Helping Friends Who Have No Game Is A Bad Idea

One of the natural effects of having or developing advanced game is an impulse to help your close friends who aren’t quite as fortunate as you. Seeing a friend paralyzed by simple interactions with the opposite sex, languishing in a relationship with a sub-standard girl, or being held back by the series of relationship myths that are force-fed to men—which are grounded in zero real-world realities—is enough to tempt even the coldest-hearted player into generously breaking off some crumbs from his hard-earned wisdom loaf.

Even if you’re not overpowered by your generosity—or game reflexes—you’re bound to get half-hearted solicitations for your “secrets” sooner or later. Like a guy with a cooler of sweaty bottles of Gatorade in the desert, you and your riches will elicit the envy of the thirsty.

But talk to any experienced player and he will tell you the same thing: throwing a blue-pill, no-game, sexless friend a game lifeline comes with major risks.

He Simply Won’t Get It

Unless he’s a young guy who simply hasn’t had exposure yet (an increasingly unlikely scenario given the penetration of game-related material on the Internet), odds are your friend has had ample opportunities to observe and pick up elementary “game” in the real world. Yet, he’s repeatedly passed up the opportunity. Instead, he probably buys into the mainstream, romantic-comedy version of dating, where things “just happen” and the “right girl” will fall out of the sky onto his dick if he waits long enough. Or, worse, he will have been infected by full-fledged feminist brainwashing: that deliberate efforts to meet and connect with women are “predatory” or “creepy”; that pursuing attractive girls is “shallow”; or that “game” is a series of mind-bending tricks to manipulate or confuse “insecure girls” into sleeping with you. Talking a guy out of this mindset is—if not outright impossible or dangerous—a time commitment ten times bigger than you imagine.

He Will Make Endless Excuses

Since it’s unlikely that your friend has zero idea about what to do, chances are that he’s actually a pussy, lazy, or simply not ready to undertake the long, arduous journey of learning game. Like learning a musical instrument or language, getting good with women requires years of work to learn, and an on-going commitment to maintain. His problem, in other words, goes well beyond simply not knowing game. He lacks the prerequisite personality traits necessary and mindset to improve. Whether it’s insecurity about his height or race, faultfinding all the prospects around him, or the classic I’m-not-looking-to-bang-tons-of-girls-I’m-just-looking-for a-girlfriend logic, a man who’s not ready will engage in the most impressive verbal and mental acrobatics to stay precisely where he is.

He Won’t Value Your Advice

Before I knew any better, I spend countless hours trying to help a miserably sexless friend who was habitually friendzoned by the surprisingly many cute girls in his social circles. He sat by as guy after guy plucked girls from his stable of crushes, pounded them out for a while, and returned them to the bin, like unrewinded video tapes to a Blockbuster. I eventually banged one of those girls myself, and he actually “confronted” me on the phone about it:

No-Game Friend: …I think you should set me up with one of your female friends.

Me: I don’t have any female friends. And, why?

No-Game Friend: Because you got Amanda because of me. You could set me up with your friend Sara.

Me: I met Amanda on my own, you didn’t even introduce us. And, Sara has a boyfriend. Not to mention that I’m currently trying to bang her. [I eventually did]

No-Game Friend: Bottom line is you met Amanda at my party. You got something because of me and I never get anything from you!

Me: Are you kidding me? Amanda wasn’t even there for your party, it’s just coincidence that you happen to know her. Plus, I’ve been helping you for months, coaching you when we go out, and given you volumes of rock-solid advice I never share with anyone.

No-Game Friend: Advice is worthless. I want girls, not advice.

This story is extreme, but it’s hardly unique. Thirsty beta and blue-pill guys want magic bullets, not prescriptive programs that require social risk and work. They don’t see value in field-tested, results-proven information—especially when it comes free of charge. Guys pay a month’s salary on much less than I’d given him.

He Will Repeatedly Cockblock or Crab You

“Helping your friend” often involves bringing him out with you. That means enduring cockblock after cockblock during their learning phase, not to mention the consequences of the stink of lameness that wafts off of him and hangs over your whole party. Even when this isn’t the case, your friend will not remember or respect the wingman’s code when—crazed by his thirst—he sees the oasis on the horizon.

I once introduced another game-less friend to two Eastern European girls I was working at a club. In the clumsiest and most obvious way, he kept climbing over me to talk to the girl I’d clearly selected (the cuter and slightly thinner of the two), repeatedly interrupting me and ignoring the other girl. When he finally managed to scare them both off, I pulled him aside:

Me: What are you doing, man? You know better than to go after my girl.

No-Game Friend 2: I don’t want the fat one. I want the hot one.

Me: Yeah, it doesn’t matter what you “want.” You didn’t do the work. You know the guy who opens gets to pick. Plus, she’s not even fat!

No-Game Friend 2: Well, if she’s not fat why don’t you take her then?

Me: Because that’s not how it works.

No-Game Friend 2: Well, when they come back why don’t we just see who they pick? [defiantly]

Me: They’re not coming back, you idiot.

You’ll Destroy the Friendship

You broke it, you bought it. When you undisturb your friend’s placid existence—however deluded or sexless it may be—he becomes your responsibility. I’ve heard stories of guys being blamed for future failures (“I said what you told me and I scared the girl away. This was my chance and you fucked me over!”), of thin-skinned newbies not being able to handle the sometimes-brutal feedback, and of former friends becoming active haters (“He only does well with chicks by manipulating them”).

