313 thoughts on “ROK Undercover: What It’s Like To Attend An Eastern Orthodox Church Service”

1. When you do the Catholic churches, please don’t go to a Vatican2 one. Do the traditionalists.
   Thank you.

   1. This this this this this.

   2. how can you tell the difference in general. I know that here in Manhattan St. Agnes Church is known to be the bastion of conservative Catholicism — or at least it was when I paid attention to things like that (~1-0-15 years ago).
      Believe it or not, the catholics of NYC are generally fairly conservative. Our Cardinal, Dolan, is, politically, very conservative and doesn’t pull punches in his opinions which are generally unpopular with the larger, lefty, nyc audience.
      For instance, he publically called on people of faith in all major religions to not comply with any laws regarding same sex marriage recently. Just straight up said “fuck em”
      He was a Benny 16 appointment.

      1. Interesting. They are different spots of resistance from what I understand, even among the ‘mainstream’.
         Well the latin Mass and how people are dressed are important, along with no silly things like handshakes or grouphugs after the Pater Noster. And also, most women wear cover their heads and wear dresses while most men are in suits.
         @JohnFerdinand wrote a nice comment in the Mormon’s comment’s section :
         “if you want authentic Catholicism, the easiest way to find it now is
         pretty much finding a church which does traditional Latin masses every
         Sunday. Generally speaking, when a parish advocates regular Tridentine
         masses in 2016, they’re trying to keep it as old school as possible. And
         if the priest’s sermons are ‘Hell is real and most people choose to go
         there, just read the Biblical stories’ instead of ‘God loves everyone
         even if you aren’t Catholic, that’s my opinion anyway’, you’re on the
         right track.”

         1. Yeah St Agnes does all latin mass. There are actually a bunch here which, again, is probably due to the fact that NY Cardinal is a really conservative kind of guy. I am not really sure if that is how it works though…that is, if a more liberal cardinal can control that kind of stuff or if it is handled on a parish to parish basis.

      2. Cardinal Dolan allowed homosexuals to march in the St. Patrick’s Day Parade in NYC, and WAS AT THE FRONT of that Parade.

         1. I feel there was more to that story having to do with politics and funding. The St. Pats parade is anything but religious anyway. Just a bunch of drunken cunts. I wouldn’t judge based on that. That said, I am not a member of the church so I am not really the most knowledgeable. I do know, however, that he has been a public advocate for conservative issues.
            He is far too conservative for my taste but since, as I said, I am not a part of the church it doesn’t bother me all that much.

         2. I live in NYC too, and I think what he’s referring to is that gays were allowed to march under their own (rainbow) banner, as if it was a gay pride parade (and dress similarly as well).
            One parade isn’t enough for the sodomites. They need to take over the Irish parade as well.
            Notice how the sodomites only insist on marching under their own banner at the St. Partick’s day (white, Irish) parade, and not at the Puerto Rican parade or the West Indian (caribbean) parade.

         3. Agreed.
            For the record I think all parades are gay.
            But your point is totally correct anyway

         4. They would get their asses kicked at the PR or WI parades, thats why…

      3. You can tell the difference by the Masses the N.O. Mass is in the vernacular & directed at the people and the Latin Mass (the Mass of the Catholic Church) is in Latin & directed towards the altar. Also make sure to ask if the mass is done in union with Francis, if it is don’t go.
         Also if you open the church doors and it’s nothing but old people….that’s a NO church

         1. Interesting. I wouldn’t go anyway. DOn’t want to evaporate all the holy water. But I always like knowing about this stuff.

         2. Ha in that case please don’t. We need the Holy Water.

         3. If you run out you can swing by my church and have a holy whisky. Islay Island Malt.

         4. I’m an Irish-Catholic. So I go to that church too. Pretty sure its a law somewhere.

         5. yes. If you don’t show up frequently enough to either church a bony fingered nun materializes out of the ephemera and pokes you with her finger.

         6. Ahhhh….Laphroaig, Lagavulin, Bowmore, and Caol Ila!
            I drink them and then piss Speyside!

         7. Laphroaig cask strength is my fav

      4. It depends on the local priest who has the relationship with the community. I have an aquintance I went to HS with who became one. We had a few beers together a couple of years ago and I asked him about the internal power struggles inside the church. He said it’s a real fight behind closed doors and very political. Some know if the tried to push some of the crap the current Pope is spouting, the pews would be empty by next Sunday.

   3. I’ve have found a very interesting youtube channel held by a Catholic bishop that made me change my mind about Catholic ideas..: He has a lot of video and is ready to answer any question particularly from atheists. He event talks about movies:
      Just a few:
      Limits of tolerance (feminism):
      
      “youtube Heresies”https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qj0V7JhMJ3w
      The New atheistes
      
      .

      1. Google is paying 97$ per hour! Work for few hours and have longer with friends & family! !ro381f:
         On tuesday I got a great new Land Rover Range Rover from having earned $8752 this last four weeks.. Its the most-financialy rewarding I’ve had.. It sounds unbelievable but you wont forgive yourself if you don’t check it
         !ro381f:
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   4. Latin Mass? Or is there more to it, a certain order?

      1. There are several traditional orders. SSPX, SSPV… It’s an entirely different kind of service. All together.

         1. I was raised in a Vat2 church, it was, ‘nice’, not bad, just ‘nice’. But niceness is not enough to keep a young man’s attention or obedience for long.

   5. word

   6. Seconded! He wouldn’t be going to a Catholic Church if he went to a V2 one.

   7. Absolutely. The Catholic Church is the largest traditional religion in America. While Catholics in America may, by and large, ignore the Church’s teachings, Catholic doctrine regarding patriarchy, divorce, and contraception are still the gold standard for traditional Christianity. I strongly urge you to visit a Traditional Latin Mass (aka “Mass in the Extraordinary Form”) to witness what full-bodied Catholicism is all about. The best Traditional Latin Masses are staffed by either the FSSP or SSPX:
      https://www.fssp.org/en/messes.htm#USA
      http://www.sspx.org/en/community/priories
      At my FSSP parish church, 25% or more of the population is under 18, and there are plenty of attractive, single white women.

   8. The article writwr is very, very wrong. For example predestination is a CALVANIST idea that even Roman Catholics abhor.

      1. And I remember learning that God is a unique God in three distinctive persons. I’ve never heard that the Son and the Holy Spirit are the same person.

      2. Wrong. Thomas Aquinas, Ludwig Ott all affirm predestination; they simply embrace the paradox of free will being compatible with predestination. Whereas Calvin was very either/or and affirmed that predestination precluded free will and based his TULIP theology out of that.

   9. Those are very hard to find. I live in NYC the traditional latin mass is almost impossible to find sadly.

2. The official religion of the Soviet Union?

   1. That was atheism.
      The Orthodox Church had first been forbidden and slaughtered then brought back along with patriotism by Stalin at the start of Operation Barbarossa to boost Russian’s moral against the Germans, since it turned out that you can’t motivate the average Russian to fight to the death for atheism and internationalism.
      It was a setback toward traditional Russia, with the difference that now the Church was controlled by the communist Party .

      1. I was about to pounce on this but you handled it qyite aptly.

3. Here’s what it’s like to talk to a religious person…. ANY religious person.

   1. Is that a criticism? It isn’t clear what you mean.

   2. Just because you’ve never talked to someone doesn’t mean you can’t share accurate facts about that person.

   3. Doesn’t matter how much you talk to god. However, if god talks back to you there is a padded room with your name on it.

      1. Or a crown to put on a French King’s head, and Burgondese and English, wanting to burn you alive.

         1. everyone always wants to burn me alive. smh.

         2. People talking to God and starting social movements are a recurrent phenomenom in French medieval history. Doesn’t matter if you believe or not that they were talking to God, but the fact that the entire country believed them and that they slaughtered either pillaging hords of unemployed mercenaries, went to Crusades or kicked the English out, illustrates how differently society thought in these days.

         3. Must be your similarity to Ms. Ark.

         4. Question is: Did they do it because they believed he had talked to God, or in fact, had any real understanding of the concept of God, or was it simply perfectly normal convincing rhetorics just as modern politicians use them, only that they threw in the word “God”?

         5. I have a smart phone.

         6. Do you have God’s number?

         7. 42

         8. That’s not the point. And you’re free to have your own interpretation. The point is both members of the elite and of the common people did sincerely follow such people who had visions, – people who came from very diverse spheres of society -, and it shows how the society was an entire different planet, compaired to modern times.

         9. Just talked to God, we need to kick the English out
            @Joanofarc.
            #Frenchlivesmatters

         10. Douglas Adams, right?

         11. Yup

      2. So I take it you do not have internal monologue? You’re a fascinating person. How do you think? Do you have flashy intuitive stuff passing before your eyes?

         1. well done.

