually pulls out — reduces the woman’s chances of getting pregnant to almost zero. On the other hand, if a woman decides to cheat on her husband (remember, no contraception), she has no control over whether the man cums inside her or not. She can say “pull out” all she wants, but it is ultimately up to the man whether or not to do so.
Additionally, if a man fathers an illegitimate child, he can still father children with his wife and live a (somewhat) normal family life, assuming he has sufficient resources to raise all his children. But if a woman gets pregnant by a man other than her husband, she has to devote herself entirely to that baby for years, and the husband is no longer certain of his paternity of ANY of his children with her, since she has proven herself to be a cheater.
You also argue that “more men procreating with the same woman means the strongest seed/man gets the child.” That is only true if she has sex with multiple men within a very short period of time. Otherwise, she will just get pregnant by the first man she happens to sleep with while ovulating. Once she sleeps with the first guy, the egg becomes fertilized, and it won’t matter who is the “strongest” of the men. In order for a woman to truly get the strongest genes for her offspring, her best strategy is to find a high-value man with strong genetics and lock him down, ensuring all her children will be fathered by him, and not by weaker men.
On the other hand, for a man, it makes sense biologically to fuck as many women as possible to spread his seed and father as many children as possible, even if he is married and has a family. We might (rightly) consider this type of behavior to be immoral due to all the bastard children who would grow up without a father around, but it makes sense from a purely biological standpoint. Women do not have the option to “spread their seed” like men. A woman can only have one child every 9 months, regardless of whether she has sex with 1 man or 1000.
For a woman, sleeping with lots of men will not cause her to have a greater number of offspring, and will not make her offspring genetically stronger, either.
So yes, it does “go both ways” (i.e. male and female cheating/promiscuity are both bad and can lead to consequences), but that doesn’t mean that they’re equally bad. One is way worse than the other, and leads to far more serious consequences.
OMFG… Your Fucking Delusional… So mother fucking delusional it’s fucking mind altering….. you poor misguided fool… She will fucking take you to the cleaners… Ignore it… in this day and age … Fucking as if Dude… Wake the fuck up..
“Furthermore, although societal norms have changed, I still believe that any TRULY self-respecting man would not marry a divorcee who up and left her own family just because her husband cheated on her.”
This statement just shows how much misunderstanding there is between the sexes. By stating that that a woman leaves her family “just because” her husband cheated on her, trivializes the effect that cheating has on women.
You mention that you would feel a visceral sense of disgust and anger if your wife should ever cheat on you. While those are expected emotions from such a situation, they are not necessarily more intense or more justifiable than a woman’s emotions of jealousy and anger if her husband wasn’t faithful to her.
Either way, you’ve admitted that you’re not a woman and cannot begin to understand how it would feel to a good and faithful woman, for her husband to step out on her. No one would argue that being ‘submissive’ and ‘dependent’ on her man would be a lot more readily accepted by some women, if men wouldn’t take that as an advantage to cheat on her whenever the impulse struck him strongly enough. I can’t help but think that this common pattern of discounting female emotions and wrongfully assuming that a woman wouldn’t care too much about cheating, is one of the major reasons a lot of women felt very mistreated, dissatisfied, inadequate and insignificant, hence feminism and its consequences today.
Also, nice try with shaming men who marry divorced women, after their first husbands have hurt them deeply. I’m truly glad that most of the rest of the world doesn’t subscribe to your definition of what a ‘self-respecting’ man is or does.
So I assume you’re a woman. I can’t tell from your name.
I assume you’re a woman who was hurt by a man, probably divorced. If not divorced, then you were in a committed relationship that ended badly. Am I right?
Your comment is pure emotion and no logic. You pretend to be against feminism, but in fact you defend it. You argue that a lot of women felt hurt and mistreated by men’s natural behavior and society’s acceptance of it, and that’s what led to feminism. You’re literally arguing that feminism is a natural consequence of basic human nature and societal structure and norms.
I am not excusing men who cheat. I agree that it is bad and would not happen in an ideal world. But there is a reason why pretty much EVERY SOCIETY ON EARTH has been more accepting of male cheating than female cheating. In fact, we have a special word for female cheating: “cuckolding.” And by the way, this is not unfair to women. If anything, you can argue that it is unfair to men, because a man whose wife cuckolds him is shamed a lot more harshly than a woman whose husband cheats on her.
Why would you come to ROK (on an article that is a month old, no less) with your quasi-feminist ideas? And you even have the nerve to claim you’re against feminism? Let me guess, you’re against the “excesses” of third-wave feminism, but you’re perfectly fine with first-wave and most of second-wave feminism. You just think modern feminism “goes too far.”
http://www.rooshv.com/why-the-female-anti-feminist-is-a-feminist-in-disguise
You make a LOT of assumptions, Rob. And then use straw man arguments to counter silly assumptions that you’ve made entirely on your own.
First of all, no. I’m not a woman. I have never been divorced or had a relationship that ended badly or whatever silly narrative you’ve concocted about my life. Just because I’m willing to look at things from a different perspective, a quality that many on here are lacking, does not mean I have to have experienced it first hand.
Also, I never pretended to be against feminism. Yet, another assumption that you’ve made. There’s no quasi feminism here, I’m literarily arguing that feminism is and will always be an inevitable response to the patriarchy. This is why western countries can never return to the patriarchy. If it truly was a system that ‘worked’ and everyone was satisfied with it, feminism would not have had the edge way that it did and taken over so many things, as it’s done now. Too much has happened; going back is impractical. You all can deny it all you want, but if the patriarchy ever tries to rise again, feminist ideals will ALWAYS rise against it.
But I get it. It’s important to maintain the hope that the patriarchy is coming back, especially for many of the guys on here. They all circle jerk to fantasies about how things will go back to the good ol’ days of total male dominance. The ‘manosphere’ has been going on for what? 10 years? What have you guys achieved? Men going their own way? (Who, by the way, feel it necessary to constantly remind everyone that they’re ‘going their own way’.) Men practically encouraging the slut culture? Less marriage? More tension between the genders? If that was the goal, then well done!