If you’re like me, you actually don’t outright befriend guys who don’t display some degree of game already. I’ve gradually come to the point that I can’t fully respect a man who doesn’t have at least some marginal skills around women, since it speaks to other areas of his personal development, social intelligence, and masculinity.

But when can you help a friend with no game? When he begs you to teach him, and keeps returning after repeated rejections and denials that you even “have game.”

Then you’ll know he truly wants to–and can–learn.

Read More: The Price Of Taking The Red Pill

104 thoughts on “Helping Friends Who Have No Game Is A Bad Idea”

  1. As my third grade teacher used to say, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink. I’ve been trying to impart some red-pill manosphere wisdom in small doses to a friend of mine only to be attacked and marginalized. He did exactly as you said, he engaged in the most impressive verbal and mental acrobatics to stay exactly where he is. I don’t hold any sort of grudge or ill will towards him, but it’s obvious that he’s become resentful of me.
    In the end, looking out for number one is really all a man can do. I’ve learned the hard way it’s not my responsibility to look out for or try to help anyone but myself.

  2. I wrote an essay called “How to get your Professors’ Attention, Along With Coaching and Mentoring,” which is really about how people who don’t know about a field can approach those who do know and how those who know about a field can test seekers.
    One strategy is to tell the seeker to go read something—in this case, The Game, or something more modern—and see if they a) do it and b) if they do, how they react. That’s one low-cost way of trying to learn if your friends with no game can be helped.
    In addition, you never know: perhaps your friends with no game today will, in a couple years, think to themselves, “Tuthmosis told me about that book. . . “

    1. >One strategy is to tell the seeker to go read something—in this case, The Game, or something more modern—and see if they a) do it and b) if they do, how they react. That’s one low-cost way of trying to learn if your friends with no game can be helped.
      this is actually great advice. if they go ahead and do it, and respond positively you know you’re not wasting your time

    2. One of my brothers was a type of guy who I found was led around by his feelings and such. After college he started to change and wise up and one day in the kitchen in my house i had to slip in ‘The Game’ and we talked and talked about it. Now i’m glad he has the knowledge to back up his looks.
      I’m proud of that man even when he falters, and i will continue to be this way. This is the feeling i get whenever i speak to someone who will temp wing man me in a situation or those i help hoping they’d get the hint, and do.

  3. This article will save me a lot of trouble in the future. I used to push my friends into getting better with women with poor results. Even the ones who want help just want the ‘magic bullets’ you speak of. I am no longer going to frustrate only myself with these attempts. Also “The dream of having a girl fall out of the sky and onto your dick” is a hilarious witticism that I will certainly use in conversation sometime in the near future.

    1. Trying to teach game to a beta friend can not only ruin your friendship, but also cause him to become disillusioned, miserable and woman-hater

      1. Right. All of the negative (the demystification of women) without the benefit (increased success with women). You see some of that in the so-called MRA world.

        1. What’s up with the MRA hate bullshit? You know that if you oppose feminist laws and the feminine imperative, you are basically an MRA too right?

        2. I certainly don’t oppose any feminine imperative. Women can be whomever they choose. If there is a feminine imperative, I merely think it shouldn’t dictate and drive the masculine imperative.
          Game, MGTOW, and MR activism are all moves toward reclaiming a male identity that doesn’t seek or require female permission.
          Pick the one you like the best, but all three are fundamentally doing the exact same thing.

    2. The thing is John, you cannot teach a man how to be good with women, as he either has the good looks to attract or he doesn’t. Also, you have to remember that women, not men are the choosers.

      1. You can be he has to be young and actively pursing the knowledge on his own before you even enter the picture.

  4. I learned this lesson recently when trying to show the light to my childhood friend, and get him to drop a hoe. He’s 24, from a wealthy family, but has been tied down to one girl for maybe 5 years (a girl who has cheated on him at least once, probably more.)
    He pretended to agree with me, but his actions showed otherwise. I don’t help those who won’t help themselves.

  5. Learning game and red pill knowledge in general has distanced me from most of my friends. The ones I’ve talked to seem receptive to what I say, I’ve even sent them to some of the courses/material that really helped me, but to no avail. Its strange, because two of my friends who got laid a ton in college, ended up with average, Asian girlfriends they met online. They think its the best they can get. I find that we don’t have much to talk about anymore. They can’t relate to my desire to travel, meet women and be more independent, while they’re stuck in a multi-year relationship, tied to a mortgage, car payment, corporate job, etc. I think it’s best to just lead by example, and if someone is interested in learning more about your lifestyle, let them ask.

    1. Same experience here, eventually you need to go your own way and roll solo. I think it’s perfectly natural for people to grow apart over time.

    2. The red-pill road is a narrow and lonely one. I write about it in another piece here on ROK: The Price of Taking the Red Pill. It’s linked at the bottom of this article.

  6. Goes for co-workers as well. If you ever try to council a guy on what he needs to do to move out of his crappy situation he will resist, even after complaining and asking your advice in the first place. To change means hard work and possible failure and most fellows in that mindset won’t risk it.
    A friend of mine had a mangy dog. Scratching all the time. I tole my friend and he said he had him treated but he went right back to the mange. “I think he likes it that way…” so he gave up and let the dog be.