         2. I have my bright moments.

   4. How do you know?

4. I used to live in a heavily Greek dominated area and still go there from time to time. One thing I really enjoy is going there on greekster when I go house to house to people I know both socially and through business. They all have a (or more than one) lamb roasting on a spit. You stop by, make nice, let them try to sell you their ugliest daughter, flirt with their pretty niece, drink so ouzo or, if lucky, raki, eat a few bites of lamb and move on. You make the circle a few times getting progressively more drunk. Those people know how to have fun.
   The night is great. You go out and the orthodox church has what I have dubbed the “Wizard Parade” THis is when all the clergy dress up like wizards do a huge parade down the streets and all the greeks come out dressed up. The old timers looking dignified and you youngsters dressed like they are going to a club called “HORE”
   This has been my primary interaction with the orthodox church other than the Russians I have boned and I must say it is a pretty good time.

   1. Had a high school friend who was Eastern Orthodox and attended the Greek festival they held every year. Tasty lamb and sweet Greek wine was in order that evening and quite a treat. Will definitely have to attend again.

      1. Greeks are generally a fun and congenial lot. Also, the fathers aren’t insane about the greek girls marrying other greek guys….so long as the guy has a good job — at least in my experience.
         I have a lot of greek contractors who work for me and every year they want me to eat lamb, drink sweet strong booze and have a fun time.

   2. Damn you, now I feel compelled to go eat that grill plate at the Greek around the corner.

      1. opa

         1. Definition of opa: “OPA is a Greek Word that may be used as an ‘Exclamation’, or ‘Utterance’, or ‘Declaration’, or ‘Affirmation’ or a lovingly gentle way of telling you to ‘Stop’ … depending on the situational context. ”
            You must have meant the last version.

5. Are there really very many virgins?

6. Good article, I thoroughly enjoyed it. You said 3 religions were the most conservative in America, I’m assuming you mean Amish and Orthodox. What is the 3rd one?

   1. The 3 he covered were mormonism, islam, and Orthodox Christianity.

      1. Thank you.

7. I spent a semester working mornings in an Orthodox church in Chania, on Crete in the early ’90s, and had classes in Byzantine history from the priest of the church. The priest was a Scot with an impressive beard (the beard seems to be an an essential qualification – any Orthodox priest without a full ZZ-Top-style beard is probably an entryist SJW). He had a Greek wife and kids, a healthier custom than the Catholoics, but being married meant he couldn’t become a bishop. His parish church was small but historic, from the Venetian-era and in the heart of the old city, with many old icons as well as frescos.
   Some observations:
   *no pews
   *worshipers constantly entering, leaving, and milling about during the service
   *music written Byzantine-style, which is very different, no notes but note changes, no keys but modes
   *middle-aged women the most frequent visitors outside services
   *real beeswax candles for votaries (thin tapers you light in aid of prayer, usually extinguished by the sexton after about ten minutes and returned to the other candles)
   *lots of brass, which is polished by hand
   *some icons have many small silver or silver-plated representations of various body parts hung around them; these are put there by worshippers praying for the health of that part
   *every church is dedicated to a saint, that saint’s day is the feast day of the church, and at least in Chania, Crete, that means a real feast, with wine, served by the Bishop himself. (The diocese’s nearby popular and palatial youth center also served small amounts of alcohol. There is no drinking age in Greece.)
   *no communion wafers, the center square of a special round, leavened loaf is cut out and placed in the chalice before communion wine is added, the essence of the bread/body is transmitted with the wine. IIRC this is to avoid possible crumbs and may be different if the communicants have taken holy orders.)
   *Easter is the big yearly celebration, bigger than Christmas.
   * the liturgy is almost the same as a thousand years ago, exactly the same as five hundred years ago, quite impressive

8. Do Judaism. Orthodox. Don’t bother with the others. (Reform etc).

   1. (((Judaism)))
      Wait, that doesn’t make sense.

      1. He should do it disguised as an Orthodox Jew. With fake curly hairs around the ears.

         1. ha!

      2. Judaism: father of Christianity and western civilization. Patriarchy rules. Women are chaste. Family oriented.
         No need to disguise oneself. Just dress respectably and find a synagogue. Ask any question you want.
         Lots of documentaries on YouTube where that’s done

         1. I don’t go anywhere that has chaste women….I like my women chased, not chaste.

         2. “father of Christianity and western civilization”
            Ha ! What a joke.

9. ”Unlike some Protestant faiths which preach that you can simply make an
   acknowledgement that Jesus is the Son of God, and proceed as you were,
   knowing your position is secured in heaven, the Orthodox church requires
   moral behavior, and encourages one to live in a Christian manner. ”
   When you go to the protestant churches go to the confessional Presbyterians PCA and the OPC avoid the liberal churches.
   Go with the reformed and avoid the evangelicalists.

10. Every time I pass by any of the Catholic or Protestant Churches and see a rainbow flag by the entrance, I realize how rotten, weak and degenerate these religions are (in the West at least). Only Russian Orthodoxy carries the light of tradition and zero tolerance to the so-called “progress”.

    1. Orthodox churches in general do the same. The most conservative, family-oriented Christians I ever saw were Romanian Orthodox.

       1. When I lived in my student apartment a year ago my neighbour was a macedonian female student, 28 years old and of orthodox faith.
          We ate together a few times (I really mean eating and not fucking) and her whole apartment was full of jesus and maria depictions.
          Only problem: All her female friends were either orthodox christians…or muslims so there were always girls with hijab walking around the hallway.
          That’s something I see all the time: religious christian girls are always hanging around with muslim girls because those two groups can emphasize with each other – both can’t live according to the female imperative and both have to value the patriarchy.
          I only went to catholic, evangelic and baptist churches in my life – they were all bluepilled as it gets.
          I really need to check out orthodox communities, we have quite a few here in germany.

    2. When they’re done with us, they’ll come after you my friend.

       1. No doubt they will, all that “Pussy Riot” story was an attempt to warp the social fabric of the Russian society, and those whores got whipped and publicly humiliated on a few occasions in Russia. Now, they dont try any more

          1. You have the State on your side. The two heads of the Russian Eagle work together again. It’s admirable.
             The French Republic for example can’t wait for out kind to be wiped out of this physical world.
             The Femen that faked an abortion and hurled blasphemy in Notre-Dame-De-Paris, sued the Church, because the security threw them out… and they won.

          2. Well, you rip what you sowed during the French Revolution.

          3. We have a very similar history when you think about it :
             The revolution during which hundreds of thousands of French Catholics are slaughtered.
             The revolution during which millions of Russian Orthodox are slaughtered.
             Paradoxically, the French take gread pride of the Napoleonian Army or his soldiers sent to the death by the Republic during the Great War.
             Paradoxically, the Russian take great pride of the Red Army during the Great Sacred war.
             The French is ( was) often conflicted between his spiritual nature and the love of wine and foie gras.
             The Russian is often conflcted between his spiritual nature and the love of Vodka and borsch.
             The non-degenerate French and the Russian are made to get along.

          4. Hahahaha, hard not to agree

    3. Those rainbow flags long pre-date the faggots. They were Christian flags many decades ago, the faggots co-opted them and now pretend that it’s their flag. FYI.

       1. Swastika also pre-date Hitler by thousands of years, yet most will link it with the latter, not with Hinduism or Russian paganism

          1. What I’m saying is that if you pass a Christian church with the flag, chances are it’s one that predates the 1980’s and has been hung there since forever. It’s not a show of support for fags (well, probably not in any case).

          2. Well in Germany, the bergoglian Church did put a Raimbow flag at the entrance of a Cathedral, with the outspoken goal to welcome sodomites.

          3. If their mission was to inform the deviants of their sin and help them overcome it, that would be fine. I strongly suspect that it was instead “Come on in, we don’t judge, fuck each other up the ass all you want, God loves you, you can do anything you want!”

          4. “Come on in, we don’t judge, fuck each other up the ass all you want, God loves you, you can do anything you want!”
             I have this argument all the time.

          5. The original Hindu swastika was flipped in orientation

          6. It’s an easy one to win, but they have to recognize logic, which sadly, they do not.
             “God says don’t judge, so we can let gays do whatever they want and welcome them in and let them fuck on the altar and we should all cheer!”
             “I’m not judging, God has already declared homosexuality a grave sin, He’s already judged. Since He has said this, I will not condone nor support the sin of homosexuality. Gays are welcome in the Church, but only if they confess and renounce their sin and atone for it.”

          7. I think that the swastika pre-dates Hinduism, and in fact, is found in Norse relics and artifacts from at least the Viking period forward.

          8. ISIS is true Sunni Islam and all the ‘Muslims’ condemning it aren’t Muslims.

          9. I have read that in Hitler’s nearly obsessive quest for ancient mystical powers, he stole the swastika from the Hindus but flipped it so that it became a uniquely Nazi symbol. Some (many) symbols are also diffuse and/or parallel in origin, the two snakes consuming each other, the target (bull’s eye) and even the cross (passing of the sun across the horizon) have seemingly multiple origins.

          10. I don’t think that’s correct, it predates the Indians and actually comes from a common proto-Indo-European origin. There are numerous Norse artifacts that have the swastika “correctly” drawn as the Nazis used it. I strongly suspect, given his penchant for Teutonic romanticism, that he lifted it from the Vikings.
              http://norse-mythology.org/symbols/swastika-ancient-origins-modern-misuse/

          11. The Germanic people’s migrated to Scandinavia a few thousand years after The Aryans migrated to India and Hinduism developed.

