A great many guys read game articles or watch videos online and get proficient at approaching girls and asking for their phone numbers. The problem is that they don’t get any further than this, and there is nothing more frustrating than having a smartphone full of flaky numbers with girls acting half-hearted and shying away from coming to meet you on dates.
If you are looking to pull hot girls with the idea of finding a relationship, or even just for temporary fun, then you need to learn how to get over this particular hump. Below I tell you exactly why you’re getting into this situation and the steps you need to get out of it.
Phone Number Purgatory
Let’s be honest, we’ve all been there. You see a cute girl in the street, walk up to her, give her whatever spiel you’ve taken from this week’s YouTube video, have a friendly chat and then you ask for the number. But later on when you contact her you find that the number fails to lead you to the sexual nirvana you had hoped it would. Instead she either ignores your messages or is polite but flaky.
If this happens to you several times a month then that’s fine—flakiness is usual and to be expected. When you’re walking up to random girls in the street or club you are to some extent playing a numbers game, as well as competing with whoever else is blowing up her phone on WhatsApp, Tinder and so on. But if you are finding yourself in phone number purgatory consistently—if it is a pattern rather than an occasional occurrence—then it is likely that you are doing something wrong in your approach.
Here’s the problem—when guys first get into game they massively overestimate the degree of sexual intent they are injecting into their interactions. And that makes sense. After all, if you’ve hardly ever approached in your life then the mere act of telling a girl she looks cute should be—-logic would dictate—enough to let her know that you have a dick and you are interested in her. Unfortunately, this is not the case and far too many guys are having friendly, flat, non-sexually charged conversations with girls, projecting a ‘nice guy’ aura and getting blown out.
Don’t be one of those guys—as with everything in life, pick-up works much better when you put everything you have on the line.
Avoiding Risk
The central issue is that most guys (and girls) are risk averse—they don’t want to put themselves on the line for fear of being hurt and humiliated. Nothing wrong with that. From an evolutionary perspective it makes total sense for a human being to avoid danger. In pre-historic times a man risked being torn limb from limb for approaching a woman from outside of his tribe, so the inbuilt fear of approaching we all feel to some extent is based on a human precedent that is inbred.
There are two problems with this, though: one, we no longer live in prehistoric times and two, appearing risk-averse looks profoundly unsexy.
Look, in 2017 the risks associated with politely approaching girls are extremely low. I have approached thousands of girls over the years and almost nothing bad has ever come of it. OK, I’ve annoyed a couple of boyfriends and been embarrassed a few times, but I have never been physically attacked, arrested or killed. Now, I’m not saying that any of those things couldn’t conceivably happen in the course of a pick-up—of course they could. Just that, as long as you’re calibrated and approach with light and cheeky humour they are all extremely unlikely.
The other thing is that, put simply, girls like guys who take risks. I have got with girls who probably wouldn’t have looked at me twice largely because I’ve had the balls to run up to them in the street and express my sexual interest in them. This is where cold-approach pickup has a huge edge over Tinder—you can, through your actions, demonstrate your qualities as a man (boldness, courage, sexual intent etc). So why half-ass it? Far better to go all in with every girl you approach and let her know precisely what you want.
The issue is that girls are taught to be polite (OK, there are plenty of bitches out there, but stay with me). Handing over a phone number is in many cases merely a form of politeness—a more pleasant way to get rid of a guy. The path of least resistance.
While new guys probably know this on some level, they choose to ignore it. They perform the lowest-impact approach they can, take the number, go home feeling like they’ve scored a victory and then complain online when the girl doesn’t respond or refuses a date. Then they go out the next week, do the same thing again and so the cycle repeats itself.
How To Avoid Phone Number Purgatory
Look, the only way you’re going to avoid falling into this trap is by going all-in. What do I mean by that? I mean every time you approach a girl, whether you go direct or indirect (and that’s a whole other topic) you need to leave her in no doubt why you are talking to her and what you want.