No one said cuckholding wasn’t a terrible thing and I can certainly see how female cheating is a lot more frowned upon than male cheating. But the problem arises from the nonchalant attitudes, such as yours, which disregard the importance of the mental turmoil a female that has been cheated on, goes through. You know why? Because such mindsets, which is common in the patriarchal societies, translates to little to no consequence for male cheaters. Besides religious conviction (and even this isn’t full-proof), there isn’t much motivation for a man not to step out on his woman if he lives in a society where his wife would practically be forced, out of sheer necessity, to stay with him. He gets to eat his cake and have it. Now, we live in an era where women don’t have to put up with a man’s infidelity. Due to consequences such as his wife leaving, and potential breakdown of his family, a man would think twice about cheating, or at least hide it better out of shame. Are there still many women that stay with cheating husbands? Sure. But at least it’s not because they have no other options and are basically forced to do so. Now, she has a choice. There’s really not much I can do about you thinking my reply was more emotional than logical, but stating that a lot of marriages cannot survive without trust and spousal integrity, is as logical as can get.
You ask why I’m commenting on a site like this? Simple: I wanted to. This might not be a popular place to express these views, but so what? Only an idiot would let being called fancy names like ‘mangina’, by a bunch of fools on the internet, affect the way he views the world and his beliefs. I see you’ve all built quite the man-cave here, but no one is moving towards any actual enforceable or practical solutions. You just spew crap and fuel revenge fantasies. So most likely, things are just going to stay the way they are or further worsen. At least I, along with most of you here, would be dead before this world turns into a complete shitshow. Either way, good luck.
So you’re a man, but you claim to understand “the mental turmoil a female that has been cheated on, goes through” better than I do.
You seem to know a whole lot about the “manosphere” for someone who is a feminist and considers us all to be misogynists. Do you spend much of your spare time sitting around hate-reading ROK and other so-called “manosphere” sites?
And yet despite all you claim to know about everyone who reads ROK, you really know very little. You sarcastically ask “what have you guys achieved?” and then you say that we have encouraged slut culture, less marriage, and more tension between the sexes. While some men on here might consider themselves to be “pick-up artists” and have no problem with the slut culture, I disagree with them. As for marriage, I am very pro-marriage, but I think men should have high standards (and women should, too). I think men shouldn’t marry sluts (and I think women shouldn’t marry deadbeat bums). As for the MGTOWs, I think they’re idiots and so do many people who read this site. This is not a MGTOW site.
You make a shit ton of assumptions for someone who accused me of “making a lot of assumptions.”
Just out of curiosity, what is your deal? What kind of world would you like to see? I’m a bit confused by some of the things you say. You say you’re not against feminism and you complain about “patriarchy,” but you also talk about the “consequences of feminism” (in your last post) and you seem to be against slut culture and the decline of marriage. I really don’t get where you’re coming from. You seem to contradict yourself a lot.
I don’t claim to understand the female mind better than you do, but I can empathize with it. I can recognize that when someone breaks trust, whether man or woman, it affects the other person very negatively and puts the relationship in jeopardy. I don’t know why it’s difficult for you to understand that you don’t have to literarily be in someone’s shoes to get what they are going through.
And yeah, I’ve gone through quite a number of these manosphere articles. Is that a problem? Lol are you actually trying to shame me for going through and trying to understand the opposing arguments to my beliefs? Classic. The only way to understand where someone else is coming from, is to actually read about or listen to it as much as you can. This is common sense and there’s no shame in that. Also, I never said you were misogynists. Where have you even seen me use that word? Some here may actually hate women, but frankly, the majority are really just ignorant and like to follow the deranged herd mentality without actually experiencing anything themselves. I’m willing to bet that a good number of the guys, especially the ones that claim to be pick up artists, never actually have much success with women, but they refuse to look inward to things that they could improve. It’s all the women’s fault, of course.
What assumptions have I made? You’re just parroting everything that I’ve said without giving any actual opposing arguments against it. You agree that there is an increased slut culture, less marriage, stupid MGTOWs (never said this was an MGTOW site by the way, but MGTOW groups are technically part of the manosphere). So, saying these things aren’t assumptions; they’re truth. You personally might disagree with the actions of pick up artists and be pro-marriage but you cannot deny that the general consensus here, is that men should avoid marriage, because apparently women are heartless creatures and AWALT.
Also, in what ways am I contradicting myself? If you want to see a true example of contradiction, re-read your 2nd paragraph and then the first sentence of your 3rd paragraph. You initially say that I know a lot about the manosphere (lol at hate-reading), then you back track and say that I know very little. Which is it? While you try to figure out your assertions and all over the place reasoning, my stance is that while I’m not against the feminists ideals, I disagree with the slut culture and the decline of marriage. These two things are consequences that have actually arisen from both feminism and the manosphere movement. But they are not the core tenets of feminism. Choice, partnership and equal opportunity for education and the workplace, among other things, are. A world like this, is what my ideal world would look like. You frequent these sites and are obviously a supporter of their ideals, but you also claim to be pro-marriage. Is the manosphere overall pro-marriage? Do you agree with everything the movement here pushes for? Exactly.
No one movement is absolute or does everything right, but my issue with patriarchy is that (even if it could come back, which it can’t), it’s still not the answer. You cannot make half the world population have so much power over the other half and not expect backlash. Hence, my notion that feminism will always rise against patriarchy, and appropriately so, I might add. Besides, the reason I even brought this up circles back to your original attitude regarding male cheating. An attitude that is common within patriarchal societies. So, as long as people here keep pushing for patriarchy, against the feminists that are pushing for equality, we would never move forward.
You claim that feminism will always rise against patriarchy, and yet patriarchy has been dominant for the vast majority of human history.
I agree with you that there is too many people with anti-marriage AWALT attitudes in the “manosphere” (which is a stupid term, by the way). That is changing, though, Roosh, the guy who runs this site, made a name for himself as a pick-up artist, but has recently changed his tune and embraces traditionalism.