          12. It wasn’t stolen from Hindu’s, it’s almost a universal symbol used by almost every culture everywhere. Chinese, Ethiopian, Germanic, etc. You name it, they probably use Swastikas for something. Not to mention. It was pretty common in limnography in the early part of the 20th century.

          13. The swastika was a well known, if not commonly used, symbol but was called by many different names:
              China – wan
              England – fylfot
              Germany – Hakenkreuz
              Greece – tetraskelion and gammadion
              India – swastika”The word “swastika” comes from the Sanskrit svastika – “su” meaning “good,” “asti” meaning “to be,” and “ka” as a suffix.”
              “In the 1800s, countries around Germany were growing much larger, forming
              empires; yet Germany was not a unified country until 1871. To counter
              the feeling of vulnerability and the stigma of youth, German
              nationalists in the mid-nineteenth century began to use the swastika,
              because it had ancient Aryan/Indian origins, to represent a long
              Germanic/Aryan history.”

          14. The word “swastika” is Indian.

          15. I don’t know about which orientation the ancient Hindus used for their Swastikas, but I’ve read that nowadays it could face either way with them, and that there is no special meaning to either direction. A few years ago I visited a huge Chinese Buddhist temple (the biggest one in the U.S..east of the Mississippi River), located north of New York City in Putnam County. In their gift shop they were selling statues of the Buddha with a red Swastika on his chest (or belly? I don’t remember now). The Swastika faced the same direction as the version that Hitler approved for his flag. Also, interestingly, the Finnish Air Force still uses that version of the Swastika on its flags.

          16. Also the Navajo Indians use it.

          17. Here is what the current Finnish Air Force flag looks like:
              http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/images/f/fi%5Eaf.gif

          18. Yeah, like I said, almost every culture uses it…

       2. I didn’t know that. Interesting. Did it have some significance other than sausage smuggling?

          1. It’s what fags and socialists do. Take every happy symbol and co-opt it. Gay used to mean simply “happy” (as I’m sure you’re aware). Liberal used to mean “libertarian” but now means socialist.
             The rainbow flag is now claimed to have been created by some faggot hippy in the late 1970’s. This is an outright lie. I mean an utter, flaky, stupid lie. I distinctly remember seeing rainbow flags at Christian churches (Protestant) as a youth, long before the fags claimed it. As in, before my sister was born, which was years before the late 1970’s, which is how I know the fag story is bullshit.

          2. Oh know, this I know. I was just wondering if you knew what the pre Fagopting TM meaning was.

          3. or maybe, GOJ, you were just going to the wrong churches. Do you need me to get a doll so you can show me things?

          4. You’re mean. I’m going to tell my boyo Brutus to beat you up.

          5. In Russia a rainbow still means a rainbow. Its painted on many kindergarden buildings.

          6. You know who’s opinion we REALLY need on this matter…FatherOfThree’s.

          7. He’ll just link it to casinos.

          8. And Jews.

          9. I actually do not. Hell I don’t know what the white flag with the blue field and red cross in it means except “Christian” (I think?). But I do know that it predates the filthy ass packers who now claim it as theirs.

          10. Don’t be redundant.

          11. (((Blocked)))

          12. I wish someone would link something to me … oh wait, I already had that. Okay, life goal no. 34 finished.

          13. You got a list of life goals? What’s no. 42?

          14. It’s a bit like the French Republic : “liberty, equality, fraternity” to parody the Holy Trinity.
              The Marianne as an ersatz of Holy Mary…
              The Human’s rights instead of the 10 commandments. They copy and pervert it.
              I think copying and twisting things to lure people it’s what Satan do, according to most theologians.

          15. Making the universe explode through sheer willpower.

          16. But…but….but….

          17. My grandfather always says “there is nothing gay about being gay”.
              Notice the rainbow. It represents a promise God made , that never again would the earth be flooded to destroy mankind , …and look at how satan has taken the rainbow and attempted to pervert it , by taking the rainbows image , (that sacred promise between God and Man) , and transforming into a symbol of homosexuality

          18. Yup.

          19. yup

          20. There we go, that sounds like the correct interpretation of it.

          21. yep

          22. La La La ‘I cant hear you’ la la la

          23. Yarp

          24. That’s precisely correct. And as a substitute for ancient mysticism, we now have “science” complete with white robed priests who deliver “messages from nature” as if by divine intuition.

          25. ….

          26. yar

          27. Yep

          28. In Russia kindergarden buildings paint on you!

          29. Yap

          30. Crying Dawson > Crying Jordan

          31. What a dumb comment

          32. It’s a joke. Relax.

          33. Jokes are funny, yours was a dumb comment

          34. Ok. …Dont think its funny thats your choice. Just letting you know it was a joke, no harm ment ….

          35. Oki, no worries, original Yakov Smirnoff’s ones were quite good. “In Soviet Russia car drives you” – very true cause cars were so crappy they were out of control on the road. My dad still has that junk

          36. nowadays if I see a rainbow ( Canada) in any form I have to ask myself if its just an innocent rainbow that is painted or if it has connection to faggotry.

          37. Im in Canada too, when I see a rainbow – the only association I have is faggotry

          38. And in Canada kindergarteners receive sex Ed and sensitivity training.

          39. You’ve nailed it here. I used to be one and it drives me crazy every time the media present scientific theories as facts. Or when one new publication comes out that supports the narrative it gets plenty of press coverage. But if it’s redacted a year later, no one mentions it.
              Drives me so nuts. Good scientists will admit that the Big Bang theory is simply just a model theory that is the best explanation scientists can come up with based on the information they currently have. They admit that the scientific creation story will likely be different in 100 years when we have a lot more data collected and new technology to make discoveries with.
              Of course, those scientists rarely get interviewed.

          40. “They admit that the scientific creation story will likely be different in 100 years when we have a lot more data collected and new technology to make discoveries with.” Who? Can you give an example of this happening?

       3. Every church in downtown Boston had a rainbow flag up during pride week, and most had statements written on their signs that made it clear they support faggotry. I think the churches in the big cities allowed the co-opting a long time ago.

    4. They’re a Protestant church near my Tradtional Catholic Church, They have a very masonic banner at the entrance : “Liberty. Equality. Fraternity. Refugees welcome”.

       1. We really need to take the heat off of those refugees. They’re just as conservative as we are. Leftist degeneracy is the real enemy.

          1. They are invading Europe and raping their women and starting to claim entire towns as theirs. Fuck the “refugees”.

          2. Most of the people we’ll push the limits of what’s allowed to benefit themselves. Agree, refugees are just pawns

          3. Interesting that you guys demonstably defend white dudes who rape, yet scourge non-whites for it. (and no, I am not shilling for feminism).
             The Irish did exactly the same in the US in the mid-19th century, and people reacted exactly the same way.

          4. Where do I, or anybody, defend “white dudes who rape”?
             Show me.

          5. To quote Straightalpha
             ”That’s
             something I see all the time: religious christian girls are always
             hanging around with muslim girls because those two groups can emphasize
             with each other – both can’t live according to the female imperative and
             both have to value the patriarchy..”

          6. And that has what to do with what?
             It’s 70%+ young men, combat age, coming over. Again, fuck the fucking refugees. Get the fuck out of Europe. Period.
             And I know that it’s European leaders doing this, but that doesn’t mean that we give the rapefugees free reign.

          7. Not you personally GOJ, but given the fact Matt Forney has written about how any person who claimed rape in the public arena is lying about it, especially if the dude was white, should show you about it. Look at Forney’s writings on this site. A lot of ”Is such and such woman lying about being raped”. He then turns around and scourges refugees.

          8. Refugees are pawns that leftist governments use for votes. That being said, removing them is going to be very difficult.

          9. It will be like Yougoslavia everywhere.

          10. You missed the logic. If a woman does not report rape, then uses the internet to create an attention storm, then most likely she’s bullshitting. Women who are really raped don’t go around bragging about it, and generally, report it. What he wrote is not condoning real rape in any way, shape or form, and it has shit to do with “white dudes”.

          11. Since when does a public accusation automatically equal false. For all we know, they might actually have been raped and might want to use the newly emboldened feminist crusade for it as a platform to yell it.
              Forney probably would believe anyone who said they were raped by a refugee completely even if they announced it publically like his subjects have. That’s the big hypocrisy.

          12. An accusation without evidence is nothing but conjecture or a common claim. Nobody…NOBODY…should accept an accusation as proof of a claim, no matter what it is. If a woman can prove rape, then nobody here, nobody at all, thinks that this the rape is ok, under any circumstance. Your accusation falls flat on its face.