As I said, many guys have this ‘well I approached her and I told her she was pretty so she must know I was trying to pick her up’-mentality. No, no, no. Girls don’t always know why you’re approaching them. You may simply be being friendly. You might be gay. Unless you make it absolutely clear that you are approaching with sexual intent you risk being ignored, or worse, friend-zoned.
Now, I’m certainly not advocating that you walk up to women and tell them you want to bang them straight off the bat. That would be uncalibrated and counterproductive. But what you must do is communicate your intent through deep eye contact, touch and verbal spikes.
When you are talking to her, even if you’ve approached her indirectly asking for directions, she should be in no doubt of the message your eyes are communicating to her—that you’re imagining her naked and you like what you see. There’s no short cut to this, it takes practice, but try thinking sexual thoughts while you are speaking. That will get you a lot of the way there.
You should also try to touch her. Not in a weird, creepy way. Just on the forearm or maybe the back. What you need to do from the first meeting is to break through the ‘strangeness’ or you and her getting physical so that it becomes anchored in her mind as something natural and pleasant. This will make the transition to sex later on a hell of a lot easier.
Finally, you must drop verbal spikes into the conversation. The two methods I use most commonly are double entendre and challenging. When speaking to a girl I will commonly misinterpret whatever she says as having a sexual undertone to it (‘Oh, it’s raining hard. Do you like it hard?’ etc). I will also challenge her on some aspect of her personality (‘You say this is the best coffee shop in town? I’m not sure I believe you. Show me your barista certification etc.)
You must tease and you must make the conversation crackle with sexual energy. Unless you’re going for a same-day lay or one-night stand you have to ensure that you’ve peaked sufficient interest in her (i.e. vaginal tingles) that when you text her you aren’t merely that nice, friendly, entirely forgettable boy she talked to briefly outside the metro station.
Want to find out more about how to approach and seduce sexy girls? Buy Troy’s bestselling book, The Seven Laws of Seduction. Follow Troy on Twitter here.
Read More: 5 Ways Trump’s Presidency Will Impact Game
I never ask for a girls phone number until I’ve had sex with her. If the sex was no good, she ain’t getting my number.
What’s scary is this is something to the numbers game which I have noticed as well. When you have the chance to build rapport and go for the lay, it is always a better option. Always easier to get things to progress if you either started with something and strike quick, or you went all of the way and just want to stay in touch.
Tired of phone number purgatory? Wanna get a girls phone number and make damn sure she’ll either answer or call you back? Take a lesson from Loc Dog. (0:40)
The best way to escape phone number purgatory: Have so many numbers, and be so busy with your awesome life, that you don’t even notice if you’re there.
This is generally true. I would also add that you should know how to read people…Pay attention to subtle cues, her body language, physical contact etc. But also remember that whatever she is saying is not true, but it IS a true reflection of what she wants you to think. I take for granted that women are lying all the time. The 10% of the time I am wrong is totally worth the dice roll. However, just because they are lying doesn’t mean there isn’t truth to mine if you know where to look. While her words may not be literally true, she wants you to think a certain way about her….so her lies are there to create that image. What does she want you to think about her? Once you unlock the motive behind the lies you will know if she is worth any more time.
If you sense that she is just biding time until a better option comes along, then she will find that better option. Don’t feel bad about walking away mid conversation. You are a man, not the National Foundation for Listening to Women’s Bullshit.
‘National Foundation for Listening to Women’s Bullshit’,
another classic coinage…
I second that.
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“National Foundation for Listening to Women’s Bullshit.”
Uncle Knee, you just won the internet. lol
Solid. Gold.
It appears that this article was written for guys who have trouble closing the deal – and you are obviously way past that stage. So in the interest of esprit de corps, and helping other men here in the community, please, tell us how to get there. Tell us how we can have such an awesome life and such a huge cache of girls’ phone numbers, that we won’t even notice being in phone number purgatory. Perhaps you might even do us all a very great favor and actually submit an ROK article on the subject. That would be awesome.