You claim that women were horribly oppressed throughout most of human history, and that we need feminism to fight against that oppression. However, you were not alive during patriarchal times, so there’s no way for you to know how women felt about it. Yes, the early feminists were women, but they are in no way representative of what the majority of women thought and felt. In fact, the early feminists were almost exclusively very wealthy women, so, by definition, they are not representative of the majority of women in society. In my opinion, women were a lot happier back then.
I agree that you should try to read opposing points of view, and it’s good to know that some leftists (i.e. people like you) actually read sites like ROK and take them seriously, rather than just dismissing our opinions right from the start. However, if you’re arguing that “patriarchy” is oppressive and that “feminism will always rise against patriarchy,” then we are coming from such different places that there’s really no point in continuing this discussion. You clearly see the world very differently than I do, and we likely never agree when it comes to these topics.
Ah, I see. Now that Roosh is getting older and can’t get the usual number and quality (hot and young) of women that he used to, he now embraces traditionalism? Good for him. Does this scenario bare any resemblance to the females that everyone here insults, who spend their younger years ‘riding the carousel’ with supposedly alpha males and then when they get older and realize that they can’t snag those anymore, they settle for beta males? I agree with the general consensus that it is very difficult to turn a whore into a wife, but a player is not going to become a good husband either. The inability to pair bond, after you’ve whored yourself around, may be more common, but is not exclusive to women. For the woman’s sake, I hope I’m wrong, but I’m willing to bet that he would not be able to commit fully to whoever he decides to settle down with. He will always be itching for excess variety and will most likely cheat on her. But I guess for people with mindsets like yours, that might not be such a big deal, right? Lol, I truly hope none of you ever have to find out what it’s like to experience the consequences of betraying the trust of a good woman.
“In my opinion, women were happier back then”.
As you’ve accurately stated, this is still just your opinion. You say that because I wasn’t alive during the patriarchal times, I couldn’t know how they felt back then. This is true, but neither were you. How do you know women were happier back then? Studies that attempt to assess this are usually too subjective and prone to inaccuracies. One person’s definition of happiness is different from another. Also, unless there is some kind of re-incarnation of the very same women from patriarchal times, unto these times, you cannot accurately assess whether her happiness increased or decreased. But choice always adds a new dimension and value to things. If a woman wants to live within a patriarchal community and marry a man that has those beliefs, she’s more than welcome to do so. And if she wants a partnership marriage where male infidelity isn’t so readily dismissed, then she would be better off with a man that upholds this.
But you’re right. We seem to have reached an impasse. No worries, have a happy new year.
You seem to be starting off with the assumption that men and women are equal (with the exception of their genitals and a few other physical differences), and then using that assumption to reach all your conclusions.
For example, you started off by saying that because Roosh now embraces traditionalism after having lived a promiscuous life, he is no different than women who “ride the carousel” and then decide to settle down and get married later on. This only makes sense if you start off by assuming men and women are basically equal.
As far as the whole male cheating/female cheating, you (correctly) realize that you would feel absolutely terrible if a woman ever cheated on you. However, you are then assuming that a woman would feel the same thing if her man cheated on her. (I’m not denying that a woman would be upset if she got cheated on, but it would not be the same as what a man feels).
Here’s something to consider, if you haven’t already:
You seem to have a problem with the anti-marriage point of view that some people have (and I agree with you on that). Keep in mind that the traditionalists and promoters of patriarchy — who you hate so much — are actually some of the most pro-marriage people out there. Believe it or not, we (“we” as in traditionalists, not ROK readers) actually want to see healthy romantic relationships between men and women.
Anyway, take care and happy new year.
Modesty in women cannot be achieved overnight. It is a cultural change that couldn’t occur in our lifetimes. A girl who has had intercourse in the triple digits is not going to become quality wife material because some flashy real estate billionaire is president of the United States.
Because the quality of women is low, men have two options: Sit out the dating world and be lonely socially awkward virgins, or learn some game and have some success with women.
Personally, I don’t care about having one night stands, and sex with degenerate sluts doesn’t do much for me, but having the ability to attract women is a valuable skill. Also, if you’re really curious, you can search the archives here for discussion on the differences in men sleeping around vs. women. Women lose the ability to pair bond.
Get back to us when we are in a society of “mostly virtuous red pill women who stay around the home and look after the kids” because that’s not the world any of us have ever lived in.
No, I know. It will not happen anytime soon. Men are exploiting and enjoying the decline of society, the paradox explanation is fair enough. But I was wondering, if some miraculous day the red pill will happen and you have the society and high quality women that you wished for, will men accept that there will be a lot less gaming on their part?
I definitely am enjoying the decline in society. Less gaming? No woman wants a broken bird.
So if you not screw around that makes you a broken bird? I know a few nice girls and the nice girl generally does not want a guy where it’s not the question if he had STI’s, but which one’s he had. Sexual experience is a plus, fucking dozens and dozens of low quality skanks is not, because it shows us you have bad taste.
If you read the early writings here, you’ll find even the site’s author himself had a hard time accepting game, because it’s so against his natural desire to just want to treat women nicely and with respect, they way our grandparents did. Yes, some guys enjoy sluts, just as there have always been sluts, everywhere, through history, but I’d wager most men are just looking for a nice girl to settle down with. I tried to find some examples, but there are just so many articles published on this site, it’s hard to wade through them all.
But really, what’s the point in such a hypothetical question? If we lived in that society, the men also would be different. We are responding to and reacting to the women that we encounter. We change our tactics and our behavior to whatever finds favor and success with them. Chances are, in a high society, the answer to that question would be blatantly obvious to you.
My point in the hypothectical question is that everyone here is striving to achieve a certain ideal (the red pill lifestyle, to keep it short), for themselves or for their family/society. You strive after an ideal in hopes of actually achieving it one day. If that happens, it leaves you with a whole different scenario.