          13. ”An accusation without evidence is nothing but conjecture or a common claim.”
              Ignoring the fact the people he wrote hit pieces about (omit Sulkowicz, who was a right liar) had some vidence.
              ” If a woman can prove rape, then nobody here, nobody at all, thinks that
              this the rape is ok, under any circumstance. Your accusation falls
              flat on its face.”
              This is precisely why rape is so fucking hard to prosecute. It usually amounts to he said she said, in which case Forney and most of the manosphere will side with he and feminists will side with she. Lack of evidence either why does not imply it didn’t happen.

          14. In a court of law based on rule of law, one must always side with the accused (consider him innocent) until evidence comes forward proving the charge against him or her. That’s how the entire system is supposed to work. You don’t buy people’s word as true without evidence, in a court of law. Period. Full stop.

          15. Siding with the accused and doubting whether or not something happened is not the same thing, so much so Scotland, in cases of rape, announced a variation on the innocent until proven guilty model. Guilty (as in the rape happened and the accused did it), a middle category (we believed you were raped but we can’t know the accused did it), and innocent (you weren’t raped and because of that, the accused didn’t do it).

          16. I don’t doubt, I disbelieve, in a legal sense. Totally disbelieve. This is objective, it’s not meant in malice. When evidence comes forward, then I re-evaluate and, if applicable, believe the accuser and render a guilty verdict. But not one moment, not one nanosecond, before that will I side with any accuser.
              Believing somebody was raped without evidence is hardly good law. It’s outright tyranny actually.
              This is all incidental. Nobody here ever says that rape, when it really occurs, is ok. Your accusation is false.

          17. Feminists are more inclined to believe rape victims because according to them, most rapists don’t spend a day in jail. They’d rather be supportive than be inquisitive. That’s part of feminism, i.e take the side of the marginalized (at least those you think)
              They won’t necessarily say that they were raped, they’ll just offer moral support.

          18. Feminism also believes that men and women are equal in every way. Which is demonstrably and laughably false. What they believe is irrelevant to me.
              And yes, they do say that they were raped. Hillary Clinton, Matriarch in Chief, says that we must “believe” rape victims claims. That’s entirely different than “take seriously” (which is proper, so as to get an investigation going).
              This is, again, all tangential. Nobody here supports actual rape or rapists, ever. You’ve not backed up your claim.

          19. It actually believes men and women should be allowed to pursue the same opportunities, not that men and women are identical. Tangential, once again.
              Let’s not talk about HIlary shall we. That sociopath says anything she needs to in order to get what she wants I care about my emotional cool.
              Forney seems to make justifications for literally any accused man in any one of those cases. If he were more impartial and didn’t immediately discredit them based on publicity, I could take him more seriously.

          20. That’s not supporting rape.
              Your case has failed. We should move on to a new topic.

          21. No I think you wrong here, the bulk of them really comes here to enjoy our decline.

          22. Or to hasten it.

          23. Or both.

          24. To exploit the welfare and evenutally take over (and make it a shithole just like they left behind). They are pretty up front about it.

          25. Since when does a public accusation automatically equal false.

              Since she goes to the media FIRST instead of reporting the supposed crime to the Authorities and oftentimes they don’t bother to file a claim, since they know perfectly that in a serious investigation, her bullshit claims would be debunked.

          26. Feminism isn’t about equal opportunity but even it were it would still be flawed logic. Women shouldn’t have the opportunity to do things that they aren’t biologically or otherwise equipped to take on.
              For ex, If the military can have an age limit because older/the very young aren’t ideal soldiers then women should be limited from special ops for example. Same goes for mining, firefighting, etc. We shouldn’t have equal opportunity in everything.

          27. Point conceded then.

          28. You could say that about all immigrants, brown or not.

          29. Ignoring of course the fact many of those whom Forney blasts did that.

          30. ”We shouldn’t have equal opportunity in everything.”
              I think you’re confusing equal opportunity with equal representation. Feminists aren’t for 50 50 everything.

          31. Which of those public claims have been backed by a formal claim…which hadn’t been debunked much to the chagrin of the accuser, the legal body and the media. No one in this website supports real rape and anyone with some common sense knows that the last thing a real victim of rape wants is to publicize her ordeal and brag about it unless she is left no other recourse…which is hardly the case in the first world.

          32. I`ve already conceded his point. Let’s change topic shall we?

          33. This is In Response to feminist demands that we have to believe the victim no matter what. But that is ridiculous. So forney took a more extreme version of innocent until proven guilty. But it is still, “the main is innocent until she actually proves it.”

          34. Feed the fuckers to the dogs.

          35. Give me 3 examples of women being unable to have the same opportunity as men. More women in college (which impresses no one but the uniformed), women being able to shag like men (which impresses no one but the immoral), and women working in the same cubicles.

          36. Yes, but necessary.

          37. ”Give me 3 examples of women being unable to have the same opportunity as men.”
              1. Being banned from certain positions in the military due to archaic laws.
              2. Being denied certain promotions.
              I can`t think of a third as of yet.

          38. Thanks for your response. However your answer is vague and so I’m not convinced.

       2. Think I’ve walked by the same church, it had another sign outside stating “Come in, rape my wife and children….”

11. If Christianity were my only religious option, I would be Orthodox.

    1. That begs the question of what your current status is….scientology? Heh.

       1. I wanna see a wrestling match between Jesus and Ron Hubbard.

          1. I got Hubbard in the 4th round on this one. Now Put Hubbard against Buddha in an MMA fight and it is Buddha all the way.
             The best MMA would be Buddha versus that crazy indian god with like 8 arms. That would be The Brawl To End It All

          2. Buddha’s thoughts while considering whether to enter the match:
             I have no ego, so there’s no really any point in doing it.
             But then, there’s no ego to prevent me from doing it either!

          3. What about Spinoza ? He has no free will.

          4. I think Buddha/8 armed god played out in the video game Street Fighter.
             I think its time to choose Hill’s inauguration song- Ive narrowed the list to “Highway to Hell” and “Terrible Lies” and “Head Like a Hole” by Nine Inch Nails

          5. I dunno. Jesus did drive a bunch of people out of the temple, by himself, with a homemade whip. I got Jesus in 3.

          6. Plus, if he were to get killed, he’s back up and raring to go in 3 days.

          7. That resurrection ability is pretty tough to beat in the long game.

          8. Jesus also tamed a cave full of dragons, and killed a guy. Gotta go with Jesus too.

          9. Plus, beard.

          10. Wait…what?! I need the book and verse for the dragon thing.

          11. Or are we getting into Revelations at this point?

          12. I always think in the long run. It’s a battle of attrition.

          13. Be careful with that, you’re going to get lolknee all horny thinking about the whore of Babylon.

          14. I got him covered: http://www.jezebel.com

          15. It’s in the redacted portions.

          16. Jesus via an armbar

          17. And, lo, suddenly there came forth from the cave many dragons; and when the children saw them, they cried out in great terror. Then Jesus went down from the bosom of His mother, and stood on His feet before the dragons; and they adored Jesus, and thereafter retired.

          18. Jesus wins by using a foreign object and then hiding it in his tights.

          19. That never really happened. The Jewish Temple was far too huge, and also had a large battalion of Temple soldiers on site to prevent just that sort of thing from happening.
              Not to mention that those money changers were a necessary part of the temple service. Mosaic law forbade buying the sacrificial animals with non-Jewish currency, so that money had to be changed to keep the Temple operating for the foreign worshippers who came to make sacrifice

          20. But even if it did happen, so what? There is nothing impressive about chasing out some soft, flabby guys who sit on their asses all day counting money. Now, if Jesus had chased out one of those temple guards, or a Roman soldier, then I would be impressed!

       2. Pastafarianism
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Monster

       3. He is Thelemite, movement founded by Aleister Crowley, an English sorcerer from late 19th and early 20th century.

    2. I once had the opportunity to sit down with a Coptic family from Egypt. The thing that impressed me most was the patriarchy. The father invited me in, a random guy, and the rest of the family followed his lead; the women served me tea and cakes as their guest. I was struck by the hospitality and devoutness. He talked about their family legacy and religion, which goes back a very long way and is full of persecution, and that struck a chord with me.

       1. They are the lowest of the low in Egyptian society. I watched a documentary on trash(yes, Ill watch anything) and a lot of these Christians are garbage pickers- thats how they make a buck

          1. SJW scum cry about colonialism and then turn a blind eye to Islamic imperialism practically annihilating Coptic culture.

12. A superb article, just a minor flaw: the church before the schism was was called Catholic, as in Greek it means for all. Rome kept the name, by slightly changing to Romeo-catholic, but Byzantium changed it to Orthodox exactly because it wanted to signify the fact that they follow the right and real doctrines. Some ceremonies though have evolved and changed slightly, but this is according to country and does not violate the doctrine, in Greece for example people sit down during mass, also the Russians use conjoined cups in marriages to share the wine between newly weds, in Greece this does not occur. But all that is cherry-picking and more about specific cultures and truly insignificant to the true doctrine. But really a superb article on the orthodox church, same images occur also here (Greece).