“It appears that this article was written for guys who have trouble closing the deal ”
I love Troy’s articles. Most of them are old hat when I read them and I think “oh that is obvious” but then I realize that Troy isn’t writing his articles for me. Everyone has different strengths and weaknesses and I think Troy does a great job zeroing in on some guys weaknesses and giving solid, tested and intelligent advice on how to over come them. A lot of people read these articles incorrectly imo. If you are already a journeyman carpenter a lesson in introduction to carpentry isn’t going to seem very exciting to you however, if you can’t see how a novice would benefit than it is your loss.
Everybody has to start somewhere. Mm-hmm.
I am sure that an article that would be geared to me and help me make pictures on the computer like you do with Beta Magazine would be hilariously amateurish to you. But I am a total computer illiterate, so any information that better helps me play around with my magic box is excellent for me.
I have encountered guys who are really outgoing and personal and all around really great dudes who totally fucking freeze up and blow it the second they talk to a woman. It is like Dr. Jeckyl and Mr. Can’t Get Fucking Laid. Guys like that benefit a great deal from stuff like this.
Chalk me up as one of them. Ive been red-pilled since before there was a name for it. But i lock up like PTSD when a woman pays any attention to me at all. And now im 46yo.
My buddy will be in the bar most socially guy in the world and some girl will approach him (he is a good looking fit guy) and he will go like full on idiot tourettes. I wish I knew the solution. I tell people, oh just keep at it but really that is bullshit. I have always been a social guy. Even as a kid I was really social and talking to people has always come very easy to me. It is disingenuous for me to say “just keep at it”
Do you find that there are things you can do to mitigate the problem. If so, an article from the perspective of someone who has and beats the issue might be more valuable than from someone who just assumes everyone can do it if they just act a certain way.
Youve really caused me to think. This is an agonizing problem. Ive retyped this response a half dozen times because it needs to be genuine.
Everything changes if I refuse to acknowledge my attraction. But its not an answer. I end up friend-ed and witness to everyone elses success.
If I could find a way to disavow but pursue… middle ground. But then, I should have thought about this 15 years ago when I still had options.
I think you should look at this as an opportunity rather than a problem. You have a challenge set in front of you. If you can conquer this you could not only improve your own life markedly but also do wonders for other men with the same issue. You should set some concrete goals, small step by step ones, to take on the things that are hard for you one at a time.
In bits and pieces I have always pursued some of the individual tenets of neo-masculinity. But it was upon discovering ROK and this community that brought it all into clear, practicable focus. Im proudly two years in.
If there is a way to help anyone else count me in. No one should have to grow comfortable staring into the abyss. One action that I still think is a good idea is doing some local meet-ups. Habitat for Humanity had a project going up back in august and 30 or so women from a Univ had volunteered. But of course I go and focus on building a house and working my ass off.
Perhaps the solution to making that work is going to be doing something Im not familiar with? Im trying to think like a hunter – dont wander the forest looking for deer. Go to where they frequent and prepare.
I really appreciate the frank discussion and good honest advice. Its helping me be honest with myself rather than kicking my own ass.
I don’t know much about hunting, but it sounds like the right idea. Get out of your comfort zone, learn something new and don’t be afraid to make an ass of yourself doing it. If you live near a big body of water I would suggest that this summer you find a beginners paddle boarding class. Always lots of women, always a fun time and after people are always going out to drink. If you can laugh at yourself when you fall off a paddle board you will be fine.
Damn right! You know, even H4H would work if I took the focus off of building the entire house by myself, and focused on being a ‘helper.’ At one project I was leading a crew of four co’eds putting up vinyl siding. It was sunny. Everyone had a great time.
Youre on to something. I need to identify a half dozen appropriate activities. TBC
When I first joined the Navy, a guy from Iowa made us do the following when going to a club-
– Get drinks, settle for 5 minutes.
– One person is selected as ‘it’. He has 5 minutes to approach a girl, ask her to dance, get into conversation. If he fails to select someone, the group selects for him.
– Group observes the fun, then selects the next person in the barrel.