  7. This is very true, and applies to other areas of esoteric knowledge as well as game. When someone is confronted with a belief system that upsets his worldview, the reaction is normally defensiveness, anger, and contempt. We’ve seen it all before. And this is why many schools of gnostic knowledge historically have had to practice some form of the “lex silentii”, or the rule of silence. Most people are simply incapable of making the leap, due to the reasons Thutmosis states. Instead, you, the bearer of knowledge, will be persecuted.
    But there are always those out there who are willing to listen. Look for the character traits of the true seeker: humility, intelligence, diligence, and discipline. You will know him when you see him. And on that fertile field, scatter some seeds of wisdom. We do have some responsibility, after all, to transmit this information. But first make sure the novice has demonstrated some resolution of purpose and the requisite desire to allow himself to be broken down, and then remade.
    I’m old enough to know you can’t teach an old dog new tricks, but I’m still young enough and stupid enough to keep on trying.

    1. Humility, intelligence, diligence, and discipline. Those qualities are now nothing but a liability in the New America. It’s truly Alice in Wonderland. I still appreciate seeing them, as rare as they are.

      1. I know it’s pretty dark out there, man. Do not despair. Keep the torch lit, know this is a dark historical period to be living in, and know there are like-minded souls still around.

  8. Spreading wisdom is its own reward.
    However, the only person you will ever convert is yourself.
    So it doesn’t matter their reaction…what matters is that the more you teach…the more you learn.

  9. It’s kind of like trying to convince a new-ager of the fallacies of astrology or homeopathy. We hear what we want to – it takes effort to open the mind.

  10. Humans have a natural born right to failure and mistakes. Let them fail; most people are able to learn by experience aka PAIN only. ONLY.
    Words are wasted. Lead by example is good but not enough. They need to feel the pain, deep inside. Only then will the sheep once in a great while find the strength to change.

    1. Humans also have a great way to rationalize any pain. Change is scary after all.

      1. From my experience, I believe people are more terrified of change, (possible long-term discomfort), than pain (short-term discomfort).
        Change your behaviour around your ‘friends’ and you’ll soon see how quickly they want the status quo restored.

    2. Eh, I don’t think of failure as painful – just knowledge gained. Been teaching a friend “game” and the first thing I taught him is to laugh off rejection; it’s all a game and there could be 100 reasons for her saying “no” (period, boyfriend, lesbian, recently heartbroken, father died etc…).

  11. I don’t think this is entirely fair. At some point I noticed that certain friends were getting all the girls, so I asked for advice. The help they gave me really improved my pitiful game. So I think it really comes down to whether a friend is going to be receptive and respectful or a vindictive hater. The journey of game has to start somewhere.

  12. I talked up some very simple game principles on a more mainstream-type site – intending to stir the pot a bit – and of course got a hater snarking back “oh, here’s an MRA”. (Deliberately equating all red pill with all MRA’s – in other words, code for “oh, a small dick, bet he can’t get laid.” Since I was being the troll, I left it there. But it does prove, as noted above, that you can’t defeat an astrology believer with astronomy, or as Ron White puts it more bluntly: “you can’t fix stupid.”

  13. Tuthmosis, I take your points here, but please remember that civilization is all about social cooperation. Your no-game friend may have great skills and natural abilities in the field of auto mechanics, while you may be hopelessly inept in this regard. Would you want him to declare that he would never associate with a man who didn’t have at least a modicum of mechanical knowledge?
    And if he fixes your transmission as a favor, and you have the influence to steer a girl or two his way, wouldn’t you do it?

    1. The thing is, Leo, that a person who shows such traits that point to an unwillingness to learn an important and crucial skill likely does not have any skills to speak of themselves, believe it or not. Someone who REALLY wants to get laid and has REALLY wanted to get laid for a very long time and KNOWS that it is possible to get laid but REFUSES to put forth the effort and then RATIONALIZES himself into a state of cognitive dissonance is a person of weak character and little use to you or society.

      1. How do you conclude that a low-game guy has no other skills. It’s more like the opposite– as the author admits, learning game is a long arduous journey– so an experienced player likely has had less time to develop other competencies such as repairing cars. That’s why we have trade in society. You help me with something you’re good at, I help you with something I’m good at. We don’t all try to be expert at everything. I agree that all men should respect game as a worthwhile skill, but not everyone will have time to develop it to a high level.

        1. The thing is this: when it comes to *skills* it’s more than just passing on information or a one time service. A teacher / adviser can show you the way, but then you have to do the work. There is no way around it.
          You could go to a world class athlete, or musician, or artist or whatever and ask them to teach you their craft, and maybe they will. But they can’t download the skill directly into your brain. To get as good as them you will need to bust your ass as much as they did. Their skill didn’t come without sweating blood, so it won’t be any different for you or anyone else. This article points out at this flaw in many people: wrong mindset, and the expectation that anything can be handed to them on a platter with no effort from them. You can try to teach them as much as you want, but until they fix their mindset, they will remain unteachable.

        2. It’s not just that the person doesn’t have game Leo, it’s all the other things I said too. These are all indicators of a weak person, and weak people don’t have useful skills.

      2. Bullshit!!, I know men who have done everything within their power to meet women, only to be met with hundreds, sometimes thousands of self esteem destroying rejections. Get it through your PUA brainwashed head, that successfully picking women is NOT A SKILL, and is reliant on your looks, and whether the woman finds your physically attractive. Let me tell you what is a “weak character”, being a pussy worshiping PUA/Mangina who thinks that women are perfect and men are stupid.