13. “Icons often depict Jesus, saints or angels, typically in portrait style, and with symbols that encourage reflection on holiness and mystery.”
    Why is this icon worship different from what modern media does? Because it is drawn with antique gold colors, the houses are built in antique styles, everything stinks like incense and the drawings are really bad? And because instead of pentagrams, it uses crosses? Seriously, that’s just superficial differences.
    “Neither is marriage a social institution, but an eternal Christian vocation that allows the husband and wife to grow closer to God.”
    Haha. Right. So why exactly – if it is not a social instution – does it need to be socially acknowledged and ritually confirmed? To ‘reinforce’ what God wants anyway? But if it is apparent truth, why does it need to be reinforced? Illogical.
    And by the way … eternal? Christ! They are worse than Scientology. At least with Scientology, you only sign up for a couple billion years…
    “Upon visiting a local Orthodox Church, I was immediately drawn to a young, feminine mother at the front door, who kindly welcomed me while holding her child. Upon entering, my senses were overwhelmed simultaneously with the smell of incense, the beautiful interiors of green and gold, and the angelic singing of the choir.”
    It’s basically all nice impressive show. It’s definitely nice, of course. But so is a very good hotel. And so cliched. Young feminine kind mother with child … I wept. But yeah, I kinda know what you mean, especially that “angelic” type of sound which is really really special, I think due to the stone architecture. Speakers or headphones don’t do it justice. But then, is it really angelic? Or is it simply very good sound design? Who knows.
    “The implication was clear—we don’t just take anyone. You are expected to put forth effort, presenting yourself a better man before God, and needless to say, the priest does not issue pussy passes.”
    WE don’t just take anyone – a better man before GOD.
    Right. Before God. So that’s why I need to confess to a PRIEST, to look better in front of GOD? I can’t be the only one who sees the bullshit in this. If it is about God, then I must confess to God, not to a priest. And ultimately, whether I actually let God into my heart, so to speak, is a personal decision and confessing to a priest can be a very fake gesture. As it is a personal decision, I believe it to be a personal responsibility to foster a relationship with God – not with the church.
    But then, I am not interested in that Communion thing anyway, so fair enough.
    All that said, I find this quite sympathetic. I mostly thought of Christianity in terms of the Catholic Church and most of the things I considered extremely bullshitty seem to actually not be a part of the original ideas (if what you say is correct). So I guess if you put a gun to my head and forced me to choose a religion (which I will never do out of free will!), it would be this.

    1. What about the church of the flying spaghetti monster?

       1. Well, I don’t think God can be reduced to anything specific, so no. Although this church seems to think God is a dude. Hm. At least the spaghetti monster is gender neutral … or wait, it isn’t. Not at all!

          1. not sure about diety gender of the spaghetti monster. Need to ask a pastafarian.

          2. They smoke a lot of Oregano……

          3. It’s obvious which gender noodles have.

          4. Unless it’s a Cavatelli monster….

          5. Nope, spaghetti http://www.venganza.org/about/

          6. Its gender is Barilla

          7. Lol!

       2. Actually, I have a couple of friends who are ordained Pastafarian ministers.
          Apparently, they can legally marry people.

          1. Oh this silly world.

14. If/When you do a Catholic Mass, go to a Latin Mass, AKA, “Mass in the Extraordinary Form.”
    For the love of the Holy Trinity, DO NOT — DONOTDONOTDONOTDONOT — go to your average Catholic Parish. You will walk out a devout atheist, and I wouldn’t blame you one bit.

    1. I spent a few Christmases in Latin America, and it was amazing to see their full commitment to celebrate it in full spirit

       1. By Latin Mass he means the entire Mass is done in Latin. The priest has his back to the congregation facing the alter rather than facing the congregation. This is how mass was done for nearly 2000 years until Vatican II.

15. I was watching a TV show recently about Greece. There is a Greek Orthodox monastery where women are not admitted and haven’t been for 1,000 years. That’s history…..

    1. What?

       1. Had to edit op, realised I left out “women”……

          1. Well fuck you, you white male misogynist!
             https://usercontent2.hubstatic.com/12861551_f520.jpg

    2. yeah Marsh, spicy is right. need to make some sense out of that.

       1. When you are doing something for 1,000 years I mean that is history right there….

          1. makes more sense now. Yeah, I mean, the muzzies and the jews still separate (at least the more conservative ones).
             For my part, I prefer bars to churches or temples or houses of worship. They serve better booze, don’t separate the men from the women and encourage, rather than denounce, pre marital sex.

          2. I agree. It’s still nice to know there are monks out there living a Spartan existence of fasting and contemplation. I was always told hunger is good sauce…….

    3. I think you’re referring to Mount Athos. The reason it is off limits to women is because it’s dedicated to the Virgin Mary.

16. My brother married an orthodox girl. The wedding service was PAINFUL! It was two hours of ceremony and the priest finding every excuse to end sentences with “for ages and aaaaggggeeees”. The incense too! Ugh.

    1. How is she as a wife?

       1. AWFUL!

17. Wonder what the angelic singing of the choir was. People in the West associate angelic voice with a certain high pitch female singing despite the fact that we do not have female angels. Interesting, huh?
    Women were not allowed to talk let alone sing in the old school Orthodox churches and for a good reason. Male Brains Aren’t Designed To Listen to Female Voices.
    Read more: http://stylecaster.com/male-brains-arent-designed-listen-female-voices/#ixzz4JlqqByps
    The Orthodox music is amazing and somewhat disturbing to the modern ear. I wonder why that is?
    

    1. Yeah, he probably meant female high pitch voices. In a stone church, the sound is truly amazing and I get why you would call it “angelic”.

       1. Angels were usually young boys. Before puberty, boys and girls have roughly similar vocal pitch which is probably why sometime we label female singing as angelic but it is incorrect.

          1. True. They used to cut off boys’ balls too in the hope they would become Castrato stars. Most of them didn’t…

    2. That song you shared truly is amazing and disturbing. Fucking love it. I think that in modernity, people do not create such deep music, because many emotions and aspects of human nature are shamed away and ignored. When we then hear something that makes these parts resonate, it’s like we rediscover some long forgotten part of ourselves.

       1. That’s a rather good explanation, it is a part that modern people prefer to remain dormant.

       2. not all orthodox chanting and prayers sound like that. its going to be different based on what is being sung and in what tone,as well as who is singing it. also on the culture and traditions of that church…
          take Mt. Athos for example… it is one of the most Holy places on the earth and a stone in Orthodoxy. all of their chants that i have heard are pretty moderately pitched. My priest spent some time on Mt Athos,and he described those monks as really tough men. He told me they intentionally only sleep 4 hours a night,and they work all day.. im sure the monks of the Valaam monastery in Russia are real tough guys too,and their chants are VERY high pitched considering they are all men.

    3. I swear to God, every day you surprise me with new depths of lunacy.
       From the article you linked.
       When it comes to processing a woman’s voice, they [ed: men] use the more complex auditory part of the brain that processes music, not human voices.
       So in essence, normal speech is processed as music, ergo, music from women would also BE PROCESSED AS FREAKING MUSIC.

    4. Talking about masculine music …
       

    5. This one is Byzantine secular piece, which if you didn’t know it could be confused for Turkish.
       

    6. Last one. A Serbian Orthodox piece which is rather easy listening, maybe because it’s girl singing it. I guess female singing is from the devil which is why it’s more listenable and light-hearted.
       

       1. female singing is of the devil? get out of here! i hope you’re just trolling…the attitude you are showing does NOT reflect true christian values. Orthodox Christianity loves and respects women as long as they are respectable. This is evidenced by our veneration and prayers for intercession to Our Lady,Theotokos and to the Saints(including the female ones!)
          your attitude reflects true misogyny,similar to that taught in islam,not the traditional gender roles and male headship taught in Christianity.

    7. Listening to singing and listening to someone talking are very very different.

       1. I agree….male headship is not misogyny. but what this guy is saying very much is. in another post he said female singing is of the devil.

    8. i attend an orthodox church and women are always partaking in the choir…not sure what you’re talking about.

    9. only men in the choir? think again! orthodox worship is focused on God,not on ourselves. and both genders partake in it.
       

       1. This is modern times singing. In the old time women did not sing.

          1. im not aware of any canon of the church now or then that says women dont participate in the prayers. because thats what the singing usually is-prayers.. like i said,im not sure that you can back that claim.
             orthodoxy is not focused on us,its focused on God. women may be under the authority of a male,but they are humans. this is orthodox Christianity. not islam.

18. I don’t think Catholicism came out of Orthodoxy. Or Orthodoxy came out of Catholicism. I think it’s more of patriarchs popping all over the region. Eventually there was a power struggle among the more powerful seats (Rome. Constantinople, Alexandria, etc), accelerated by the decline of the Jerusalem church.

    1. I always thought Catholicism and Orthodoxy were two branches of the original church founded by Jesus. There was Catholicism in the west and Orthodoxy in the East.

       1. And that is correct thinking, neither of them are “original”. Original was until schism and that’s it. Btw, I am pretty sure if Jesus was currently here on Earth that he would be really perplexed by the whole thing.