– It is amazing how quickly you get used to approaching women if you simply practice it. In the above, after doing this about 4 or 5 times it gets boring because no one is hesitant about approaching a woman. I once approached a beautiful young lady, obviously with her boyfriend just because she kept looking at the dance floor and tapping her foot, while occasionally looking forlornly at him. She was like a puppy that just wanted to play fetch. Our whole group kept her dancing all night– boyfriend, who was rather large, was not a happy man.
You can do something similar on a personal level. As in the project above– I will show up, start a task and at 30 minute/1hr point I will approach the most attractive woman and ask her some questions about how she happened to be here. However that encounter turns out- back on task for whatever the set period is, then- pick another woman and same thing.
Depending on where you live groupon may be a great resource for that. I often find very cool things on groupon from water sports to booze cruises to movie nights or one time I drove a Ferrari on a track.
NICE – I like that! …a Buddhist friend always urged me to approach dating with ultimate confidence and accept results with utter indifference.
I’m not a player or a guy with ultimate game or anything. I did have 4 sisters and was around all their friends. So they weren’t a huge mystery to me. Had a great mother and read too many Zane Grey novels which did kind of provide an inflated view.
Anyway– I found the above as useful in getting over fear/hesitance in approaching women. But, since I was never huge on the whole promiscuous sex thing– Catholic– can’t help you much after that.
No man. Your well-meaning advice was spot on.
Ive often thought- and I’m looking for exceptions- but I grew up with three brothers…
I tell every man I meet that the #1 most important thing is to FIND PURPOSE. It’s the thing you were put on this earth to do. It’s a calling.
Some of us know our purpose from a young age. Others find it years later. Some never know their purpose.
That purpose will carry you through everything. It cushions all the shocks. It helped me brush off my divorce like dandruff off the shoulder. And the irony is that women are drawn to a man with purpose, especially if you let them know that they’ll always play second fiddle.
Oh yeah, and phone numbers. If you’ve been talking to her right, she’ll turn over the digits quick. One simple trick: “Hey give me your number so that I can ________(neg something we just talked about)________ before you embarrass yourself.” Make it clear that she’s a menace to herself and you will correct her for her own good. Subtle dominance cue. Sets the stage.
Mission Accomplished
https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/05b2717513b64be0b8d1e8e3cf524dba64cfe206f96983e1b76dc60e3a6c68aa.jpg
it is purpose that define us.
We’re not here because we’re free. We’re here because we’re not free.
There is no escaping reason; no denying purpose. Because as we both
know, without purpose, we would not exist.
Well actually getting the numbers wasn’t what Troy was getting at though…
Hey Flipper!
Once a year you will now be able to just grab her by the pussy. https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/4e7dc8d46429a75b92b99b4345d0ab6854ab68fa8743de4762af15811dc40f38.jpg
I would call you a cunt but you lack the requisite warmth and depth
She (literally hitler)
C-ant U-nderstand N-ormal T-hinking
I saw this somewhere but couldn’t come up with a better acronym. So copy paste it is.
Nice, I like it.
Caring Understanding Nineties Type. Look up the song.
Can U Not Talk
Kevin Bloody Wilson – way ahead of his time!
Amongst many not-to-be-missed Redpill songs of his, I particularly like “Do you fuck on first dates?”
“Do you fuck on first dates
Does you Dad own a brewery
Could I feel Your tits
Or would you show ’em to me
If the answer is no
to me questions above
Then be a good sport and give me the name
Of a girlfriend who does”
Classics…
In fact just read the lyrics for the whole thing: http://bit.ly/2iBB6sN
Haha “i hope I havent made a prick of meself with my song about bein a cunt”
I’m definitely going to use that in public from now on.
As a side note you might find humorous, about a decade ago my cousins and I got a boat together. We had it for one summers. An awesome little 4 Winns we kept on the Hudson. The name of the boat was “Sea U Next Tuesday” We always said if we got another we would call it “The Wednesday After That”
“Monday Is Next Group Encounter”
“Pick Up Saturday/Sunday, Yes?”
“Monday Usually Follows Friday”
Haha love it.