      3. This is stupid. Getting girls is not a crucial skill. Some people might say that chasing girls (which is all PUA is) is a waste of time.

        1. It’s very closely related to reproduction which is a very very strong imperative. Someone who is lazy and lacks enough work ethic to ignore his most basic needs and put himself in denial about it is not a man of strong character.

    2. Flawed analogy, unless he’s willing to let Tuth drive his ’66 Chevy he’s spent a couple of years and $60,000 restoring, whilst he drives an Edsel.
      >but please remember that civilization is all about social cooperation.
      Civilisation is social control diguised as cooperation to fool the naive. Since feminism has destroyed religion, I’m not morally-obligated to help the weak, lazy and / or willfully-ignorant.
      I was a kid who was always doing the ‘right thing’ for those weaker than me, or those who were bullied. My reward: every single time they’d end up tarnishing me by association, testing my patience and continually drag me down to their level of mediocrity.

      1. So you are willing to make a trade, we’re just debating the terms. I don’t expect something for nothing, just that you recognize other skills as being valuable as well.

    3. @leo: Brononymous already pointed out the flaw in your logic, but there’s another piece. A correct use of your analogy would be if your friend with auto-mechanic skills went around offering to teach guys how to be mechanics–unsolicited. Then he brings the totally unknowledgeable guy, who he’s deemed needing of his skills, into his garage.
      A lot of guys will say they would love to know how to work on cars, but lack the dedication to learn, the tolerance of grease, and the mechanical brain to make that a reality. An ill-suited guy would complain, learn nothing, break shit, and just get in the way of daily operations, not to mention the other guys who work at the garage.
      The right move is to wait for a guy to approach you with a clearly genuine desire to learn and, ideally, be willing to trade his skill for your skill.

      1. I’m agreeing with you that there’s no point in trying to make people into either mechanics or players, unless they show a strong interest and willingness to work at it. But you didn’t answer my questions above. Are there any situations where you would trade actual help– not advice– for a different type of work that you are not proficient in?

        1. The service of fixing a car can’t be compared to just giving a girl to someone. You don’t just give girls to your friends and the girl fucks. The girl still has to be convinced, and if your friend can’t do that…sorry bra, looks like you’re fixing my car and spanking it tonight solo.

  14. I tried teaching some game to a good friend with little female skills. At first, he was intrigued, but now he’s become jealous, does not want to go into social situations where I’ll have more social prowess (aka clubs & around my friends) than him, is trying to actively compete with me for women, and more or less wants to remain friends just to get free advice. At first, I didn’t even mind because he was harmless, but now it’s becoming irritating. Great article. Wish I had this advice earlier.

  15. I would have enjoyed this article more if it was about red pill knowledge because to me that includes simple realities about women that get labeled as PUA but come from before that. Do I try to impart red pill knowledge on my blue pill friends. Do I stop being friends with blue pill people. It often is a lesson in futility to impart red pill knowledge on some one who doesn’t want it and after all that’s why it’s called the red pill because the choice was there whether or not to take it.

      1. I keep my mouth shut these days because most of the time your buddy looks at you like you’re a fucking retard when you try to help them out. “Whaddya mean, ignore them? Whaddya mean, don’t buy them a drink?” It was a good article with a valid point. Never mind, i just read some of your other posts. Why are you even reading this “horseshit”?

      2. I keep my mouth shut these days because most of the time your buddy looks at you like you’re a fucking retard when you try to help them out. “Whaddya mean, ignore them? Whaddya mean, don’t buy them a drink?” It was a good article with a valid point. Never mind, i just read some of your other posts. Why are you even reading this “horseshit”?

  16. ‘But when can you help a friend with no game? When he begs you to teach him, and keeps returning after repeated rejections and denials that you even “have game.”’
    Easy. You shut the fuck up and don’t tell him about your extracurricular activities. I had a friend who was burdened with some lame ass wings that did nothing to help his game. The difference being I don’t advertise. My stupid ass friend couldn’t keep his mouth shut if his mother’s life depended on it and would tell everyone he’s training to be a pickup artist. Game isn’t no charity event for chumps. Unfortunately, the market is saturated with sleazy marketers who tell you anyone can learn game. In truth, only a few people are cut out for it. More isn’t merrier.
    It’s estimated that only 1 out of 5 people who pay for $2,000 bootcamps actually have the drive, determination, and desire to become players. 80% of people are willing to shit on their $2,000 investment. These stats suggest your random joe blow friend isn’t going to care about game.

    1. Rubbish!, a close personal friend of mine paid $3,000 for a PUA bootcamp, and neither he or any other of the 4 students in his PUA class had any success. This was in spite of my friend approaching hundreds of women and learning what he learned back the front.
      PUA is a scam , and anyone who actually believes picking up a woman is skill, is an idiot.

  17. The gameless friend is ready to learn when the pain, misery, and embarassment of getting their hearts ripped out numerous times finally becomes unbearable. Some guys live in a state of comfortable misery.
    They think there is some nobility in being celibate. (There isn’t.)
    They think fucking ONLY 5s and Fat Chicks makes them less shallow than everyboby else. (It doesn’t.)
    They really think the ONLY reason that guy got that girl because he is rich, good looking, dresses nice, fill in the blank. (Blissful Delusions.)
    You can’t save them all. Nor should you. Your friend’s gamelessness is HIS responsibility not yours.