19. It has always fascinated me to hear AltRight types like Roosh (through publishing this Max Roscoe article) try to extol the virtues of Christianity while simultaneously practicing and advocating for sex outside of marriage, as if the measure of a man is how many young women he beds down. To someone like him there are only two types of men: (A) weak and p***y-whipped or (B) strong and women-violating. The message of Christianity is to transcend the carnal and acquire the strength and virtue that comes from forgoing the ravaging of the created to instead worship the Creator. As someone who also can not tolerate a weak p***y-whipped man, I also see the ugliness and failure of a beast with no self-control. A soldier, cop, fireman or anyone who puts himself at risk to help others, are the real men in our society and not women-centered and women-worshipping parasites like Roosh. Anyone with daughters already knows this. Roosh, if you are as carnal as you appear to be than perhaps Islam is what you are looking for and not the teachings of Jesus Christ.

    1. A) This site has many authors with many different viewpoints and approaches to life. If you looked at the very top of the article, you would notice this is part of a series done by Max Roscoe.
       B) Roosh has stated in many of his more recent writings and videos, that he is entering a new stage of his life where gaming women is losing its appeal and he’s now becoming increasingly interested in settling down.

    2. He’s not Alt Right, and this is not an Alt Right site.
       Nobody here worships women, in fact, the exact opposite. Wanting to sleep with women, consensually, is not parasitical.
       What you’re doing is creating a straw man and knocking it down and then declaring victory. That’s weak.

       1. “Nobody hear worships women”
          *Nobody here worships women.*
          Fixed it for you.

          1. I was telling him to listen to me.
             *grumble grumble damint grumble grumble*

          2. you and @unabashed took the wrong angle with this cf. my advice on how to deal with shit test yesterday

          3. Ah, then you were looking for the Southern term “y’hear.”
             I take my wins from you wherever I can find them.

          4. I assume your response to him is the correct way to deal with the matter then?

          5. It’s okay. We’re hear for you.

          6. no…but seeing as how I can not reach his jaw from my office it will have to do.

    3. shut up faggot

    4. You’re right, of course, but prepare to be flamed. Protestations to the contrary, this is an alt.right site, or at least becoming one. Daily Stormer, one of the alt.right’s house organs says specifically that the “neomasculine” movement is a facet of the alt.right. The continuous articles praising Daddy Trump and Putin are another sign of alt.rightness. Finally it’s ironic that a site that loves articles praising old fashioned Christianity also turns to blind eyes to adultery–so long as it’s men who are doing it. As for soldiers and first responders, in the RoK world they’re just simps and white knights.

       1. Where is anyone turning a blind eye to adultery?

          1. He’s on a roll making shit up. His contributions to this site have been little more than trolling most of the time.

    5. You’ve misrepresentated Roosh as well completely glossing over the fact that his viewpoints are parallel to many men who live and earn experience: their opinions and perspective can change accordingly.
       “A soldier, cop, fireman or anyone who puts himself at risk to help others, are the real men in our society” You’re speaking as if we are still living in the past, and there are absolutes. There aren’t.
       Many men foolishly are “noble” and “brave” in a society, and especially to women, who would just as much forget they exist or destroy them for some perceived offense.
       I find it very common that older people are clueless as to how the real world works now.

    6. Firstly, there’s no need to splat out words like “pussy”. There is no profanity filter here, and no need for trigger warnings.
       Anyhow, I too have struggled with the dichotomy you mentioned on this site. I reckon it’s a case that, like Roosh himself, RoK is evolving past the notch-count phase and into developing relationships — with women, other men, community and God — a little more meaningfully. I don’t begrudge young guys going out sowing their oats, but l’m personally no longer interested in that sort of thing, and I bet many RoK readers are in the same boat. Having said that, the essays on game and the nature of women (and men and society) are invaluable for men at any stage of life, even if their immediate application is not too get one’s dick wet.

20. Thank you for this very insightful article, I have much reaoect for the Orthodox Church. I like thay they are the ones who stayed as true to the original message of Christ as possible.
    I want to know a bit more about their Theology. Is Jesus devine, or simply a mortal Prophet?

21. wtf… there is no ‘undercover’. Just walk in and start asking questions.

22. There are a lot of inaccuracies in this piece, but I’ll focus on just a few.
    “Since that time, the Catholic Church evolved and modified teachings, adding ideas such as a Pope who is above all other men, and priests which are restricted from marrying, purgatory, indolences, predestination, crusades, and original sin.”
    a. This phrasing is highly misleading in that i) the Pope is not “above all other men” but merely the visible head of the Church, a position not a statement of worth or standing before God, but merely describes his ecclesiastical position, and b) the Pope being the visible head of the Church was firmly in place long before the Catholic/Orthodox split in 1054.
    b. Purgatory was also a Church teaching long before 1054.
    c. By ‘indolences’ I assume the writer meant indulgences. The teaching on indulgences was also in place long before 1054.
    d. Predestination is not a teaching of the Roman Catholic Church. It is a teaching of Reformed and Presbyterian churches, among others (all Protestant).
    e. The Crusades being on this list of supposed “evolved and modified teachings” is odd, as the Crusades were not a teaching but a series of historical events in which the Church called Christians to take back territories (particularly Jerusalem) conquered by the Muslims.
    f. Original Sin: also a teaching also firmly in place well before 1054.
    Furthermore, one of the little pics included in the piece claims that the Catholic Church teaches that the Holy Spirit “combines both the Father and the Son”. No, it does not. It teaches that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and the Son, but can not be said to “combine” them, as they (with the Holy Spirit) share the same divine nature. Photius, an Orthodox writer, claimed in “Mystagogy of the Holy Spirit” that Catholics thought this, but was easily and resoundingly shown to be in error by later Catholic writers, most prominently Thomas Aquinas.

    1. Excellent correction. You beat me to it.

    2. Where does he mention anything about the crusades?
       “claims that the Catholic Church teaches that the Holy Spirit ‘combines both the Father and the Son’.” I grew up eastern orthodox, and I have never known anyone who thought the Catholics believe this. It’s pretty clearly an error of the author.

       1. “Where does he mention anything about the crusades?”
          It is mentioned in the passage I quoted. I thought the author may have edited the piece to take this out, but, nope, it’s still there.
          “I grew up eastern orthodox, and I have never known anyone who thought the Catholics believe this.”
          I covered this in my comment: Photius, an Orthodox writer, claimed in “Mystagogy of the Holy Spirit” that Catholics thought this…” Photius is actually considered by many Orthodox to have been a great Orthodox theologian, an opinion not shared by Roman Catholics. Whether Orthodox today believe Catholics believe this, this position was clearly stated by Photius, and was for centuries one of the frequently (and erroneous) arguments levied against against the Catholic teaching of “the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father AND the Son” by Orthodox theologians.

23. I’m a Catholic married to an Orthodox Christian and I’m well acquainted with both faiths. Orthodox Christianity and conservative Roman Catholicism (what I think of as small “o” orthodox Catholicism) are the same faith. However, the Western Roman Catholic Church has been a far greater contributor to Western Civilization than Eastern Orthodoxy (I’m not saying it’s better or worse, just different in geographic orientation and expression). Granted a lot of mainstream Roman Catholicism has been, like many other things in the West, corrupted by leftism, feminism, sexual libertinism and all the other -isms that afflict Western Civilization. Eventually though, that “leftist faith” will collapse leaving only the original faith.
    This was a reasonable introduction to Orthodox Christianity but weak and incorrect in many areas. The author didn’t research things very thoroughly. A couple of points of clarification to the others that have already been raised…
    – Orthodox Christians believe in a transitional state between death and union with God (that is why, like Catholics, they pray for the dead). Purgatory is a theological word from the Latin (i.e. Roman Catholic) world and is thus, on the surface, denied by the Orthodox. However, they effectively believe in the same thing.
    – Eastern Orthodox priests – like Roman Catholic deacons as well as Chaldean Christian priests and Coptic Christian priests (both of whom are officially part of the Roman Catholic communion) – may marry. However, Eastern Orthodox bishops must be celibate and, if an Eastern Orthodox priest becomes a widower, he too must remain celibate.

    1. By allowing priests to marry has Othordox church mostly escaped the priest pedo problem in the Catholic church?

       1. As an institution, the Orthodox Church in the West is tiny compared to the RCC so it’s hard to draw comparisons and conclusions. You can be sure that Orthodoxy has its share of sexual deviants and perverts too – you can read comments from ROK contributor, “Brother Aurelius” alluding to that (he started out on the path of Orthodox Christianity only to opt for Catholicism after witnessing some of it).
          The pedo problem is a misnomer. It was primarily a homo problem as most of the abuse was directed at post-pubescent teenage males. Are there a lot of homos in the RCC priesthood? Yes. In fairness, many of them are deeply spiritual men and good priests that live their vows of celibacy with integrity. Others are confused and sexually repressed men that act out in sexual deviancy.
          If more of the RCC ecclesiastical leadership had done its job (many did), taken a hardline and turfed the deviants, the problem would haven’t been what it became. Instead, through cowardice, a misplaced sense of compassion, fear of bringing shame on the Church and/or soliciting and listening to therapists that label everything as a “treatable condition” rather than simple wickedness that should be shunned, they created an awful mess that Leftists devoured with glee. Perhaps some of those in leadership were themselves sympathetic to the sexual longings and behavior of their clergy? Bottom line – a mess and a betrayal of the worst kind.
          I have known a number of good, profoundly spiritual, masculine, heterosexual men who were great priests. Sadly, like so much in the West, the priesthood has been emasculated and corrupted so that we’re left with only the odd youngish traditionally masculine man within a community of old men, effeminate men and homosexuals. A crisis of masculinity indeed.