I think shes sweet – -I’ll give her 98 per hour
looks like a pillow queen to me. That is not a girl who is going to push you down and ride you reverse cowboy.
Yeah; why doesn’t the moderator filter out these spam messages?
They do give me a chance to use some funny stfu lines and they usually get culled out sooner or later.
Little black book!
Sam was the man!
He was, except when he dealt with Gary’s Old Town Tavern. He could never beat Gary
Yeah, Gary had his number. He also couldn’t keep Rebecca from becoming a fat cow.
? I think you are confusing Gary with Robin Colcorde
No way…just mentioning Rebecca separately.
ah okay. His black book reminds me of another paper- related story: My friend, as a goof, maybe to pysche himself up a bit, tore a piece of paper out of a notebook, wrote at the top “Bitches phone numbers” and proceeded to write 1_____, 2____, 3___ etc on it. We all laughed.
Well, later that night, he was about to get the number of this gorgeous lady (this was the late 90s, so she would be “smokin” or “slammin” at that time) he whips out that piece of paper, she reads the top, and man, man oh man! you shoulda seen the look on her face! Im surprised she didnt dump her drink on his head.
Kratom per day keeps rejections away.
Or is that cocaine? Never seem to remember these things.
In short, women in the west are so solipsistic that they think everyone thinks like them and expect you to be able to read their mind in real time. I just act like I don’t care and say random shit. They get curious and chase after me, much better than playing their stupid game. The sexual market is a battlefield, women are your conquest. Conquerers who play by their opponents rules are rarely successful.
Just like what Trump does.
Exactly. It is no coincidence the media fell as soon as someone had the balls and power to refuse to play by their rules. The media is run by men, but is largely disseminated by women. Women in journalism did not fare very well against trump.
Look how well Trump handled Katy Tor from NBC. Just studying her body language shows that she was way into him. He was forceful, negged her, complimented her, etc. Guy is a master of game.
Absolutely brilliant. She probably thinks she did bad in the first interview because she liked him all along. I have a picture on my computer somewhere on my other PC of Trump shaking hands with Reagan while Nancy is giving him fuck me eyes.
Exactly act like you don’t care about her little opinions and say whatever you gotta say without any remorse and they will swarm all over you. Oooh God I can wait to get to that point.
Only solution: move on to the next one.
Funny thing is the phone number purgatory thing is fairly common so it isn’t ever truly the problem. Lack of abundance will always hurt more.
or two
I don’t even know how to score a number from a random girl I meet.
You usually get it towards the tail end of the conversation. After you get the number make an excuse to leave. Don’t want to linger too long after you got it. Makes you look needy.
My problem is actually to have conversations with random girls. Aso, I can’t imagine how to transition from a random, smalltalk conversation to “btw give me your number”.
Why do millennial chicks keep sending me eggplant emojis? Am I missing the signals or something? I text her back and ask her do you want to go shopping at whole foods? Then she sends me emoji of dolphin jumping in the air. What the fuck is that? Millennial chicks have so many dick pics saved to her phone, they just sit back on the sofa at home watching tv in the evening and flip through them and send emojis to guys they want to fuck.
Send back the giving the middle finger emoji and see what response you get back.
Texting negs is so 10 years ago. That game is stale.
Well, it seems like what you’re doing is not working by the way you’re bitching about it in your post.
@verified account might actually have a point; unless you catch her attention sharpish with a good Insta account then your text will float in sea of other texts she’ll receive. The ROI is not what is used to be.
eggplant is meant to represent the peen!
Good that somebody explained that to the middle age fucks trying to teach game here.
The question is did she send it to say you are a peen or to say she wants your peen? This of course leads to two possible meanings for the dolphin.
Easy broham, let’s not emrage Gen X’s. Statements like that could cause a real katzenjammer.
You are obviously from a low context culture.
Don’t forget the kratom
I never seek a girls number unless we have touched in a significant way. I find that you don’t get flaking, but you will get an occasional change of heart about that boyfriend she was mad at.
Some will. Some won’t. So what? Next.