    1. “The gameless friend is ready to learn when the pain, misery, and embarassment of getting their hearts ripped out numerous times finally becomes unbearable.”
      That is an absolute truth. At some time in a man’s life he realises that all he has been taught about women, dating and sex is a crock. More significantly, he becomes aware that those he has entrusted to prepare him for success in life in general (and with women in particular) have misled and outright lied to him. I remember when I had my moment of enlightenment many years ago (way before the red pill became a thing) and fuck was I pissed off. Whilst I may not be Don Juan reincarnated, I have a much better grasp of handling life and women now than I did in my earlier years. Essentially, I only came to this through years of suffering. From that point of view, pain was a good teacher.

  18. Teaching men about Game (or anything) is itself a form of Game — you wouldn’t try to argue or convince a woman to want to fuck you, right? You can only behave in a way that’s attractive to women, and they come to you.
    It’s the same with any form of persuasion. It’s a pulling process, not a pushing process.
    The only way to get a friend to learn Game is to lead by example. When he sees you having it all figured out, he’ll come to you.

    1. Some men are just born losers when it comes to women. Been there/done that. The sad thing is that the guys who need the most help are often times the most resistant to it.

      1. I’ve often wondered about that. The best explanation I can come up with is that guys who have had tears of failure/rejection from women are usually at their lowest ebb. Unfortunately – as I found out – when starting off in game, one has to be prepared for even more rejection and more rejection more often. For a man who is mentally at his lowest point, this is probably going to be a bit much to contemplate. This probably explains why so many guys who might benefit from game give before they even start.
        I think another reality facing men whom have had vast histories of rejections from women is non-existent self esteem. One problem I used to have was despite my assertions that all women were stuck up bitches who only wanted to fuck assholes, I knew deep down inside I was the problem. Getting from that stage where all seemed hopeless to the step of taking a big psychological risk (keeping in mind there are no guarantees in life) to try to improve myself took a monumental effort. Whilst I am glad I did, I can certainly appreciate why a lot of men don’t.

        1. @disqus_QJevC3WS8a:disqus
          I’ve often wondered how The Dunning–Kruger effect plays into the this phenomenon.
          Also, many manginas and white knights—-particularly the big, offish types—-are classified by their female acquaintances as a type of pseudo-gay friend wherein the woman determines the male (not man) to be a clumsy and incompetent suitor who poses no real threat because the male has no working knowledge of social dynamics and has no idea how and when to initiate and/or escalate a relationship.

    1. You have got to be kidding, the article above would have to be the biggest load of horseshit I have read in my entire life.

  19. “I’m-not-looking-to-bang-tons-of-girls-I’m-just-looking-for a-girlfriend”
    Right, so anyone who can’t afford to put the time and effort to go to clubs every night and have ONSes every week is now a pussy? I would love nothing better than to be fucking hot women each day every day. I just don’t have enough time to do it. Serial monogamy (staying with a single girl for 3-6 months at a time, then moving to the next) is far more practical and lets me pursue my other interests in life as well.

    1. That’s not what anyone is saying. “I just want a girlfriend, not to bang a lot of girls” is a common excuse that guys with zero game use to not improve their skills with women. Little do they realize that getting a girlfriend and banging tons of girls use many–if not all–of the same skills.

      1. “Little do they realize that getting a (quality) girlfriend and banging tons of girls use many–if not all–of the same skills.” – Tuthmosis
        Honestly bro this didn’t really click until sometime last week. I was all for finding a decent girl to do random stuff with, but i realized that i was using my logical mind and the world really doesn’t give 2 shits about me or my logic and that 2 girls at work have amazing girl game and i should probably stay away from them.

    2. As though day game, social circle game, and multiple simultaneous LTRs don’t exist …?

  20. Remember that game isn’t just about picking up women, but also used to help you get along better with ALL women, including those you aren’t trying to bang, as well as be a better conversationalist with everyone in general. So, when your friend is unable or unwilling to commit themselves to learning how it works, they may be putting themselves in an inferior social role in relation to you, which will likely result in some resentment and jelousy.

  21. The worst is when you help a friend learn game and he finally fucks a slut…..then marries her. Sad…

  22. Great article. I’ve had this same response to trying to help a “friend” after his divorce with the realities of game.
    However, I relized much earlier on that he didn’t appreciate the advice, didn’t heed the advice, and kept doing his lame-o online dating thing on eHarmony. He’s now well into a dozen “dates” or so where he’s been taken to the cleaners doing the traditional meet girl for drinks, take to dinner, blah blah blah. No bang. Not even 2nd dates.
    I don’t help him anymore. He’s on his own. And unless a fledgling PUA comes with great enthusiasm, eagerness, humility and dedication, I won’t share a crumb from my table. You gotta earn what you eat in this game, and unless a dude is really hungry, he’s going to try to steal the food off your table.