          1. “Are there a lot of homos in the RCC priesthood?” Not really. When you statistically adjust it, there aren’t that many, there is only an anecdotal appearance that this is the case.

       2. The Catholic Church never had a pedo problem. I’m sure you and a whole bunch of other idiots are gonna scream “but muh anecdotes!”, but 10, or 20 pedophiles is NOTHING when you put it into a perspective of total population and compare it to other professions.

          1. Watch the movie “Spotlight” you moron. It was FAR more than 10 or 20 priests. It was close to 200 alone, in just the Boston area! Anecdotes my a$$.

          2. The celibate priest requirement created all kinds of distortions.

          3. Celibate you mean… I don’t think celibacy made grown men molest little boys. And there’s ZERO justification for the Roman Catholic Church covering up THOUSANDS of pedophile priests worldwide. Like I said, it wasn’t just the Boston Archdiocese. There were hundreds alone in Ireland as well. The rest of the US. How many did we not hear about in Latin America? There’s absolutely no equivocating this issue.

          4. Celibacy doesn’t make a man queer, but a celibacy requirement will attract males outside the standard norms of male behavior. Its normal for a male to be attracted to females. I agree its more of an ongoing shit storm than catholics want to acknowledge.

          5. You’re absolutely correct: at least in the 20th century, gay men figured out that they could become highly respected members of the community by becoming a priest. With no problems with not ever enjoying the company of women. The requirements of the Church definitely led to that kind of person being attracted to the job. I think the statistics that they figured out were maybe ten percent of the priests molesting kids. More would have known at least a little that something was going on or were actively covering it up. Probably a majority knew nothing about it, whether they were gay or straight. But, Church policies, in an increasingly Godless and immoral society all conspired to create this situation and most die hard Catholics chose to ignore it. To their shame.

          6. Spotlight had the number at 87 Priests in the Boston area. Still, that is a small drop in the ocean. Here is some actual statistical examination:
             https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/all-about-sex/201003/beyond-bad-apple-priests-who-the-pedophiles-really-are
             https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/do-the-right-thing/201003/six-important-points-you-dont-hear-about-regarding-clergy-sexual

          7. Yep
             400,000 priests and a few thousand incidents over 69 years
             Rabbis raping kids hit that number annually

          8. Joos and Marxists loaded the seminaries with ringers to destroy from within
             Communist head in the USA Bella Dodd personally testified to Congress of placing 2000 such agents into the priesthood to subvert it.
             Read also Maurice Pinays The Plot Against The Church
             All joo intrigue over 2000 years is covered

          9. “Rabbis raping kids hit that number annually” You do realize that there are about 30 million jews and 1.2 billion catholics?

          10. Jews are somehow involved in the pedophile priest scandals in the Catholic Church… Alrighty.

          11. A majority of American Jews are liberal, I get that, but it’s a huge stretch to somehow give them any culpability in Catholic priests molesting boys. IMHO. I’m not familiar with this Dodd and her testimony to Congress of thousands of Jewish agents being placed in the priesthood… I also won’t fall into the intellectual trap, most prevalent on the Left, where everything that’s bad or gone wrong in the last 2000 years is the Jews’ fault. That’s the kind of thinking that led to the rise of Nazi Germany and the Holocaust. But, I suppose the Holocaust never happened either right?

          12. 87. More than “ten or twenty.” By the most conservative estimate, it would be considered a “prevalent” problem and was provably covered up by the Church. So it was close to a hundred, not two hundred. My mistake. I watched the movie a while ago.

          13. Again, you are cherry picking the Boston area. Read those articles. Catholic Priests are not more statistically disposed to be pedophiles.

          14. Again, you didn’t actually read what I wrote: it happened worldwide. It was especially prevalent in Ireland also. I also mentioned Latin America where it’s a lot less likely to have come to light. You’re the one who originally said it was ten or twenty, which is far off the mark. You can keep arguing as much as you like though; it doesn’t make me wrong.

          15. Again, you didn’t read either of the articles I posted that both show it isn’t anymore prevalent that any other profession.

       3. Was never really s problem. Offender rate of about 1.4%. Smaller than Protestant pastors and Rabbis who are protected by the kosher press. And all religious groups pale in comparison to public school admins, teachers and coaches in sex crimes with kids.
          Joo lawyers made a bundle on the Catholic witch hunt though. I think expelling them 108 times for their crimes had slot to do with the payback

24. While I have great admiration for the Orthodox Churches (which are segregated along ethnic lines), their claim that the Latin church was “Orthodox” until the great schism is somewhat disingenuous. The Latin Church has always been different since the beginning, and for 1000 years the Patriarchs of the East were OK with that and were also OK with the Bishop of Rome being the first among equals (a primacy of honor).

    1. “While I have great admiration for the Orthodox Churches (which are segregated along ethnic lines)” I grew up eastern orthodox, and this isn’t the case. A Greek church wouldn’t deny a Russian or visa versa.
       “The Latin Church has always been different since the beginning, and for 1000 years the Patriarchs of the East were OK with that” It’s not that they weren’t different, it’s that they became more and more different.
       “Bishop of Rome being the first among equals (a primacy of honor).” That is not anywhere near primacy. First among equals just means he typically presides over the Synods and Councils and his opinion is given slightly more significance, but that is it.

       1. That’s what “Primacy of Honor” means, that he’s a first among equals, it’s honorary. I understand the Orthodox objection to the Papal Monarchical primacy, which is a different matter. It is my understanding that JPII offered to rescind the Monarchical Primacy if that would help end the schism. I also believe that he also offered drop the filioque from the Nicene Creed to end the schism. Sadly, I don’t think there is anything the Pope could offer at this point to end the schism. And as far as I know, Francis doesn’t seem to care about ending the schism. Perhaps he doesn’t care or maybe he accepts that it can’t be done.
          My point about the ethnic lines in the church was just an observation.Of course a Russian would be welcome in a Greek Church. He might not be able to understand what the Priest is saying, as I doubt the Greek Church celebrates the Divine Liturgy in Russian 🙂

          1. “That’s what “Primacy of Honor” means” Well in that case the Eastern Orthodox have absolutely no objection to that, they have any objection to infallibility.
             “I understand the Orthodox objection to the Papal Monarchical primacy” I have no idea what this is.

       2. I don’t get how Orthodix allow divorce and must of their nations allow abortion in contrast to Catholic nations.
          They also supported communism and warring against Nationalist Germany, who fought the joo world order, save Romania.

          1. “I don’t get how Orthodox allow divorce and must of their nations allow abortion in contrast to Catholic nations.” What Catholic Nations don’t allow divorce? And I don’t mean third world backwaters, I mean developed nations.
             “They also supported communism and warring against Nationalist Germany” Which Country are you talking about? Every Orthodox country in Europe except Greece and Yugoslavia support Germany, and they probably would have had Italy not invaded then. Both Romania and Bulgaria were members of the Berlin Pact.

25. “If one follows the Christian faith, or is merely interested in this
    period of history, I strongly encourage at least a basic introduction to
    the ideas of Orthodoxy, if for no other reason than to understand your
    roots and history.”

    I recommend the Orthodox Study Bible for any studying Christian or anyone with intellectual curiosity into Christianity. The Orthodox study Bible’s Old Testament is translated from the Septuagint. It’s one of the few that are as most English Bible translations use the Masoretic text for the Old Testament. The Septuagint Bible was the Bible Jesus and the Apostles used. The Orthodox Study Bible also includes several books that were taken out of Protestant and Catholic Bibles, but were once considered part of the Bible. I’d go as far as saying this is a must have for every Christian:
    https://www.amazon.com/Orthodox-Study-Bible-Hardcover-Christianity/dp/0718003594/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1473448387&sr=1-1&keywords=orthodox+study+bible

26. Nice read – I am enjoying these pieces. (And Max, if you ever need a pinch-hitter for one of these undercover religious investigations, I am definitely available for the Satanic Lesbian Orgy gig…)

27. As a child from mixed Catholic – Orthodox marriage I was privileged to explore both “sides”. Orthodox Church has more interesting funerals in my opinion (however that morbidly sounds), Catholic Mass has priest talking about life, more interesting then ceremonies in Orthodox Church.

28. “Indolences”
    “Predestination”
    “The Eucharist is similar to, but more than, a mass or communion.”
    Your grasp of religion leaves a lot to be desired.