It’s great that with the world falling apart someone has had the sheer guts to raise this vital issue. Any sane woman seeing this article will feel that men are just a bunch of childish jerks.
By sane women you obviously mean the ones who complain about men who take up too much space on the subway. I mean with the world falling apart and all.
How dare someone post an article about Game on a manosphere site! What the fuck is the world coming to, muthafucka?
It’s good advice to be more direct in a light funny, banterish way but you have to make it look natural and seamless and that means being comfortable using that approach. I don’t see introverted guys saying “oh, so you like it hard?” If the girl says it’s raining hard. Maybe it’s better for some guys to build up to that kind of sexually charged banter by simply being asexually friendly at first. Maybe some advice on how to build up to a more direct approach? I feel like the OP hasn’t considered the awkwardness some guys would feel trying this approach as it involves stepping way outside of your comfort zone.
Ps I wouldn’t advise touching a random girl on the back or arm while asking for directions. That’s strange. Imagine a random guy walking up to you for directions and while you talk to him he’s stroking your arm or has his hand on your back. How would you feel? That’s how she would also feel.
Yeah, I think a direct approach just isn’t enough. There needs to be something more – if not overtly sexual than some deep emotional connection. The hypnosis-like persuasion techniques can help on this matter too I think (pacing and leading), combined with the challenge can help some newer guys afraid to escalate. I haven’t fully deployed these yet though.
Smartphones really set you back, but just having a conversation shouldn’t your goal once you can control your approach anxiety. I’ve been there.
I’m going to solve all of your problems with women in this short post, free of charge.
If you have a bunch of phone numbers that go nowhere, you have three basic problems:
1) you are not attractive
2) you are not dominant
3) you are not edgy
What to do then? First, lift some fucking dumbells three times a week. Five sets of five reps each. Takes half an hour, max. Eliminate all carbs from your diet for a couple weeks. You don’t have to be handsome. Watch the movie Urban Cowboy. The villain in that movie is butt-ugly but still very attractive to women because of the shape he’s in and his utter selfishness.
Second, stop giving a fuck. If you want to know what that looks like, watch Californication and see how Hank Moody treats all women (aside from his daughter and his baby mama). When you truly don’t give a fuck, you will act the same way and say the same kind of things. Be selfish, and always put yourself first. Being totally selfish = not giving a fuck, in case you didnt know.
Finally, since we’re talking about Hank Moody, dress like him. It’s easy to do, the clothes are basic, edgy, comfortable, inexpensive and never go out of style. Sure, there are other ways you could dress effectively, but this is the bare-bones, cheap-ass, minimal effort way to bad boy alpha glory.
Do these simple things and you’ll be swimming in pussy. Not giving a fuck and dressing like a bad boy will start getting you women well before you reach top physical shape. And you won’t need to ask for phone numbers ( nowadays,with peak hypergamy, unless a woman has already basically thrown herself at you, asking for a number is practically worthless, as well as a sign of weakness).
Nothing really new here, but don’t just read this; do the fucking steps and you will see results. What you’ll probably notice first is that women you’re not attracted to will go absolutely apeshit when you’re around and openly proposition you. As you continue on, you’ll quickly see HBs of increasingly higher value doing the same. It doesn’t take long.
What does Hank Moody wear that’s so edgy? I never watched the show, but just googled his images….jeans and a black shirt are edgy??
It’s classic bad boy attire. Probably not sufficient by itself; you need to be at least somewhat attractive and dominant (selfish), hence my 3 points.
When TV commercials want to depict an attractive man, they often show him in a dark T shirt and jeans, and often driving a muscle car.
Same with the dark, untucked and partially unbuttoned dress shirt. And black leather blazer, of course. Dress like Furio from The Sopranos, or like Mike Ness from Social Distortion. All variations on the theme.
Sometimes phone game takes time, I smash a few girls that ignore me at first sometimes months later. It’s just a quantity game.
“Oh, it’s raining hard. Do you like it hard?”
I got I say that or any guys says it most girls now in days will look at it as perverted or creepy stand point.
Just delete the numbers. Very simple.