  23. I have never read such absolute drivel and nonsense in all my life. Firstly, can you please clearly define and quantify what “game” actually is?, because you PUA fanboys all seem to have different definitions as to what having game is all about.
    Let me explain why the above article is so ridiculous, and highly offensive to ugly looking guys like who have no luck with women through no fault of their own. Picking up women is not a skill, you either have the good looks/genes and or money to attract women or you don’t. A true skill eg. Learning how to play a musical instrument is something that can be replicated time and time again because the musical instrument (unlike a woman), is a neutral object, that’s not going to reject you/or flake on you.
    My point is simply this, a good looking man who is a natural with women (only because of his looks), not because of any silly “game”, cannot teach an ugly looking man how to be good with women. It’s analagous to a 7ft tall guard in the NBA trying to teach a 3ft midget how to slam dunk a 10ft high basketball hoop.

    1. Imagine someone asking you to clearly define red pill. Game is a mindset. By MRA definition game is application of behavioral psychology to the field of dating. It is slightly more than giving women what they want. It is realization of your full potential and not allowing any obstacles to stop you. Behaviour is a skill and it’s called a game because you learn that skill to emulate behaviour women are attracted to. Looks are a part of it but your behaviour matters more. Looks or money alone will not get you far. There are many fat, bold fucks with no money surrounded by hot women. Just like men, women are looking for full package, taste vary and not all are superficial. Productive part of the game is maximizing your positive attributes and minimising the bad. Unproductive is pretentious shaming and boasting with “I’m Alpha brah” crap. Further more (and it’s the pinnacle of my thoughts on game) despite the critics, as an MRA I think game is a part of healthy masculinity or at least an introduction to a healthy masculine mindset. Something young men desperately need.

  24. Further to my earlier comment, another reason I find the above article ridiculous and offensive is that it unfairly puts down men who are simply just shit of out of luck when it comes to women. Take me for example, I am 44 years old and I have never had a girlfriend, and never married, and if it wasn’t for hookers I’d still be a virgin, however as I from Australia prostitution is legal so I am lucky in that regard.
    In my teenage years, and throughout my 20s and 30s,I tried very hard to meet women, only to be shot down in a hail of instant rejections and friendzoning.
    My cursed luck with women, and no I don’t chase after hot looking women, never have (they are out of my league and I am too ugly anyway), comes down to my ugly looks. So how am I at fault, with being born with genes that women don ‘t want? However I am in good shape (healthy diet and the gym), but attraction is mainly from the neck up.
    If you have the good looks to attract women successfully, then more power to you, but don’t put down and degrade men who through no fault of their own have no luck with women. Men often become depressed and in some cases commit suicide because they are lonely and can’t attract a woman, so the last thing they need is another kick in the head.
    And before I get attacked and insulted, I am no troll, and feel free to message me if you want proof that I am for real.
    Seb (shit out of luck when it comes to women)

    1. Since you’re Australian, I’ll forgive your total ignorance of who Henry Kissinger is.

    2. Dude it all starts with attitude, judging by what you just said you have clearly no confidence in yourself at all. Girls are like sharks they can smell that miles away, even from approach. The key here is to grab your balls (literally) and just approach them confidently, if you have already been rejected a million times then you are probably used to it, and besides you have nothing to loose. stop being so negative on yourself key here is to think yourself superior, approach as if the girl were a number 4 or lower. Trust me i know clear cases of guys that are ugly as fuck and still score much more than pretty looking guys. Im talking about mexican type people (no offense to anyone) literraly, skinny dudes, fugly face, short and horrible hair. I have close friends like these and whenever we go to playa del carmen or cabo they get tons of girls, why?! cuz they dont give a fuck. Obviously not on the first try but by the 3rd or 4th, they get it off with some girl. Stop being such a pussy man. In my experience i’ve learned there is no such thing as bad luck! BAD LUCK is an excuse for people who can’t man up. Just look at soccer teams why do you think South American teams are good and get to beat european teams?! Cuz when they play they go in confidently and man up, they dont go: “Omg they’re europeans, they’re taller, they’re faster, they’re bigger”. You can see how they beat soccer powerhouses and how they play, cuz the players mentalize themselves, that they are all men and that they can too win. So My advice is get out there, stop making excuses and MAN UP. Everyone has had shit, i’ve had long sexless streaks for up to 6 months and gotten with fugly girls. But who cares the thing is how far can you bounce when you hit bottom. Life is about attitude, that separates leaders from followers.

  25. It seems like Seb might be suffering from MicroPenis, you might as well just turn gay.

    1. No I won’t be turning gay, i like women too much, plus hookers are legal where I am
      from, so I have a supply of relatively cheap, easy sex. In fact if you look at game on a cost to benefit basis, hookers are actually cheaper than wasting your time trying to pick up bar sluts.

      1. Hookers over regular women, what a sad view to have. Keep going bro, whatever makes you happy.

    2. No I won’t be turning gay, i like women too much, plus hookers are legal where I am
      from, so I have a supply of relatively cheap, easy sex. In fact if you look at game on a cost to benefit basis, hookers are actually cheaper than wasting your time trying to pick up bar sluts.