Not one that will be reality anytime soon, but I’m was curious to see how men would react and reflect on their (gaming) behavior if red pill lifestyle would actually become the norm (again).
I bet Liberals asked themselves “why bother with the hypothetical question that Trump could be president har har har”, yet here we are. 🙂
My point is that simply if you asked men from 1910 how they would respond to women who had promiscuous sex with dozens or hundreds of men before marriage, lacked proper manners and courtesy, and divorced raped their husbands, the men would have no idea how to answer that question. They couldn’t even fully understand what such a scenario meant, without experiencing it. Just as most men today have no concept of what a true, feminine woman is like. I would say if you have never left America and visited a traditional society, you can’t answer that question honestly. As for the rest, as stated, I believe most of them want a traditional marriage and home life.
I assume you’re a woman, based on your username.
Just because I want the world to be different doesn’t mean I (or anyone else) shouldn’t take advantage of the way the world actually is. Let me give you an example:
I don’t believe public universities should exist. I don’t think taxpayer money should be used to pay for the education of those who can’t afford it. Now, does that mean I am a hypocrite if I attend a public university? Should I bury myself in $200,000 worth of student loans to attend a private university, just so that I am not seen as a hypocrite? Of course not. As much as I hate the concept of public universities, the fact of the matter is that they exist, so I might as well take advantage of them.
The same thing I’m saying about public universities can be said about sluts. I hate the fact that there are so many sluts, but that’s not going to prevent me from taking advantage of them, should the opportunity arise.
Banging sluts and believing in traditional family values are not mutually exclusive. In the earlier days of ROK, there were guys who would say things like “I would never get married. Even a nice, religious, virgin girl will eventually become a cheating whore. I’m just gonna bang sluts until I die!” That’s the kind of attitude that would be incompatible with traditional values, but you see it less and less around here. Even Roosh, who used to be sympathetic to the “bang sluts, never get married” point of view, has changed his tune over the last couple years, and now believes in traditional marriage.
Think of it this way: If I have the opportunity to fuck a girl, and I choose not to, what do I get out of it? Is that woman going to be any less of a slut because I chose not to bang her? Of course not! If I don’t bang her, some other guy will, guaranteed. So it might as well be me.
Because by “banging sluts” you’ve put a premium on slutty behavior. You’re essentially telling young girls at the cross roads that only by being a whore will she attract a man’s attention. Women tell men everyday that money, confidence, and power will win them over, this is what they want, this is the key to attracting women. And men oblige. Or at least attempt to. Why would women respond differently? If you want sweet natured, loyal virgins, you’ll need to put a premium on them, not the sluts. Why are unicorns so hard to find? Supply and demand.
Wrong. By banging sluts, a man is not “telling” young girls anything. He is merely taking advantage of what the girls are already offering.
Why should I care about some random girl who I don’t even know? Why should I care what kind of “message” I am sending her? I care about my wife, my sister and my future daughters. I don’t care about random people who I don’t even know. Why would I pass up an opportunity to bang a young slut? So that I can feel good about myself for supposedly not “encouraging” sluttiness? I don’t think so. I’ll take the bang.
Furthermore, your logic is off. Men who pump-and-dump whores are sending a clear message to women that they SHOULD NOT act like whores unless they want to get pumped-and-dumped. The men who encourage whorish behavior are the men who MARRY whores.
I’m not suggesting you care about random people. I’m wondering if circumstances have been created which compel potential good girls to become whores. Maybe your position is that all females are born either whores or unicorns and no amount of cultural pressure or game will change that? If so, fair enough. Not sure I agree with that theory though.
No, that’s not my position.
I have a daughter – 10 years divorced.
I didn’t read it all.
But, I’ve read some of the comments.
Being divorced is almost inevitable. If not, a great majority of men are subjugated, and overworked…and most likely miserable and a terrible role model.
I spend about 30-40% of the time with my kid, on my terms, my rules, and guidance.
But, in the house of a wealthy controlling woman? I’d be a fucking pissant servant…
So you can actually be a better role model as a divorced dad. 2nd only to a traditional nuclear family. And definitely not a modern lying cheating whore that many are with…
Including the head of 21 convention…
Acknowledged.
See the conclusion
A good start would be teaching them to submit. Yeah I know, “misogyny!” I don’t care. Sue me.
Two things all kids should be taught 1/ Self Defence 2/ Musical Instrument
Phenomenal article. It’s a shame that the author doesn’t have a blog, I’d love to follow it if he puts out this type of material.
Thank you, and I enjoy reading you.
I plan a blog, but alas, it will be in Hebrew.
Wasn’t sure where to put this, but here are some more Australian companies to boycott, and avoid working for or doing business with (notice how many are in the mining, energy and manufacturing sectors that rely on men doing hard, physical work):
https://www.diversecitycareers.com
#6 is good to see as this so rarely gets the attention is deserves. In that sense the entire post is good to see. About #1 … hoping your daughters are attractive. Otherwise, you might find that lesson did more harm than good. Concerning the harem, absolutely no judgment but children do as mom and dad do, not as mom and dad say. So I wonder if that’s best kept out of their sight.
#1 – they are attractive, but I’m biased.
Harem – extremely out of site. Most of my friends don’t know about it and my girls have never seen a women in the house.
eh i find most women are naturally attractive….they only become ugly by doing any of the following:
1. tattoos
2. being fat
3. dressing like a prostitute
4. going crazy with the makeup and jewelry.
5. short hair
6. terrible diet
7. they smoke and drink.
usually those 7 murder their looks well beyond anything they naturally have. in addition to that….take care of their skin and hair.
all of that usually translates to having at least a 7/10 girl which is honestly good enough. once she avoids the above and takes care of her skin and hair…..then its a matter of acting feminine and dressing well but not slutty.
most girls arent actually ugly…..they just get buried underneath a pile of feminist bullshit.