29. Interesting read. My main “beef” (for want of a better word) with Orthodox church, is they have much stronger ties to the ethnic community they serve, like Greek, Serb, Russian, etc. Therefore it would be much tougher for an outsider to break in. It’s heartening to see the people were very welcoming of an outsider in the service.. but I’m not sure how well that would translate into being accepted into the community, if you’re not “one of them”.
    I mean, like the author says, just for starters being a white male is a must. And too bad if you hate borcht..

    1. Look into the American Orthodox Church (in full communion with Constantinople Patriarchy (see https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecumenical_Patriarch_of_Constantinople ) and all the fellow Orthodox churches), which has members from all the ethnic orthodox churches but holds services in English — you’ll get a younger crowd in general (more singles) but with strong orthodox traditional ways intact.
       The OCA is the ‘ethnic’ Orthodox Church of
       North America, of Americans & Canadians so to speak:
       https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthodox_Church_in_America
       But I want to stress that I believe in the brotherhood of all Nicene Creed Christian churches (orthodox, Catholic, Protestant, oriental, Anglican) if the are the conservative traditional versions of each of those traditions (i.e. Conservative Anglicans etc), so if you already belong to one tradition try to find the conservative version ( i.e. The original version of your family’s Christian tradition if any). Of course you are welcome to the American Orthodox Church (OCA) as well.

30. I’m Orthodox I was surprised and pleased to see this article on here and know Roosh also has Orthodox family roots.
    Here is some orthodox music in English so that so of you who don’t speak Greek , Russian, Serbian, Bulgarian or other commonly used tongues in Orthodox service and music can get a gist of the dedication towards God this type masculine music portrays:
    Greek Orthodox memorial service ( old Byzantine song) chanted by Greek Orthox priest in English
    
    Russian Orthodox Psalm 111 Russian Orthodox monks (Valaam monastery brothers in Russia –sung in English):
    

    1. Beautiful music.

31. Sorry to air my suspicion, but obviously something’s awfully out of it’s place here on ROK.
    What the fuck is this shit with ,,Russia’s so great” ,,Putin’s so great!!”

    1. This is a site which celebrates masculinity, patriarchy, tradition, and values. A good summary of the things we believe is here.
       http://www.rooshv.com/neomasculinity
       Perhaps it’s you who are out of place.

       1. I am in error, I did not express myself very well.
          What I was trying to say is, how come we can talk shit about the US, talk shit about every single leader, but absolutely nothing about the violent soviet inflitration and of the west and east ?
          We talk about Marx and Lenin and Stalin as if they were from another planet, they came, they killed, they detracted entire cultures, but somehow, all of that ideology ,,evapored” ?
          It’s still here, it’s poisonous, it’s spread throughout the US and the EU but one of it’s primary roots comes from………today’s Russia.
          How come we talk about the bads, but we don’t go deeper into today’s happenings?
          I am Eastern European Orthodox.

          1. The world was a far different place in the Soviet era. America was doing some evil shit back then too, but it was a far more pleasant, happy, socially stable place to live, with a significant middle class, diversified economy, and lack of extreme feminism and political correctness.
             We will talk shit about anyone who is not upholding neomasculine principles, and hold up anyone who is. It doesn’t really matter who their parents are, what their skin color is, or what language they speak. To quote a great woman: “Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people”
             Should we criticize and attack Russia because that’s the geographical area that Lenin came from? Well then I guess Germany is also fair game because Karl Marx was born there. And why not America, then? After all Big Red, Trigglypuff, and Lena Dunham were all birthed in the US, so that must make everything within its national borders a wasteland, right?
             See the problem with that kind of thinking?
             Here’s a better question for those who despise the ideas of Marx, Lenin, and Stalin. What nation today follows more planks of the Communist Manifesto? The USA or Russia? Far more important than what passport the creators of the ideology held. Hell, if Marx didn’t write it, someone else eventually would. The idea and its effects are what is important. Not the single individual who propelled it.

32. Orthodox world is divided in national churches. There is communion between them, but they are not 100% the same. Better avoid Greek orthodoxs they are in decline and weak. Also they are controlled heavily by USA.
    The main con of orthodox nations is they tend to produce pro-communist/collectivist anti-individualistic societies. In the most common case, Church is controlled and used by the state. Also there is no tradition of military monastic orders, like knights of Malta Teutonic Knights. They didn’t take part in the Crusades, and they are proud of it, by repeating modern leftist propaganda. Not everything is perfect. A mix of old Catholicism and orthodoxy would be best. Of course, now, compared to the present Pope they are like the last defenders of Christianity

33. confession was used as power so the church could use the secrets against you.
    big lips sink ships.

    1. Not so much.
       It is biblical that of having a confessor and seeking absolution for moral transgressions via contrition seeking absolution and atonement

34. The crusades were absolutely necessary and were reclaiming of lands stolen by Muslims and their sword.
    Otherwise I think the orthodox have it right

    1. What Christian movement today wants to retake the Holy Lands?

    2. The Crusades were also a way for the younger sons of noble families, who had been left without land to inherit from their fathers because of primogenitur, to claim land for themselves in the Levant by the strength of their sword-arms and the courage of their hearts.

35. I have really enjoyed your tour of these various denominations. I was raised Lutheran but I gave up on that when I was 13 years old because even back then (1969) it was too liberal for me. Also, it was boring, except whenever there was some lithe Scandinavian or German girl with a nice, right round ass standing before me during the service. I drifted spiritually for many years, eventually discovering the Norse Gods and getting involved with the revived version of that Tradition back in 1995. But if I absolutely had to give that up and pretend to be a Christian in order to survive, I would pick the Orthodox Church, especially its Russian version, because of the reasons mentioned in this tour: beautiful churches, beautiful mystical liturgy, beautiful healthy young Slavic women, overall earthy and genuinely hospitable people. Also I’ve noticed that their priests love to drink heartily with their parishioners during their feasts. As for marriage, their priests are not only allowed to marry, but they are encouraged to do so and to have children, as examples for their parishioners and so that they can more wisely give them advice about marriage and raising a family.

36. “and Protestants have subtracted from it, by ignoring good works and disciplin”
    As a Presbiterian, this kinda hurts. But you’re mostly mistaken. It is because we’re strict in our doctrine is that denominations separate from rooted protestantism. And Luther was ONE of many priests and individuals that started the protestant reformation. I reccomend the story of Genebra and John Calvin to understand the roots of protestantism.
    I think it would be good If there could be only one Christian denomination, but the hearts of men is too hard for it. And the Orthodox Church is no different, since the Roman Catholics split from them.

37. An example of superb Russian Orthodox male choral singing, this is a choir of Russian monks singing “Save, O Lord, Thy People”:
    

    1. The words are: “Save, O Lord, thy people, and bless thine inheritance. Grant victory to Orthodox Christians over their adversaries. And by the power of thy cross, preserve their habitation.”
       Someone told me that these words are from the anthem of the Byzantine Empire, but I think that the tune is Russian. I prefer the sound of the Russian liturgy to the sound of the Balkan churches, because to my Northern European ear the latter sound a bit Middle Eastern and therefore spiritually foreign to my Northern soul.

38. Nice, love the article. For those bad mouthing the Church in the comments below, yeah thats a good place to get your facts from tory and secularists.

39. So essentially, Orthodox is the original thing, Catholicism is the “progressive stack”, and Protestantism is a rebellion to religious leftism.
    Funny how everything tends to mimic that pattern

40. might i add to all the men who advocate “game”,and “fucking hot bitches” and the like,are not positive traits taught in Orthodox Christianity(or any other branch of Christianity)…We absolutely believe in male headship in marriage and within the Church. but this “pick up artist” stuff that many authors on here promote is not approved by Christianity.
    a little lesson on “game” for Christians…Christian men dont use “game”. there is no game to us. honesty and straightforwardness always. THAT is our game,not playing with a womans emotions to get your desired outcome. and guess what,it works.
    A woman doesnt respect you for playing “the game” she respects you for standing up to her when shes wrong and you are right,even if it hurts her feelings. she respects you for always adhering to your morals,and defending whats true and right even when its not popular or easy. that lesson applies to more than relationships. it applies to everything.
    i have NO respect for you whoremongers who try your hardest to simply pick up all the women you can and “pump and dump” them. you are doing nothing more than furthering the degeneracy of women,as if it wasnt already bad enough! not to mention,if shes already a whore then why would you stoop to her level? a true Christian man simply ignores whores,as scripture teaches that they bring you shame and destruction.
    also,if you arent interested in being a good christian man,stay away from our women. church is not your personal dating service for you to “pick up and fuck hot christian virgins” there are many “men” who do just that,and it is evil. we dont want you there corrupting our women!

41. My advice is to, as a rule, stay away from the Greek Orthodox churches and focus on Serbian, Russian, Antiochian, and Orthodox Church of America ones.
    They’re all the same church, simply organized by ethnicity, but the American Greek diocese is the most “American,” of them all. Greek Americans are also some of the most pozzed people you meet in general; the people in Greek churches who are decent people and act the most “Orthodox” are invariably WASPy former protestant converts who make up with zealotry for all of the Greek’s garbage tier sjw bullshit they try to inject.

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