  26. You just hit the nail. Last night I was stuck in a convo with my best friend’s (a natural alpha and the one who kind of introduced me to game) sister and one of our close friends from the last few years. Guy’s a total bluepill. My friend’s sister started asking me for advice about this guy she likes. I start telling her some red-pill truths, about getting in shape and her appearance (she’s not fat, but could tighten up and has some grooming issues that put me completely off), being sweet, (what some people would call girl game). My other friend immediately starts calling me a “macho” and trying to get on the good side of the girl by telling her that appearances are not important, that career and intelligence matter more than sweetness, the whole feminist script. I got quite frustrated because I was honestly trying to help the girl, but in his effort to win two seconds of feminine approval he was just misleading my friend’s sister. The girl eventually told him something on the lines of “Ohh, you have to understand, he (me) is not an enlightened man as you are.” Smiled as a little kid when answering a good question at school and continued sipping on his straw (I know…). Later on the girl confessed to me “I know he was just trying to get on my good side, I’m not stupid.” It’s not the first time I’ve tried to feed him some red-pill bits (this time was mainly indirectly) but after yesterday I seriously started thinking it’s a waste of time.

  27. I guess for guys who believed in Marks extremist rantings as Truth, his
    hypocrisy is a weakness and he is betraying core good principles.
    But his rantings were never truth. He is now, as before, trying to
    maximize his happiness. Only he’s taking a different strategy.
    Sounds to me like it might be a fine strategy. Kate might actually
    improve his financial situation. He’ll get laid. There will be ups and
    downs, but chances are for a few years at least he’ll be better off,
    and it doesn’t seem possible he can be financially harmed.
    So it’s actually probably a good choice for him.
    The only guys dissapointed in his choices will be those who bought into
    his bullshit extremist immature one sided failure based views.
    You really think he’ll do better on the dating market? And for how
    long? I mean will HE do better. Not some mythological man. Him. Mark
    Minter. Mark Minter is probably getting about as good as HE can get.
    At least he’s finally owning that part of himself that seeks intimacy.
    He came across as a zealot at odds with his own hidden desires in his
    anti-intimacy fuck-women rants. Of COURSE he was lonely. Duh!
    Honestly, I still have a hard time understanding this anti-intimacy cult
    that has gripped huge swaths of the manosphere. It’s like guys are
    saying that you can learn to be higher value than the woman you date,
    can learn to push her buttons, can even learn to be great in bed and
    great with women, but you can never learn how to have successful
    fulfilling relationships with them. Pump and dump the bitches!
    Especially Western Lizards!
    No confidence in the ability to train your pimp hand to train up a woman to be useful in the long term.
    It’s a one sided attitude that denies huge parts of your humanity. As
    Mark has proven, you can’t do that for long. Something will have to

  28. Look at any kung fu movie the potential student must always prove his desire to learn to the master first. Unless they are willing to do this then yes what you say will be true.

  29. You can avoid “friends with no game” by avoiding them altogether in the first place.
    its pretty easy to tell if a man “gets it” or not, even if he’s on a cold streak. All of the above examples looks like “friendships” that shouldn’t have been that way in the first place, I can’t picture a reality where ‘friends’ actually behave this way to other ‘friends’ – although this may have been because I’ve dropped gameless gamma males from my life a long time ago.

  30. Once you reach a certain level you can’t share your secrets with the rest of the world until they catch up. Or there will be hell to pay

  31. This is so very true. I took the red pill a few months ago, have gotten decent with women and I’m experiencing this. I try to help out friends with their game, but they furiously rationalize not approaching or even trying with women. I tried it on a feminist friend group last week (BIG MISTAKE), and they have become haters. I tried it on a blue-pill friend at his response was ‘you’re totally unfit to give advice on this sort of thing’. Yes bro, even though I’m getting laid with hotties and you have had sex once in your life and that was four years ago.
    “If you’re like me, you actually don’t outright befriend guys who don’t display some degree of game already”
    I’m seeing that this is the way to go. Besides, whether a dude gets laid or not is directly proportional to how cool he is. Once you’ve studied game you can tell within a minute of meeting a man whether he is alpha or beta. You just know.

  32. This is a list of excuses why you can’t accomplish something difficult which you otherwise wouldn’t hesitate to take on as a challenge. Every item on the list is a fear or rationalization of what could happen. What if you helped a brother out and he repaid you ten fold in the coming years for what you did? That is all the motivation I need. Of course, if you get a cancerous chode who brings you down, you have to excise it, and yes, you are the average of the 5 people you are closest to, but this is a fearful list of excuses not to help someone who could really use a bit of advice and coaching.

  33. I’ve even experienced my own Brother doing the cockblock thing in the past, using me as an opener and crowbarring the thing ajar, making me look like a clown in the process. Because he’s been friendzoned constantly and developed a mental problem due to massive cognitive dissonance issues, he’s now stuck with an alcoholic trainwreck with 4 kids by different Fathers, none of which are his, and lives from paycheck to paycheck even though they ought to have an abundance of wealth.
    He is RULED by insecurity and low self esteem: “I’m bald and fat, who’s going to want me?” and another classic “I just want to be loved”. He’s asked me “Why is life so expensive?” and all the rest of the self-evident crap that we can identify so far in advance, we wouldn’t entertain an excuse of a woman such as that to begin with. I cannot express you you my shame and pity for this total omega-come-beta nightmare, with his occasionally frightening alpha rising streak. It’s one of the most embarrassingly weak manosphere situations one could encounter.
    He’s got musical talent, can hold a conversation down, is a reasonably good worker, but just doesn’t get it. I’ve tried to explain it’s nothing much to do with being bald and fat, it’s more the clingy, needy, desperate attitude which manifests itself in creepiness which women dislike.
    I’ve tried explaining the situation and received total denial and rejection of reality.