I don’t know, that seems overly generous to me. Certainly a plain girl might increase her attractiveness with effort (salon,gym,etc) but, apart from plastic surgery, she’s still plain. A big nose is still a big nose with or without a ring piercing it. Pretty and ugly are extremes, most girls are plain. To be fair, most men are as well. But a man’s worth is primarly his standing in the world, not his bone structure.
eh….a plain girl if you will…..can remain attractive simply by taking care of herself better than she would otherwise…..for example i’ve seen plenty of fat land whales who have gorgeous hair…..they’d probably go from 1/10 as they are now to a good 5/10 at a bare minimum just by dropping the pounds. the thing is women arent naturally fugly. it usually takes effort to make them fugly. they are supposed to be hot so they can get our attention and make babies.
no they arent going to all be super models….but i am still willing to bet just by getting them to take better care of themselves they’d become a lot hotter…..sort of how we like to tell men to take better care of themselves which creates SMV with the ladies.
so yes while most would still be plain…..i’d rather have an abundance of plain than an abundance of fugly.
Yes. This 1000x over.
Very interesting article, thank you!
Thank you Sir
Oh, if only this had been written twelve years ago when my daughter was much younger. But it can’t hurt to have her read it, and then discuss the points with her, to see what she thinks, and try to get her to understand some of the main points. Anything and everything I can use to help her keep from being a cock-carousel-riding slut is worth its weight in gold. Only God and time will tell if I’m successful.
Good luck.
Usually we advocate “Show, Don’t tell”. See if you can somehow “show” her consequences.
Stellar article and one which RoK has been sorely lacking; the detail and examples were much appreciated.
Glad to be of service
Your harem – I wouldn’t call it a harem until they all be domesticated and servile under your roof. And your ex, her estrangment is her own hiatus. To the patriarch, she’s a runaway, immodest and unkept. Divorce ‘separation’ papers mean nothing to the patriarch who presides as supreme judiciary within his castle.
Think what would your place, your home, your castle be like under supreme patriarchy? It’s Thanksgiving. The ‘ex’ should be reeled in, reigned in and disciplined. She should be in your lap right now clearing her throat and spitting a generous hocker on your dickhead while the fingers of your harem concubines oil your staff and guide it into that wench of a wife. Her mother worn puck is but loose BEEF CURTAINS
http://thumbnails112.imagebam.com/33806/0d029d338054520.jpg
Her ass is so damn loose . . but it’s wet and it slobbers up the place for concubine#1 who’s a degree tighter. She straddles your horse until concubine#2, the tight nubile boa constrictor gets a hold of your goose to finish things off. You go from loose to tight to tightest and then . . . BLAP. Now THAT’S what you call a patriarchal harem. And your official wife, she massages your shoulders all the while, no jealousy, no bitchiness, nothing but loving loyal SERVITUDE.
Ask yourself, can YOU find it to manifest such a harem? Do YOU see the levers to yank your wayward ‘ex’ out of the ditch and strap her collapsed junk across the firm upright boards of patriarchal firmament?
And do YOU inform your daughters that the supreme patriarchal renniassance is approaching right over the horizon? Yes like a thundering storm it cometh. DO YOU HAVE YOUR BEARD ON? YOU can impart the dawning of the AGE OF MAN to your daughters but without beard it is fruitiless. Words from a beardless face are nothing but hot wind coming out of bare naked visible lips – – like what comes out of a woman’s mouth. No woman can speak with a beard. No woman can even have a beard. No woman can speak anything basically. Their communicado is to their master, their concubines or sisterwives and children and is personal, not to be broadcast. A woman logically processes at best a scant 30% of words coming out of your mouth. A beard broadcastifies your thoughts whilst you speak and your words become more than the jarbled jibberish a woman perceives. Your words explode like a massive emotive stroke in her prefrontal cortex when spoken with lengthy beard.
Get ye beard on man.
That’s ruined my Sunday. I was having roast beef for lunch as well. Another great cultural tradition ruined for me, ironically not by cultural Marxists but a follower of this site.
Eeh . . .eeh . . ‘go fish’? It’s a good family get together game too. Aw just eat the beef. A good beef cow gave itself up for the sake. Really.
UUUUUGGGHHHHH!!!!
Come on, man!
I had two step daughters and I found (Without it sounding dippy hippy & wishy washy) that staying grounded and always answering from my natural masculine energy made them feel safe, emotionally held and able to just be young happy feminine women. Also, having clear boundaries and demonstrating your masculine presence on a daily basis with (And this is the key word) ‘consistency’ to be most effective.
Daughters are like all females, if you don’t put your foot down (Have clear and present boundaries)they get bitchy, throwing a barrage of shit tests while trying to undermine you constantly. As a father you are the testing ground for all the relationships they will have with men throughout their lives.
An example of how not to bring up daughters is demonstrated every day with the hordes of self-entitled, slutty, chemically dependent, backstabbing and vapid consumerist bitches strutting around our city centers every day plugged into the mobile matrix of the western culture.
but how do you do that? how do you raise them this way?
Boundaries, pointing out the realities of the sexes, clamping down on self-entitlement and mirroring this stuff with your spouse…and try and send them to a more traditional school if you can.
“I had two step dauhters…”
So you married a single mother? How did that work out for you? Are you still married? I’m not being sarcastic. It’s a serious question.
I didn’t marry her. She was rotten to the core. I moved on. It was a painful red pill lesson.
How can you have step-daughters without being married? That’s kind of the definition of the word “step-daughter/son”
They all end up crazy.
Near perfection (because no article can be perfect when you ‘re talking about human beings)
I would put an emphasis on primary eductation too, because it’s traditionally the mother that taught the abilityto read fluently, to handle school homework etc.
Men, then teach work ethic and how to handle the outside world when kids growns up.
Good point. I work on their work ethic, but should pay attention more
I clicked on this article with high hopes, since this is a topic I was hoping to see covered here at some point. However, I have to say, I am quite disappointed.
First of all, the author doesn’t even know how to write properly in English. I understand that English is not his first language, but at least get an English-speaking friend to look at it, or post it somewhere online to be grammar-checked, before publishing.
Second of all, I don’t know how old the author’s daughters are, but I don’t think topics regarding sexual attraction should be talked about so openly between a father and his daughters, especially if they are pre-pubescent. Even if they are past puberty, it is still a boundary that I would not cross. I know I am not the only one who was creeped out when the author mentioned flirting with waitresses in front of his daughters, and the daughter telling him she “likes it when he does that.”
I believe that the only way to raise a daughter (or a son, for that matter) correctly is to be married to the child’s mother, and for her to share your values and ideas when it comes to raising children. This article, in which a single father gives tips on raising daughters, is just as ridiculous as an article in which a single mother gives tips on how to raise sons, which we would rightly ridicule.
Don’t get me wrong, of course as a father of daughters you should guard your daughters’ sexuality like your life depended on it. You should not let them dress slutty, and even if they dress “normal” (i.e. the way most girls dress these days), it is probably still too revealing. You should have the final say on allowing them to go out dressed a certain way, and who they are allowed to hang out with. You should do everything in your power to make sure your daughter does not date or hang out with boys by herself, until she finds a boy or man you approve of who is willing to marry her. If she kisses a boy at school, or she goes on a date without your permission, that is not the end of the world, but that doesn’t mean you should just let it happen. I would even recommend considering an all-girls school, at least from junior high onwards. I would not want my 13- or 14-year-old daughter in a room with 16-year-old boys for 8 or 9 hours a day without my supervision. I don’t care how extremist that makes me seem, I would not trade away my daughter’s sexuality in exchange for not being seen as “extremist.”
That being said, there are some things a father doesn’t discuss directly with his daughter. My girlfriend’s father never once discussed sexuality explicitly with her, and he still managed to raise her with the right values. There are some things that are better left unsaid. If something of sexually explicit nature needs to be discussed, it is better for the girl’s mother to do it and not her father.
This guy never claimed to be Hemmingway. He was not claiming that he is overtly hitting on girls; he was teasing as a an example. So cut the writer some slack.
Also, your choices of being married or not isn’t always your choice. You get what you get sometimes. Additionally, your daughter is going to decide her sextuality. When I was growing up back in the “good ole moral days” of the 1980’s; I knew gal’s pregnant in 9th grade with good parents. I also know bad parents whose daughters didn’t think about boys until they were in their 20’s. I wouldn’t claim your extreme; I would just claim that in some instances you will need to take extreme measures. With the internet, they have access to all this stuff that you think should be hidden from view. Also, you may not “know” your girlfriend- a lot of women play the “good girl” and go feral on you when you least expect it. Thinking your the mighty one is going to set you up for an epic fail.
This guy is divorce and feeling guilty. He tries to overcompensates by being this awesome dad.
No
I was awesome before. The red-pill made it more so
lolknee could do with a ban too – lol
“I believe that the only way to raise a daughter (or a son, for that matter) correctly is to be married to the child’s mother, and for her to share your values and ideas when it comes to raising children.”
So important. It’s a toughy though, in this world where a woman who abandons her husband is seen as a “strong independent woman” with no stigma attached to divorce at all. My wife is a devout Catholic from Central America and we’re married in the church, so she believes this is the only marriage she gets and that adultery is a mortal sin that will send her to hell. Not sure what a guy who marries a godless woman can do. Game, game, game her all the time and be as masculine as you can and hope for the best, I guess. I personally wouldn’t advise marrying or having children with a woman for whom religion isn’t the center of her life.
Agree with pretty much everything you said. The only thing would be that in this day and age, being religious doesn’t necessarily mean a girl has the right values. There are plenty of American Protestant women who go to cucked feminized churches where they do not save their virginity for marriage to a doughy-faced beta who has never been in a fight.
Catholics also tend to have the wrong values, as evidenced by the current pope. I remember seeing on a Catholic forum one time, a man posted something to the effect of “My wife cheated on me with a black guy and got pregnant. I am so thankful to God to still have her in my life. I feel a bit uncomfortable about raising another man’s child. Is it wrong for me to feel this?” And the majority of the top answers were telling him to “man up” and “be thankful that she chose to stay with you.” There were some responses that were more red pilled, but they got down-voted and were near the bottom.
I hear the Orthodox are more red pilled.
My overall point is that religion alone is not enough to ensure a woman has good values, at least in the West. My girl, who I plan on raising kids with soon, is sympathetic towards religion but was never religious herself. Her parents sent her to Catholic school (which she hated) but never go to church themselves. I was an atheist when I met her, and she didn’t have a problem with that. And yet, I have never met a woman with better family-oriented values than her.
I basically agree with you, especially about feminized American versions of Christianity. My wife is Central American, and based on what I’ve seen the church is much more conservative and traditional down there. I’ve told this story before, but before she came to the US her priest told her to beware of feminism because it is “the work of Satan and not a good basis for family life.” I have trouble imagining a priest getting away with that here in the US.
Congrats on finding a woman with good values. Come to think of it, you’d think that more women would realize that traditional Christian values are superior for family life, even if they’re not religious themselves.
I have a cousin that ended up looking like her great aunt, like a stuffed pillow and I thought she would never get married. She found a good man who was no great shakes himself but made more money than me and they fell in love and have a wonderful daughter. So looks are not that important.
Beta bucks. Save her! and in a decade she can cash in $$$$.
Yeah but she is fat anyway and that puts her at the bottom of the human race, if we can call fat people humans…
There are a few guys that like the big cattle. Its sick, I know- but it’s out there.
Yea so basically guy still is on the short end of the stick. No offense.
First off, I’m older and out of “the game” and have been for close to 30 years. It’s like I’m on the outside and looking in. For all the talk of feminism and game hereabouts and feminism is the cause of all evils, how much does game help to further the present situation? While I can certainly see the benefits a young man can reap by learning how to attract and what to expect from women(game) I can also see where it is abused by those who know it. Want to be able to bang sluts at will? Other women see this and think they should be the same way because sluts get all the attention therefore causing good women to be in short supply.
Realize a good one is hard to find and they are worth their weight in gold, don’t waste them.