  34. This is actually a good article. Yes, unless your sexless friend is a young kid who is new to the dating scene, he has probably had enough female encounters in his life. And the fact that he is sexless means something.
    Excuses that they make have one common theme, namely, that it is somehow that their fault or lack of effort on their part that they are sexless. “I have high standards. I am looking to date models and I won’t settle for anything below an 8 out of 10. That is why I am sexless and not because I can’t have sex with anyone.” Surely, the dude can pick up a nasty, fat hippo and lose his virginity to her. But I am sure the dude doesn’t understand that (a) it takes some luck for most guys to run into single girls that are 7 and above and (b) it is by no means easy (in fact difficult) to seal the deal with a single girl that is 7 or above even after meeting her. My recommendation would be for the sexless friend to start with 2 or 3 and work his way up to 6 or 7. Anything above that may or may not be in his league, although I am not going to tell him what he is or is not capable of accomplishing. Seriously, there is an element of trial and error in the dating game and you have to meet a lot of people and pick things up along the way even if you have to start at 2 or 3.
    I have a feeling that sexless dudes fall in either one of the two categories: they either (i) simply don’t get it and as such won’t heed your advice or (ii) think that they have game (more game than the sexhaver friend) and as such do not need your advice.
    Sometimes the sexless friend will get drunk and do something weird (but not offensive) and you could work your game to ease the situation. In fact, a student of the game should be able to handle something like this without embarrassing the friend in front of the girls. But there comes a time when the sexless friend goes beyond being a weirdo. For example, he could start attacking you in the middle of the game. Yes, attacking a teammate in the middle of the game because (i) the sexless friend wants to butt in, (ii) he wants to show the girl that he is an alpha bro, or (iii) he is just awkward and to ease the awkwardness decided to say something (anything) that to him appears appropriate to the situation.
    This depends on your value system. If your life evolves purely around getting laid, then I guess I see no reason why you should keep your sexless friend around. But if you value friendships above getting laid, then I would recommend that you either give him the first chance to hit on the girl (be the bigger man), which may result in the girl shunning both of you, or simply work solo or without him. When the party is over, the girls will not be there for you. But your sexless friend (because he has nothing better to do and no where else to go) will stand by your side. 🙂

  35. “I once introduced another game-less friend to two Eastern European girls I was working at a club. In the clumsiest and most obvious way, he kept climbing over me to talk to the girl I’d clearly selected (the cuter and slightly thinner of the two), repeatedly interrupting me and ignoring the other girl. When he finally managed to scare them both off, I pulled him aside…”
    I don’t get it… why would someone be so ingrateful as to turn down.. if I know Tuthmosis, he doesn’t really game anything below an 8.5… To turn down what is essentially a free shot at a girl who is at least a 7. A 7 isn’t a bad catch, especially for a newbie.
    Sounds to me like you just had a really shitty friend.

  36. I’m an engineer….worst decision
    a white heterosexual well dressed well spoken man can make other than maybe
    cutting off his own nut sack with a rusty knife. Of my “engineering
    friends” i would say 1 has game. The others are at a level that is
    slightly higher than human excrement!
    I have engineers who get called
    fag by women in a bar for going out and being well dressed and what do they do…they
    apologize to the girl.
    Other things these “subhumans” do
    if and when they go out is hit on one girl…girl shoots them down and then they
    go on a bender at 9pm.
    And sadly I being the better man
    have tried to help them, sadly I have broken the ice and introduced them to
    solid 7’s and a few 8’s……they failed. Then I thought ok they like fatties…so I introduced
    them to fatties…..solid robust well built chunky 4’s…..and they still fucked
    that up!
    Whatever you do for the love of
    god don’t be like me. Understand that your average engineer is a gutless
    spineless good for nothing piece of human garbage that just loves having hit
    nutsack kicked by women who look like dehydrated frogs.

  37. To be honest I’ve been friends with a lot of PUA’s the most recent dude was at my job, being a MGTOW, I really didn’t give a flying fuck if he was banging this chick or that chick, because in the end, they would be fucking him as hard as he fucked them, whither with child support payments, or false rape accusations. I did make me laugh, also we talked a lot about comics and such. My advise to men with no game or think game is voodoo penis magic, fuck a whore, you’ll feel better, be a monger, you’ll feel twice as better.

  38. In my case, I have a friend who didn’t have any hobbies period. All he wanted was to spend his spare time “hanging out with friends.” Now what in the world can you offer to others & especially the opposite sex if you can’t even amuse yourself?
    I would say ignore certain friends that cannot develop game or a good relationship with themselves as years pass. If you don’t help them with their game, you’re a bad guy who is the recipient of their passive aggression. If you do help them with their game, you’re a bad guy who is making them step out of their comfort zone. You can’t want something for others as a friend once said…though it is good to call somebody out once. Sometimes, getting called out has been a great message to me as it maybe took a year or two to finally grasp what others tried conveying.
    If they don’t get the message after a couple years, eff it. Move on.

  39. A little assistance doesn’t hurt (I bought Roosh’s first book for a friend and it helped him) but not at the expense of your own game. If helping your friend means you getting cockblocked, time to reevaluate.

  40. Once a man hits 30 he’s pretty much set in his ways and—-barring a freaking miracle—-is just not gonna change.
    Your 32 year-old clueless-dater friend and your 35 year-old deadbeat buddy will resist your advice on either subject with the same intensity.

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