As a FO3 soon to be FO3+1, I tend to agree Rob Banks below.
believe that the only way to raise a daughter (or a son, for that matter) correctly is to be married to the child’s mother, and for her to share your values and ideas when it comes to raising children.
i dont know if you are a psychopath or the most alpha dad ever.
Could be both.
Excellent article.
Great article – raised 2 daughters myself who are in their early and mid 20’s and on their own. The point you made about them fearing you – they know clearly what your boundaries are.
Also, when my youngest was 11 or so, there was an incident that came along that i had to explain to her that any girl can be a slut, without any effort on her part. It’s easy. It takes a special person to be better than that, and to be better than their classmates and friends.
Only problems I had with them is when their mother got involved… You know, the type that wanted to be their “friend”. I have plenty of friends; I didn’t need my kids to be friends with me.
Yes. That “friend” problem is an epidemic.
Like you just don’t know. And most children, i am afraid, recognize and feed off of it, much to THEIR detriment.
I was suspect when the author said he had only been red pill for three years.
But when he declared his atheism, I gave up and stopped reading.
His daughters will still have their hands full because of his ignorance.
“A father is a daughter’s first love”
“A father is a daughter’s first Prince Charming.”
It is true for my sister. She unconsciously keep measuring every guys who approach her using our dad as her standard. Even for small things that often unnoticed by most people :
A guy doesn’t have a deep, calm and stern voice like our father? –> next him.
A guy orders a sugar coated whatever-chino instead of black coffee? –> next him.
A guy has unhealthy amounts of selfies and glued to his iPhone? –> next him.
A guy has piercings/tattoos/smokes? –> next him
Our dad had never even told her to do so. It all comes naturally.
I’ve found that seems to be the usual case for women raised with a good father figure. As for the girls without one…. not so good….
Maybe this one could be an example?
One thing I don’t understand is the disparity between how you treat your daughters and how you treat women, like those waitresses. You respect your daughters but not women. Why is that?
One can treat people differently, based on circumstances. I fail to see the problem
How were the circumstances different?
What did the waitresses do to deserve disrespect?
Negging is not disrespectful. I was teasing.
Negging is selfish manipulation; intentionally hurtful one at that. You can’t do that to someone you respect.
And again, he wouldn’t do that to his daughters, hence the discrepancy.
I disagree.
You won’t sleep with your mother but would with your wife.
Hence the discrepancy
But you have reason not to sleep with your mother – because she wouldn’t like it and hopefully you won’t either.
What reason did he have to disrespect those women?
You are rationalizing it.
Your answer is incomplete.
What answer? I’m the one asking the question.
Why did he disrespect those women?
Your answer about sleeping with your mother.
You treat different people differently. Simple
Yes, but what’s the reason?
I don’t have sex with my mom, but I do with my wife because my wife likes it.
I don’t play fetch with my wife, but I do with my dog because my dog likes it.
I don’t disrespect my daughter, but I do disrespect other women.. even though they don’t like it.
So, why do it?
Treating people differently is an essential part of the world. You don’t do it because “they don’t like it”. You get different things from different people, and treat them differently.
You assume I disrespect females. I have no idea why you think negging is disrespectful, but that is your issue. For me, teasing is not disrespectful, but you may think otherwise.
BTW – they like it, so your argument has a fault in it.
Negging is the process of insulting someone and therefore undermining a person’s confidence to make them feel bad in order to become more vulnerable to your advances. That is disrespectful.
Would you want it done to you? Then why do it to others? Other people have feelings just like you, so it’s a double standard – you wouldn’t want to be insulted but you insult others. That’s a discrepancy.
Again disagree.
Negging/teasing is not insulting.
I get teased by my friends and even other people sometimes, and have no problem.
So no double standard. Why are you so out to get me? Is something wrong?
So, you don’t see a difference between teasing and negging?
According to Wikipedia, the definition is:
“Negging is a rhetorical strategy whereby a person makes a deliberate backhanded compliment or otherwise insulting remark to another person in order to undermine their confidence in a way that gains approval.”
Your friends don’t tease you to insult you or undermine your confidence, certainly not in order take advantage of you when you’re vulnerable.
That poor waitress was being nice and putting up with your immature bullshit because it’s her JOB. How stupid can you be to think she was flattered or enjoying being harassed and disrespected by some misogynistic insecure loser? Your daughters will grow up, realize how awful you are, become painfully embarrassed about your public displays of your piss poor character, hate you, and may even go out of their way to behave in ways you disapprove of just to spite you. There’s no other possible outcome with daughters that have such a blatant piece of shit for a sperm donor. Oh and implying that you’re an ‘alpha’- no one’s buying it bud.
Jesus Christ.. Could it be possible for this “article” to be riddled with any more typos??!!! Seriously, I hereby offer my proofreading services for free. You want legitimacy? It starts with proper editing. Fuck!
I understand that you are angry with my typos.
Will contact you on my next article.
Excellent!
Have a new one, can you review it?
I’m on RVF if it helps
Almost all articles on Return of Kings suffer from poor writing (that is, poor spelling or grammatical errors). Attributable in part to foreign authorship?
Eh.. a lot of non-native English writers here. Goes with the territory. And lots of commas in the wrong spot, wrong idioms, and in some cases wrong pronouns. But the message is… mostly all good. 🙂
shouldnt there be a section on avoiding PUAs?
There should be a whole article on that one.
Multiple lessons of moral authority outside of your own parenting also helps. The best is to introduce her to your cultural heritage, faith or girls scouts / sports. SCHOOL is all about indoctrination and will never be a good place to just hope for the best.
See item 3 on my list
Good article. I think you’re striking a good balance between those red-pilled lessons, and some measure of freedom for your daughters.
Harem management? How is he going to teach that to his daughters?
Not teaching that to my daughters.
If I had a son, maybe.
Maybe you should…considering your daughters are most likely going to end up with a guy like their father. Let them know what their good ole dad is really like.
No.
Don’t think so.
So you dont want your daughters part of a harem but its ok to do to other women. Ok I get it, the harem women are whores, but your daughters are going to be angels for another guy therefore avoiding the same fate.
I, unlike you, don’t suffer from a madona/white complex.
And I can choose to be different person with different people
So you are a two faced fraud. Lovely. When your daughters grow up and see you for who you are, it wont be good.
You are so cute when you’re upset
Me upset? No it is more like you are going to be rather upset. I have seen this scenario play out in real life and I can tell you, women don’t like when the men they trust and look up, treat other women disrespectfully.
I believe you are confusing your experience with mine. My experience is different. Thanks for the heads up though. Wish you well
It is not my experience, you are mistaken. The experience of others I have seen. Im going to be very well thank you, I am well aware of my surroundings. I wish your daughters only well.
Great article. I have daughters myself and my wife does set a good example which the girls imitate. I also indicate that their primary role later in life is to find a good man, become mothers and support their family. Everything else is secondary. If they want to persue an education in a real subject (STEM), fine, but they will need to be prudent with their time.
Thanks.
I also emphasize that even with a career, their family comes first.
I want to know if there is a fine line of how to negate or at the very least manage rebellion or blowback during the teen angst years. Especially in a more spiritually based household (the relationship with God through biblical reinforcement type of atmosphere, not lip service lapse Catholics or charismatic, prosperity fag churches)?
Hypergamy, slut tendencies, dark triad traits, on top of all the external forces (media, school indoctrination, the “system”, etc) will be stacked against us.
Dawn Pine means well, but he’s divorced and this is like a guy who lost money in the stock market giving financial advice.
Modern “traditional” dating is flawed and a product of some messed up chivalrous thinking. About a century ago, there was a sexual revolution of sorts and women went out on their own dates with men and some whored out. It was frowned upon in the beginning but gradually came to become not only accepted but viewed as optimal romance. It’s not. It’s sick. It’s a form of prostitution where women use sexual wiles to get men to beg for them. This leads to a lot of beta males that the women don’t respect so the author of this piece wound up either growing a pair later and wanting to leave his wife OR she got bored with him.
In the past, dating was chaperoned meaning that sex was taken out of the equation. There are several ways to do this but the effect is for the couple to determine how compatible they are without the pressure of sex or cruel manipulation of each other. Americans have been unusually barbaric in twisting this ritual to grill the suitor instead of showing him hospitality. After all, he’s a potential future son-in-law so he should be welcomed. When I was overseas, I viewed visiting a girl’s parents as both an honor and delight. Only non-well intentioned men would regard a long, friendly sexless courtship with disdain.
Because the courtship rituals of old were twisted into Hunger Games for men to beg for sex or for clever PUA’s to circumvent, they were abandoned and forgotten.
In addition, one of the worst elements of the modern courtship ritual is that of women being apathetic about romance (waiting to be picked up by players or begging betas) OR sluts. Again, there’s a third option: Being a responsible adult and expressing interest and engaging in “game” similar to that of men. A plain looking woman with a fraction of game that men here engage in can easily wind up well off. For example, a 5/10 I knew wound up putting up her clean bio on popular dating websites and got hundreds of responses. She put in a few hours work and out of that, she got (short) doctors, IT professionals, and other hungry but top level betas that had significant potential. It’s kind of like my wife and I shopping at the “manager’s special” section of Staples and the grocery store. There’s a lot of bargains if you put in just a little effort.
After all, I did a similar thing. I married a Ukrainian woman who was practical and far above my “punching level” here in the states but appreciated that I earned a good living and was stable and honest. The fact is I deserved her but since the American culture treats men with such disdain, that it’s difficult for men to believe it. People who earn an honest living are given little respect in the states in a massive media culture of “get rich quick” and seemingly everything available if you have unlimited funds. Sadly, this is catching on in the east as well but in a different way since there isn’t a tradition of chivalrous man-bashing there.
I never had daughters and was kind of neutral when it comes to raising daughter (like i will let them do their thing, whether be tomboy or not…) but after this if i ever had daughter i will try to raise them traditionally like girls. Other parts of the article are good pieces of advice, i will definitely come back to read this in the future 😛
Also good luck raising your kids mate.
“Yes, female behavior should be controlled, but that is easier said than done. What can a divorce father do? Spanking is out of the question (legally).”
No, spanking children is not good according to me. Yet, I think that spanking one’s girlfriend or wife is one way to make the relationship works on the long term. Girls must therefore be educated in that perspective. How? I don’t really know.
10. Home School your children (Son or Daughter). That simple.
Dawn Pine knows all about Penny Peterson… http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/dreamworks/images/4/40/Tumblr_n5kihuhALw1qh97ido4_500.gif
That realization that no amount of game will ever win you this unicorn.
Hahaha. Shelter your daughter and teach them to be subservient like this and she’s going to be fucking every black dick in arms reach just to spite you. I seriously hope all of your daughters are whores, because their fathers are horrible.
I’m disappointed all this is is a return to enslavement in an era of technology that will erase 60% of jobs as we knew them by the 22nd century. This is not the 1950’s his daughters will be weak and depend on some man when they need to depend on themselves.
They will be the ones complaining about how much less money they make. Never realizing it was a choice. I follow the lady principal. A lady can do everything.from fixing the car to evening dress and hosting a dinner party for the educated and powerful, yet able to handle the uncouth. Still myths that will not prepare for a future where they may be the ambition and brains and what they need is a companion who dovetails skills no one who must compete. I have not interest in a 50’s female as so pictured useless.
I see people everyday in quiet desperation because they were sabotaged or torpedoed. Not a pretty sight.
I choose freedom. Not trading one master for another.
awalt
Good stuff.
I love this, I definitely intend raise my daughter in a feminine manner.
Throw away the TV before they are born, at least get rid of network TV and be selective on what movies to watch. Princess movies, sitcoms, feminist saves the day movies…all set up a false sense of reality for women. And when they turn 35 and find their attention fades with their looks, they end up miserable.